1971 351C 2V Intake and carb question.

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turtle5353

turtle5353

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Hey Guys.  Just a quick question for everyone.  The guy I painted the mustang for 2 years ago is bringing it back out for some more work. He has a BONE stock 351C 2v with a 3 speed manual trans. He is wanting me to install a 4 barrel carb and intake on it for him. Right now he doesn't want to do anything else to the motor. I'm sure in the future he will do a complete motor teardown and rebuild, but right now the motor only has 40,000 original miles on it and he just wants a 4 barrel. So my question is what carb and intake combo?? The simpler the better for this because he will not be messing with it at all.  I am thinking of just going with an Edelbrock performer intake and 600cfm carb with electric choke. Simple , easy, set it and forget it.  I know if we build this motor later down the road these items will not be any good for a performance build, but right now he just wants that 4 barrel! lol.  About the only other thing we may do to it this year is a set of dual exhaust and possibly headers, but not sure yet. Right now its the factory stock single exhaust. Any suggestions on headers that will work with power steering, power brakes, 3 speed manual, and AC??  Shortys would be fine or long tube. Let me know your thoughts fellas!!!



 
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I think for the basic upgrade you are on the right track. The performer is a decent manifold. You could go with an airgap and have that already for future performance build. as far as headers I am running the headman long tubes, they fit great. I am not a fan of the edelbrock carbs. I would go with a quick fuel in the 600 - 650 range for a stock 2v.

 
Planning for future upgrades, I'd look at a performer RPM and a Quick fuel 680 CFM vacuum secondary carb. The carb has good adjustability and the vacuum secondaries will adjust to the demand of the engine and the stock rear gear. For headers I'd look for long tubes, something with 1.75 primary tube size and 3 inch collector. These parts will work well with an otherwise stock engine as well as moderate power enhancements. Chuck

 
The only under $500 headers for the 351C that'll clear the 71-73 clutch linkage are the Hooker Comp #6921.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hok-6921hkr

I have the original Holley 4010 on my car and for a stock motor, they work very well. Much more reliable than an Edelbrock and less heat soak issues. As noted by Don, the Summit is the same carb, just rebranded. I'd mate it to the Performer and not worry about what he's going to do next. These parts are fairly inexpensive and you'll get a bit back if sold when he upgrades.

IMO, the best "smiles per mile" for that car is to toss the 3 speed into the nearest dumpster and put in a toploader w/Hurst Comp Plus shifter. It's literally a plug and play, with only the speedo cable and gear needing to be changed.

 
I have zero complaints with my Edelbrock Performer 1406 and Performer 2750 2V/4bbl intake.  Use the included ball on the throttle lever and the factory throttle cable with snap right on - should be no other modifications necessary (except wiring up the electric choke if the 2V carb doesn't have one, that is).

 
basic holley or quick fuel square bore carb.

eddy carbs are a tuning nightmare just waiting to happen and they do not make enough different parts to tune them perfectly in some cases, plus you have to pay an additional $70.00 for the privilege of buying their tuning kit if you need to tune it, and chances are extremely high that you will.

.

 
I'm glad I'm not the only one who has that opinion of the Edelbrock carburetors. I know I'll never buy another one. The ones I tried needed tuning right out of the box.

 
Thanks for all the input fellas! Back in the day for simplicity, I always went straight to an edelbrock carb on my stock or slightly modified motors, just like Eric did with his. Never had any trouble with them, straight out of the box just set the idle. I am far from being a carb tuner! And the gentleman that i'm doing this for does not want to have to touch once its installed. I will look into the quick fuel and the summit brand carbs too. I just don't want to have to fight it to get it to run properly.

Hemikiller, do those headers fit with power steering?? The ad says they will not work, just wondering if you know for sure?? Do they come in anything other than black?

 
The PO of my 73 vert with H code put the Edelbrock Performer intake on and Holley 4-V carb. The carb needs a rebuild for sure sat for 27 years. The intake fits great and I am not a carb. expert at all. He also put headers on but I cannot say what brand.

On another car I bought was an H code with three speed and PO had just put new Pypes exhaust with ceramic coated headers on. Here are some pics of the headers with the part number you can probably look up on the net. Was P.S., PDB car also and nothing was in the way and the exhaust was tucked up high so the collectors did not hit anything.

