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Electrical Gremlins


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So I get in my Mustang this AM early to go get a front end alignment. Car spent it's first night outside under a cover in 31 degree weather ... it is usually in a garage. At any rate I open the car get in the drivers seat and immediately notice that a motor is running in the back seat area, could only be the convertible top pump. It stops after 5 - 10 seconds. I put the key in the ignition and turn it to start, absolutely nothing, no clicking of any kind, nothing. Just the idot lights come on. I do this several times without success. Pop the hood check the terminals which are tight, knock on the ignition relay(?) I think, round black plastic switch next to the voltage regulator. Get back in the car still nothing, try half dozen times. I then gently push the gear shift lever(auto on floor) forward just in case. It moves maybe an 1/8th an inch. Not enough in my mind to be a problem. The car starts fine on the next try.

 

I should mention that about 2 weeks ago I noticed some issues that I believe are related to the voltage regulator, but have not sorted them out. Basically, fuel gauge started to drop and then heard a click and the alternator idiot light flashed once and then gauge climbed back to appropriate position. Was told this is probably regulator. Also, occasionaly get a rapid clicking from the seat belt sensor switch under the driver's seat.

 

Would appreciate any suggestions on these issues ..... thanks in advance !

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The motor sound may have been the seat back solenoid.

The difficulty starting may be an adjustment to the safety switch (or you just need to make sure it is all the way forward)

'Mike'

73 Convertible - 351C/4V CC heads/4bolt/forged flat tops/comp 270/rhodes/mallory unilite/tri-power/hookers/glasspacks/c6/3.50 limited slip/Gear Vendors/Global West sub frames, strut rods and shelby style traction bars/ Rear sway bar/tilt steering (not original)

 

Pics of modifications included in: [button=http://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-1973-convertible--3335]My Garage[/button]

 

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The motor sound may have been the seat back solenoid.

The difficulty starting may be an adjustment to the safety switch (or you just need to make sure it is all the way forward)

 

HI,

 

Know it is difficult to diagnose on this site. I was not aware that there is a sea back solenoid. What does that do ? The noise I heard this AM is definitely different than the drivers' seat bottom switch that I have heard before. That noise is a rapid clicking like a solenoid opening and closing. Thanks

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Ya, some mustangs have a seat release solenoid built into the rear of front seats..Mine never had them, but alot did, They let the seats unlock and lock with out having to pull a lever..So when you stop the car and turn off the power the seats should unlock so anyone in the back seat could get out with out hunting for the release, " if i'm correct"

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Ya, some mustangs have a seat release solenoid built into the rear of front seats..Mine never had them, but alot did, They let the seats unlock and lock with out having to pull a lever..So when you stop the car and turn off the power the seats should unlock so anyone in the back seat could get out with out hunting for the release, " if i'm correct"

 

Got it ... thanks. I don't think mine has them as my seats have the latch at the bottom that you lift to push the seat back forward.

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So I get in my Mustang this AM early to go get a front end alignment. Car spent it's first night outside under a cover in 31 degree weather ... it is usually in a garage. At any rate I open the car get in the drivers seat and immediately notice that a motor is running in the back seat area, could only be the convertible top pump. It stops after 5 - 10 seconds. I put the key in the ignition and turn it to start, absolutely nothing, no clicking of any kind, nothing. Just the idot lights come on. I do this several times without success. Pop the hood check the terminals which are tight, knock on the ignition relay(?) I think, round black plastic switch next to the voltage regulator. Get back in the car still nothing, try half dozen times. I then gently push the gear shift lever(auto on floor) forward just in case. It moves maybe an 1/8th an inch. Not enough in my mind to be a problem. The car starts fine on the next try.

 

I should mention that about 2 weeks ago I noticed some issues that I believe are related to the voltage regulator, but have not sorted them out. Basically, fuel gauge started to drop and then heard a click and the alternator idiot light flashed once and then gauge climbed back to appropriate position. Was told this is probably regulator. Also, occasionaly get a rapid clicking from the seat belt sensor switch under the driver's seat.

