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Helicopter

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 26, 2017
Messages
97
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1
Location
USA
My Car
1973 Mustang, 351 Cleveland 2bbl. vinyl roof.
Hi All

Long ago, the fan shroud was removed because the fan scraped the lower part of the shroud.

With the restoration, I have new engine mounts, radiator, shroud clips,  thinking that would solve the problem----NO !!!!

I "adjusted" the engine mounts to highest position and it still scraped the lower fan shroud.

Any ideas what I am doing wrong?

TNX

Roy

 
Hi All

Long ago, the fan shroud was removed because the fan scraped the lower part of the shroud.

With the restoration, I have new engine mounts, radiator, shroud clips,  thinking that would solve the problem----NO !!!!

I "adjusted" the engine mounts to highest position and it still scraped the lower fan shroud.

Any ideas what I am doing wrong?

TNX

Roy
Roy,

what model year and what year mounts and perches ?

Some say that engine will sit 1'' lower if 1973 motor mounts and perches are used.

that could also mean that there could be a difference in shrouds between model years.

Just thinking out loud.

Boilermaster

 
Hi All

Long ago, the fan shroud was removed because the fan scraped the lower part of the shroud.

With the restoration, I have new engine mounts, radiator, shroud clips,  thinking that would solve the problem----NO !!!!

I "adjusted" the engine mounts to highest position and it still scraped the lower fan shroud.

Any ideas what I am doing wrong?

TNX

Roy
Assuming you have the correct engine frame mounts for your engine mounts. ie the lower 73 frame mounts paired with the taller 73 engine mounts or 71-72 frame mounts with the same 71-72 engine mounts. 73 mouth are not reproduced. If you use repro 71-72 engine mount on 73 car you need to replace the 73 frame mounts with 71-72 year frame mounts.

with that said, alao check your transmission mount position. The position of the trans up or down can tilt the front of the engine down or up. Sounds like your trans could be sitting g higher up in the tunnel tilting the engine down in front.

 
Hi All

Long ago, the fan shroud was removed because the fan scraped the lower part of the shroud.

With the restoration, I have new engine mounts, radiator, shroud clips,  thinking that would solve the problem----NO !!!!

I "adjusted" the engine mounts to highest position and it still scraped the lower fan shroud.

Any ideas what I am doing wrong?

TNX

Roy
Roy, 

what model year and what year mounts and perches ?

Some say that engine will sit 1'' lower if 1973 motor mounts and perches are used.

that could also mean that there could be a difference in shrouds between model years.

Just thinking out loud.

Boilermaster
I ordered 73 mounts. It very well could be the problem.

 
Hi All

Long ago, the fan shroud was removed because the fan scraped the lower part of the shroud.

With the restoration, I have new engine mounts, radiator, shroud clips,  thinking that would solve the problem----NO !!!!

I "adjusted" the engine mounts to highest position and it still scraped the lower fan shroud.

Any ideas what I am doing wrong?

TNX

Roy
Assuming you have the correct engine frame mounts for your engine mounts. ie the lower 73 frame mounts paired with the taller 73 engine mounts or 71-72 frame mounts with the same 71-72 engine mounts. 73 mouth are not reproduced. If you use repro 71-72 engine mount on 73 car you need to replace the 73 frame mounts with 71-72 year frame mounts.

with that said, alao check your transmission mount position. The position of the trans up or down can tilt the front of the engine down or up. Sounds like your trans could be sitting g higher up in the tunnel tilting the engine down in front.
Good Idea.  I got a transmission mount piece with the engine mount set but did not install it (I didn't think it would be necessary).  Maybe I should take a look .

Thank you

 
Hi All

Long ago, the fan shroud was removed because the fan scraped the lower part of the shroud.

With the restoration, I have new engine mounts, radiator, shroud clips,  thinking that would solve the problem----NO !!!!

I "adjusted" the engine mounts to highest position and it still scraped the lower fan shroud.

Any ideas what I am doing wrong?

TNX

Roy
Roy, 

what model year and what year mounts and perches ?

Some say that engine will sit 1'' lower if 1973 motor mounts and perches are used.

that could also mean that there could be a difference in shrouds between model years.

Just thinking out loud.