If you buy the 2-V headers they will not work with 4-V heads if he switches later so keep that in mind.

I put a 2-V header next to 4-V head to show the difference. The 2-V and 4-V gaskets are on the floor also. The 4-V gasket on top of a 2-V to show the difference.

Pic of a spare 2-V to 4-V intake and intake by a 4-V head.





















what is the chemical formula of aluminum oxide

 
The PO of my 73 vert with H code put the Edelbrock Performer intake on and Holley 4-V carb. The carb needs a rebuild for sure sat for 27 years. The intake fits great and I am not a carb. expert at all. He also put headers on but I cannot say what brand.

On another car I bought was an H code with three speed and PO had just put new Pypes exhaust with ceramic coated headers on. Here are some pics of the headers with the part number you can probably look up on the net. Was P.S., PDB car also and nothing was in the way and the exhaust was tucked up high so the collectors did not hit anything.

If you buy the 2-V headers they will not work with 4-V heads if he switches later so keep that in mind.

I put a 2-V header next to 4-V head to show the difference. The 2-V and 4-V gaskets are on the floor also. The 4-V gasket on top of a 2-V to show the difference.

Pic of a spare 2-V to 4-V intake and intake by a 4-V head.





















what is the chemical formula of aluminum oxide
Click to expand...

Thanks David.  Those appear to be Patriot headers. They claim that you need a bracket to clear power steering. Do you recall seeing any bracket??

 
The PO of my 73 vert with H code put the Edelbrock Performer intake on and Holley 4-V carb. The carb needs a rebuild for sure sat for 27 years. The intake fits great and I am not a carb. expert at all. He also put headers on but I cannot say what brand.

On another car I bought was an H code with three speed and PO had just put new Pypes exhaust with ceramic coated headers on. Here are some pics of the headers with the part number you can probably look up on the net. Was P.S., PDB car also and nothing was in the way and the exhaust was tucked up high so the collectors did not hit anything.

If you buy the 2-V headers they will not work with 4-V heads if he switches later so keep that in mind.

I put a 2-V header next to 4-V head to show the difference. The 2-V and 4-V gaskets are on the floor also. The 4-V gasket on top of a 2-V to show the difference.

Pic of a spare 2-V to 4-V intake and intake by a 4-V head.





















what is the chemical formula of aluminum oxide
Click to expand...

Thanks David.  Those appear to be Patriot headers. They claim that you need a bracket to clear power steering. Do you recall seeing any bracket??
Click to expand...
I do not recall any bracket. The steering box is still on the chassis. One bolt did not want to come out.

 
Hemikiller, do those headers fit with power steering?? The ad says they will not work, just wondering if you know for sure??  Do they come in anything  other than black?
Click to expand...
Yes, they fit fine with PS, the Summit app guide is wrong. There is no bracket for the 71-73 with the integral power steering. That's a 65-70 Mustang/Cougar problem with the external assist ram.

Summit also sells them in various coatings, but the cost is more than double. 

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hok-6921-1hkr

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hok-6921-3hkr

 
Back in the day for simplicity, I always went straight to an edelbrock carb on my stock or slightly modified motors, just like Eric did with his. Never had any trouble with them, straight out of the box just set the idle.  

I am far from being a carb tuner!

And the gentleman that i'm doing this for does not want to have to touch once its installed.

I just don't want to have to fight it to get it to run properly.

I will look into the quick fuel and the summit brand carbs too.
Click to expand...
i have tuned literally over 500 carbs, with the majority being holleys but several were eddys, and i tune them and the timing etc until the engines run perfectly, and i can tell you with a lot of first hand experience that IF an eddy needs to be tuned, it can be a nightmare and may not be able to be tuned properly because of the limited amount of tuning parts they make for it. of course, there will be instances where an eddy just happens to work "acceptably" well enough to use right out of the box, but in my experience, that percentage is extremely low.

in contrast, holleys are easy to tune and you do not have to buy an entire $65.00 kit just to try and tune them like you do with the eddys.

i also doubt that you do not want to be in a position where you buy an eddy carb and it does not work properly right out of the box and you can't seem to get it to work as well as the customer wants and then you need to start a thread titled. "HOW DO I TUNE THIS POS EDDY CARBURETOR?"