 

Would appreciate any suggestions on these issues ..... thanks in advance !

 

MORE INFO: Stopped by an auto parts store today and had them check the charging system. First test with the car off indicated a bad battery at 12.9 volts. Next test engine running indicated bad Regulator, but good alternator and stator, I believe it was in the low 14 volt range. Any thoughts ?

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Ya, some mustangs have a seat release solenoid built into the rear of front seats..Mine never had them, but alot did, They let the seats unlock and lock with out having to pull a lever..So when you stop the car and turn off the power the seats should unlock so anyone in the back seat could get out with out hunting for the release, " if i'm correct"

 

Got it ... thanks. I don't think mine has them as my seats have the latch at the bottom that you lift to push the seat back forward.

 

Still could have the solenoid. Latch is there in case the solenoid breaks. Only when one of the doors are open should the solenoids engage.

-john

(jbojo)

351C 4V cc heads, 10.5 : 1 CR, 290 Herbert cam, Flat top forged pistons, forged connecting rods, Atomic efi,

C6 with Gear Vendor overdrive, 3.89 Tru Trac, Hooker Super Comp with 2 1/2" Pypes Exhaust.        

 

Some Mod pictures can be seen at: [button=http://www.7173mustangs.com/forum-garage?filterxt_uid=2026]Bojo's Garage[/button]

 

 

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yep you got em.

gremlins_poster_zps0154108e.jpg.087f182225f6b01e5ac5240cbff4fb79.jpg

If you don't have time to do it right the first time, you sure as Hell don't have time to do it right the second time.

 

Dutch uncle

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So I get in my Mustang this AM early to go get a front end alignment. Car spent it's first night outside under a cover in 31 degree weather ... it is usually in a garage. At any rate I open the car get in the drivers seat and immediately notice that a motor is running in the back seat area, could only be the convertible top pump. It stops after 5 - 10 seconds. I put the key in the ignition and turn it to start, absolutely nothing, no clicking of any kind, nothing. Just the idot lights come on. I do this several times without success. Pop the hood check the terminals which are tight, knock on the ignition relay(?) I think, round black plastic switch next to the voltage regulator. Get back in the car still nothing, try half dozen times. I then gently push the gear shift lever(auto on floor) forward just in case. It moves maybe an 1/8th an inch. Not enough in my mind to be a problem. The car starts fine on the next try.

 

I should mention that about 2 weeks ago I noticed some issues that I believe are related to the voltage regulator, but have not sorted them out. Basically, fuel gauge started to drop and then heard a click and the alternator idiot light flashed once and then gauge climbed back to appropriate position. Was told this is probably regulator. Also, occasionaly get a rapid clicking from the seat belt sensor switch under the driver's seat.

 

Would appreciate any suggestions on these issues ..... thanks in advance !

 

MORE INFO: Stopped by an auto parts store today and had them check the charging system. First test with the car off indicated a bad battery at 12.9 volts. Next test engine running indicated bad Regulator, but good alternator and stator, I believe it was in the low 14 volt range. Any thoughts ?

 

An alternator should put out between 13.5 and 15 volts of power. The alternator should be tested with the engine idling and electrical accessories, such as the radio and headlights, turned off. A reduced output may be a sign that the alternator is failing.

 

Automotive SLI batteries are usually lead-acid type, and are made of six galvanic cells in series. Each cell should produce 2.1 volts so a fully charged battery should output at least 12.6 volts.

 

Based on your last response the alt and battery looks to be ok. With the motor running check the voltage at the + terminal of the battery. if its above 12.6 volts it will be charging the battery. I believe that I see about 13.5 volts when charging and slowly drops as the battery charges up.

 

The first issue appears that the neutral safety switch needs adjusting. If it happens again try staring it in neutral and it will probably confirm this.