Boilermaster
I ordered 73 mounts. It very well could be the problem.
The 73 motor mounts are called captive mounts and were designed to meet new federal regulation that year. They are taller. Too compensate for the taller mount Ford lowered the frame mount/perch. See the two versions of the perches in the pic below. There was no meaningful change made to the shroud between the years.



 
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Hmmmm.

I have a 71 that was an 11/70 build and I changed the motor mounts and perches to the 73 captive style.  Shroud in place during break-in and I had no rubbing problems at the shroud.

kcmash

 
helicopter , what mounts did u have on the engine side ??????? rackerm is right on the money and helped me figure out my issue.. with that said wondering if u had regular rubber style on the motor side??? if so bingo.. that was exactly why my motor was sitting low. i changed frame/engine mounts to '71-72 and it solved my problem. the '73 frame side is about 1/2 or so lower and if u found regular rubber mounts on engine is will sit lower and hit the shourd .

 
Today I replaced the Transmission mount that came with the new engine mounts.  Results: Negative.  Still scrapes.

I called the supplier and they are sure the 71 to 73 engine mounts are the same.

Then why are the fan blades still hitting the bottom of the shroud ?

It HAS to be the mounts !!

Roy

 
Please don't take my word for it cause I don't know this for sure but it seems to me i read somewhere that there's not only a difference between 71/2 and 73 mounts and perches but also between convertibles and fastbacks or coupes.

Can anyone confirm or disprove of this?

I know I've ordered engine mounts for mine twice and both times they were wrong. (I just don't remember if they were tall or small)

 
Today I replaced the Transmission mount that came with the new engine mounts.  Results: Negative.  Still scrapes.

I called the supplier and they are sure the 71 to 73 engine mounts are the same.

Then why are the fan blades still hitting the bottom of the shroud ?

It HAS to be the mounts !!

Roy
your supplier is WRONG.. 71-72 are the same... '73 is different in both frame and engine mounts. on 71-2 the frame mount is taller and rubber engine mount is about the same (maybe) as '73 in height. the '73 frame side IS shorter and uses the clam shell engine side. u can not use a regular '71-2 rubber without replacing the lower frame mount too.. i went threw that last year and wanted the rubber engine and had to buy the 1-2 frame to bring up motor enough to stop hitting my shroud also. worked!!!

with all that said IF u find out u have '1-2 u need the lower frame mount for a 73 i do have a set i removed if u need them but u'll need new clam shell mount too.

 
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Please don't take my word for it cause I don't know this for sure but it seems to me i read somewhere that there's not only a difference between 71/2 and 73 mounts and perches but also between convertibles and fastbacks or coupes.

Can anyone confirm or disprove of this?

I know I've ordered engine mounts for mine twice and both times they were wrong. (I just don't remember if they were tall or small)
I have heard that they are different between vert and coupe/FB, but I have not found any difference, much less a height difference.

Roy, 

Your supplier is wrong, I think I proved that in my earlier post in both words and in the picture comparing them.  I have not used them, but these aftermarket Prothane Motor Mounts 6-1904-BL on eBay look like the 73 captive style mounts, but still may not be the correct height. I am suspicious because the list a correct for 71-73.

The other approach is to do what I suggested to another forum member, Delaware Bill, and it solved his problem, and that is change out the 73 frame perches for a set of 71-72 frame perches to match your 71-72 mounts. These perches are taller than the 73 version and will raise the engine up.  

Here is a listing for a pair 71 frame mounts. The description list them for a 71 mustang, but 71 and 72 year used the same mounts.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/70-71-Ford-Torino-Cobra-Mustang-Mercury-Cyclone-OEM-429-302-351c-Engine-Stands/282505629520?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D44040%26meid%3D608c48e614c34b59ace157b9cc08884b%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D142508759722%26itm%3D282505629520&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

Finally, you could try to find a pair of OEM used 73 captive motor mounts, but these are hard to find and expensive.

 
Both my 73 verts are completely stock... motor mounts, fan, shroud, spacer. One is a 351C A/C auto car and the other a non- A/C 302 auto car

 
I might be totally incorrect. I thought only 73 verts had the 1" difference in position?

If everything checks out you might have a bend in the front of your frame or the part that holds the radiator and shroud. Some people have been known to jack them up using the front cross member and that is a NO NO.

Even lifting my rust free California vert on two post lift you can see the door gaps open up. They bend very easily.