 

The clicking under the seat is probably from the seat back release solenoid. The question that I would have here is, were the doors all shut tightly? If not the light switch on the door jam could have been opening and closing due to motor vibration if it were running or some similar reason. Just make sure that all the doors are shut and see if it happens again.

-john

(jbojo)

351C 4V cc heads, 10.5 : 1 CR, 290 Herbert cam, Flat top forged pistons, forged connecting rods, Atomic efi,

C6 with Gear Vendor overdrive, 3.89 Tru Trac, Hooker Super Comp with 2 1/2" Pypes Exhaust.        

 

Some Mod pictures can be seen at: [button=http://www.7173mustangs.com/forum-garage?filterxt_uid=2026]Bojo's Garage[/button]

 

 

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So I get in my Mustang this AM early to go get a front end alignment. Car spent it's first night outside under a cover in 31 degree weather ... it is usually in a garage. At any rate I open the car get in the drivers seat and immediately notice that a motor is running in the back seat area, could only be the convertible top pump. It stops after 5 - 10 seconds. I put the key in the ignition and turn it to start, absolutely nothing, no clicking of any kind, nothing. Just the idot lights come on. I do this several times without success. Pop the hood check the terminals which are tight, knock on the ignition relay(?) I think, round black plastic switch next to the voltage regulator. Get back in the car still nothing, try half dozen times. I then gently push the gear shift lever(auto on floor) forward just in case. It moves maybe an 1/8th an inch. Not enough in my mind to be a problem. The car starts fine on the next try.

 

I should mention that about 2 weeks ago I noticed some issues that I believe are related to the voltage regulator, but have not sorted them out. Basically, fuel gauge started to drop and then heard a click and the alternator idiot light flashed once and then gauge climbed back to appropriate position. Was told this is probably regulator. Also, occasionaly get a rapid clicking from the seat belt sensor switch under the driver's seat.

 

Would appreciate any suggestions on these issues ..... thanks in advance !

 

MORE INFO: Stopped by an auto parts store today and had them check the charging system. First test with the car off indicated a bad battery at 12.9 volts. Next test engine running indicated bad Regulator, but good alternator and stator, I believe it was in the low 14 volt range. Any thoughts ?

 

An alternator should put out between 13.5 and 15 volts of power. The alternator should be tested with the engine idling and electrical accessories, such as the radio and headlights, turned off. A reduced output may be a sign that the alternator is failing.

 

Automotive SLI batteries are usually lead-acid type, and are made of six galvanic cells in series. Each cell should produce 2.1 volts so a fully charged battery should output at least 12.6 volts.

 

Based on your last response the alt and battery looks to be ok. With the motor running check the voltage at the + terminal of the battery. if its above 12.6 volts it will be charging the battery. I believe that I see about 13.5 volts when charging and slowly drops as the battery charges up.

 

The first issue appears that the neutral safety switch needs adjusting. If it happens again try staring it in neutral and it will probably confirm this.

 

The clicking under the seat is probably from the seat back release solenoid. The question that I would have here is, were the doors all shut tightly? If not the light switch on the door jam could have been opening and closing due to motor vibration if it were running or some similar reason. Just make sure that all the doors are shut and see if it happens again.

 

Great information .... appreciate it. Just had shoulder surgery so it will be awhile before I am wrenching again. THanks

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So I get in my Mustang this AM early to go get a front end alignment. Car spent it's first night outside under a cover in 31 degree weather ... it is usually in a garage. At any rate I open the car get in the drivers seat and immediately notice that a motor is running in the back seat area, could only be the convertible top pump. It stops after 5 - 10 seconds. I put the key in the ignition and turn it to start, absolutely nothing, no clicking of any kind, nothing. Just the idot lights come on. I do this several times without success. Pop the hood check the terminals which are tight, knock on the ignition relay(?) I think, round black plastic switch next to the voltage regulator. Get back in the car still nothing, try half dozen times. I then gently push the gear shift lever(auto on floor) forward just in case. It moves maybe an 1/8th an inch. Not enough in my mind to be a problem. The car starts fine on the next try.

 

I should mention that about 2 weeks ago I noticed some issues that I believe are related to the voltage regulator, but have not sorted them out. Basically, fuel gauge started to drop and then heard a click and the alternator idiot light flashed once and then gauge climbed back to appropriate position. Was told this is probably regulator. Also, occasionaly get a rapid clicking from the seat belt sensor switch under the driver's seat.

 

Would appreciate any suggestions on these issues ..... thanks in advance !

 

MORE INFO: Stopped by an auto parts store today and had them check the charging system. First test with the car off indicated a bad battery at 12.9 volts. Next test engine running indicated bad Regulator, but good alternator and stator, I believe it was in the low 14 volt range. Any thoughts ?

 

An alternator should put out between 13.5 and 15 volts of power. The alternator should be tested with the engine idling and electrical accessories, such as the radio and headlights, turned off. A reduced output may be a sign that the alternator is failing.

 

Automotive SLI batteries are usually lead-acid type, and are made of six galvanic cells in series. Each cell should produce 2.1 volts so a fully charged battery should output at least 12.6 volts.

 

Based on your last response the alt and battery looks to be ok. With the motor running check the voltage at the + terminal of the battery. if its above 12.6 volts it will be charging the battery. I believe that I see about 13.5 volts when charging and slowly drops as the battery charges up.

 

The first issue appears that the neutral safety switch needs adjusting. If it happens again try staring it in neutral and it will probably confirm this.

 

The clicking under the seat is probably from the seat back release solenoid. The question that I would have here is, were the doors all shut tightly? If not the light switch on the door jam could have been opening and closing due to motor vibration if it were running or some similar reason. Just make sure that all the doors are shut and see if it happens again.

 

Jbojo,

 

Little more information on my electrical issues. Went to my car today which had been in the garage for 9 days without running. Checked the battery with a volt meter, it read 12.6 volts. Car started right away, checked again at idle and read 16.4 volts. Drove app. 45 minutes with one shutdown for gas. Upon return checked volts at idle, 15.4. What do you think of these readings.

 

Also, had starting issue again and moved shifter to neutral started right up. Have to check/adjust the switch.

 

Also, this AM as soon as i turned the key on I heard that buzzing/motor running noise again from the passenger seat/rear of the car area. Might ahve been coming from the passenger seat. Guess it could be the seat back lock switch, was not a rapid clicking but more of a humming/motor noise.

 

Purchased a new one wire alternator that I will put in soon. Thanks again for your advice.

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MORE INFO: Stopped by an auto parts store today and had them check the charging system. First test with the car off indicated a bad battery at 12.9 volts. Next test engine running indicated bad Regulator, but good alternator and stator, I believe it was in the low 14 volt range. Any thoughts ?

 

An alternator should put out between 13.5 and 15 volts of power. The alternator should be tested with the engine idling and electrical accessories, such as the radio and headlights, turned off. A reduced output may be a sign that the alternator is failing.

 

Automotive SLI batteries are usually lead-acid type, and are made of six galvanic cells in series. Each cell should produce 2.1 volts so a fully charged battery should output at least 12.6 volts.

 

Based on your last response the alt and battery looks to be ok. With the motor running check the voltage at the + terminal of the battery. if its above 12.6 volts it will be charging the battery. I believe that I see about 13.5 volts when charging and slowly drops as the battery charges up.

 

The first issue appears that the neutral safety switch needs adjusting. If it happens again try staring it in neutral and it will probably confirm this.

 

The clicking under the seat is probably from the seat back release solenoid. The question that I would have here is, were the doors all shut tightly? If not the light switch on the door jam could have been opening and closing due to motor vibration if it were running or some similar reason. Just make sure that all the doors are shut and see if it happens again.

 

Jbojo,

 

Little more information on my electrical issues. Went to my car today which had been in the garage for 9 days without running. Checked the battery with a volt meter, it read 12.6 volts. Car started right away, checked again at idle and read 16.4 volts. Drove app. 45 minutes with one shutdown for gas. Upon return checked volts at idle, 15.4. What do you think of these readings.