David

 
Here are the parts numbers for a 73 Mustang with either a 302 or a 351C 2v or 4v

Bracket Front Support (aka Motor mount perch) = D3ZZ - 6028-A RH and D3ZZ-6029-A LH

Front Insulator (aka Captive Motor Mount) = D3ZZ-6038-A LH + RH

Rear Insulator (aka Transmission Mount) = D3ZZ-6A027-A

Note: these part numbers all have an engineering year of D3ZZ. Unfortunately I do not have a parts manual for the 71 and 72 model years, but I am fairly sure the same parts for preceding years had either a D1ZZ or a D2ZZ part number, and are not interchangeable with D3ZZ, unless both the perches and mounts are changed together. Also, I cannot find different part numbers for a convertible, nor are there any notes excluding convertibles for the part numbers above.

Related Diagram:



 
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To use the 71-72 motor mounts on your 73 you would need to use the 71-72 "Perches" or frame brackets. The right side DOOZ-6028-B (ID#  DOOA-6A094-B) and the left side DOOZ-6029-B (ID# DOOA-6A095-B) shouldn't be too difficult to find as the one year only 73 mounts. The brackets you need were also used on 70-71 Torino, Mercury Montego/Cyclone with 302/351's, and the 71-72 non convertible Mustang 302-351 and Cougar 351. The insulator or motor mount is the same for both sides (DOOZ-6038-G).

The 71-72 302/351C vert used different perches/frame brackets. Right side D1ZZ-6028-A (ID# D1ZA-6A094-BA) and left side D1ZZ-6029-A (ID# D1ZA-6A095-BA) The motor mount was also different (D1ZZ-6038B).

Rackerm has already provided some excellent info and part numbers on the 73 perches and motor mounts. There was a different set of perches and mounts for the 73 vert. The right side perch/frame bracket D3ZZ-6028-B (ID# D3ZA-6A094-BA/BB) and left side D3ZZ-6029-B (ID# D3ZA-6A095-BA/BB)  used  motor mount D3ZZ-6038-B that went through 8 different engineering revisions before the dust settled. The vert numbers are difficult to find since they are no longer in the 73-79 Ford parts catalog. Sales were probably slow to nonexistent on a part that was only used on the vert for one year so they were discontinued (1979) before the final issue 73-79 Ford Master Parts catalog was printed in 11/88.

So you can see with so many variables with perches and mounts how a "Mismatch" could occur.

The same fan shroud for 302 and 351's was used 71-73.

 
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To use the 71-72 motor mounts on your 73 you would need to use the 71-72 "Perches" or frame brackets. The right side DOOZ-6028-B (ID#  DOOA-6A094-B) and the left side DOOZ-6029-B (ID# DOOA-6A095-B) shouldn't be too difficult to find as the one year only 73 mounts. The brackets you need were also used on 70-71 Torino, Mercury Montego/Cyclone with 302/351's, and the 71-72 non convertible Mustang 302-351 and Cougar 351. The insulator or motor mount is the same for both sides (DOOZ-6038-G).

The 71-72 302/351C vert used different perches/frame brackets. Right side D1ZZ-6028-A (ID# D1ZA-6A094-BA) and left side D1ZZ-6029-A (ID# D1ZA-6A095-BA) The motor mount was also different (D1ZZ-6038B).

Rackerm has already provided some excellent info and part numbers on the 73 perches and motor mounts. There was a different set of perches and mounts for the 73 vert. The right side perch/frame bracket D3ZZ-6028-B (ID# D3ZA-6A094-BA/BB) and left side D3ZZ-6029-B (ID# D3ZA-6A095-BA/BB)  used  motor mount D3ZZ-6038-B that went through 8 different engineering revisions before the dust settled. The vert numbers are difficult to find since they are no loner in the 73-79 Ford parts catalog. Sales were probably slow to nonexistent on a part that was only used on the vert for one year so they were discontinued (1979) before the final issue 73-79 Ford Master Parts catalog was printed in 11/88.

So you can see with so many variables with perches and mounts how a "Mismatch" could occur.

The same fan shroud for 302 and 351's was used 71-73.
Thanks Steve, I am always amazed at how much history and part number information you have about our cars. I am curious about exactly what the differences were between the coupe/FB and the vert versions of the mounts. Looking at them both I have not seen anything obvious.

 
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