 

Also, had starting issue again and moved shifter to neutral started right up. Have to check/adjust the switch.

 

Also, this AM as soon as i turned the key on I heard that buzzing/motor running noise again from the passenger seat/rear of the car area. Might ahve been coming from the passenger seat. Guess it could be the seat back lock switch, was not a rapid clicking but more of a humming/motor noise.

 

Purchased a new one wire alternator that I will put in soon. Thanks again for your advice.

 

A fully charged battery will read 12.6 volts with the engine not running. It will read 12.4 at 75% charge, 12.2 at 50% charge, and 12 volts at 25% charge. With the engine running at idle you should read 13.5 to 15.5 volts. Any lower or higher and the alternator or regulator may be defective. The one wire alt will fix that.

 

When you hear the humming noise again disconnect the wires the are under the seat and see if the noise goes away. Could be a solenoid that is going bad or the switch on the passenger side door jam is bad.

 

If you need the instructions to adjust the NSS switch let me know.

-john

(jbojo)

351C 4V cc heads, 10.5 : 1 CR, 290 Herbert cam, Flat top forged pistons, forged connecting rods, Atomic efi,

C6 with Gear Vendor overdrive, 3.89 Tru Trac, Hooker Super Comp with 2 1/2" Pypes Exhaust.        

 

Some Mod pictures can be seen at: [button=http://www.7173mustangs.com/forum-garage?filterxt_uid=2026]Bojo's Garage[/button]

 

 

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An alternator should put out between 13.5 and 15 volts of power. The alternator should be tested with the engine idling and electrical accessories, such as the radio and headlights, turned off. A reduced output may be a sign that the alternator is failing.

 

Automotive SLI batteries are usually lead-acid type, and are made of six galvanic cells in series. Each cell should produce 2.1 volts so a fully charged battery should output at least 12.6 volts.

 

Based on your last response the alt and battery looks to be ok. With the motor running check the voltage at the + terminal of the battery. if its above 12.6 volts it will be charging the battery. I believe that I see about 13.5 volts when charging and slowly drops as the battery charges up.

 

The first issue appears that the neutral safety switch needs adjusting. If it happens again try staring it in neutral and it will probably confirm this.

 

The clicking under the seat is probably from the seat back release solenoid. The question that I would have here is, were the doors all shut tightly? If not the light switch on the door jam could have been opening and closing due to motor vibration if it were running or some similar reason. Just make sure that all the doors are shut and see if it happens again.

 

Jbojo,

 

Little more information on my electrical issues. Went to my car today which had been in the garage for 9 days without running. Checked the battery with a volt meter, it read 12.6 volts. Car started right away, checked again at idle and read 16.4 volts. Drove app. 45 minutes with one shutdown for gas. Upon return checked volts at idle, 15.4. What do you think of these readings.

 

Also, had starting issue again and moved shifter to neutral started right up. Have to check/adjust the switch.

 

Also, this AM as soon as i turned the key on I heard that buzzing/motor running noise again from the passenger seat/rear of the car area. Might ahve been coming from the passenger seat. Guess it could be the seat back lock switch, was not a rapid clicking but more of a humming/motor noise.

 

Purchased a new one wire alternator that I will put in soon. Thanks again for your advice.

 

A fully charged battery will read 12.6 volts with the engine not running. It will read 12.4 at 75% charge, 12.2 at 50% charge, and 12 volts at 25% charge. With the engine running at idle you should read 13.5 to 15.5 volts. Any lower or higher and the alternator or regulator may be defective. The one wire alt will fix that.

 

When you hear the humming noise again disconnect the wires the are under the seat and see if the noise goes away. Could be a solenoid that is going bad or the switch on the passenger side door jam is bad.

 

If you need the instructions to adjust the NSS switch let me know.

Thanks very much for the info.

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