I will also add that i have in fact bought cars that had fairly new eddys on them that did not run quite right and i simply took them off and literally gave them away for free just to not put myself thru the possibility of the carb not being able to be runed properly or just because i didn't have the tuning parts left that i needed and didn't want to fork out another $65.00 for them.

.

 
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I also have the Hooker Competition 2V headers (ceramic coated) with a stock power steering gearbox, and they fit just fine with no issues.  They were easy enough to snake down from the top, even though there's more room on the passenger side to install from the bottom (I was on a lift at the time, just made more sense).

I also have an AOD, with a larger valve body than the FMX, and they still fit just fine (albeit a bit closer thanks to the larger valve body).

exhaust2.jpg


I admit that I would've preferred they come back straight, rather than taper in, but I haven't had any weird transmission heat-related issues... probably due to the ceramic coating helping with the temps.

 
Back in the day for simplicity, I always went straight to an edelbrock carb on my stock or slightly modified motors, just like Eric did with his. Never had any trouble with them, straight out of the box just set the idle.  

I am far from being a carb tuner!

And the gentleman that i'm doing this for does not want to have to touch once its installed.

I just don't want to have to fight it to get it to run properly.

I will look into the quick fuel and the summit brand carbs too.
Click to expand...
i have tuned literally over 500 carbs, with the majority being holleys but several were eddys, and i tune them and the timing etc until the engines run perfectly, and i can tell you with a lot of first hand experience that IF an eddy needs to be tuned, it can be a nightmare and may not be able to be tuned properly because of the limited amount of tuning parts they make for it. of course, there will be instances where an eddy just happens to work "acceptably" well enough to use right out of the box, but in my experience, that percentage is extremely low.

in contrast, holleys are easy to tune and you do not have to buy an entire $65.00 kit just to try and tune them like you do with the eddys.

i also doubt that you do not want to be in a position where you buy an eddy carb and it does not work properly right out of the box and you can't seem to get it to work as well as the customer wants and then you need to start a thread titled. "HOW DO I TUNE THIS POS EDDY CARBURETOR?"

I will also add that i have in fact bought cars that had fairly new eddys on them that did not run quite right and i simply took them off and literally gave them away for free just to not put myself thru the possibility of the carb not being able to be runed properly or just because i didn't have the tuning parts left that i needed and didn't want to fork out another $65.00 for them.

.
Click to expand...
Ah...c'mon, Barnett...tell us how you really feel! :D ::devil::

 
Back in the day for simplicity, I always went straight to an edelbrock carb on my stock or slightly modified motors, just like Eric did with his. Never had any trouble with them, straight out of the box just set the idle.  

I am far from being a carb tuner!

And the gentleman that i'm doing this for does not want to have to touch once its installed.

I just don't want to have to fight it to get it to run properly.

I will look into the quick fuel and the summit brand carbs too.
Click to expand...
i have tuned literally over 500 carbs, with the majority being holleys but several were eddys, and i tune them and the timing etc until the engines run perfectly, and i can tell you with a lot of first hand experience that IF an eddy needs to be tuned, it can be a nightmare and may not be able to be tuned properly because of the limited amount of tuning parts they make for it. of course, there will be instances where an eddy just happens to work "acceptably" well enough to use right out of the box, but in my experience, that percentage is extremely low.

in contrast, holleys are easy to tune and you do not have to buy an entire $65.00 kit just to try and tune them like you do with the eddys.

i also doubt that you do not want to be in a position where you buy an eddy carb and it does not work properly right out of the box and you can't seem to get it to work as well as the customer wants and then you need to start a thread titled. "HOW DO I TUNE THIS POS EDDY CARBURETOR?"

I will also add that i have in fact bought cars that had fairly new eddys on them that did not run quite right and i simply took them off and literally gave them away for free just to not put myself thru the possibility of the carb not being able to be runed properly or just because i didn't have the tuning parts left that i needed and didn't want to fork out another $65.00 for them.

.
Click to expand...
Ah...c'mon, Barnett...tell us how you really feel! :D ::devil::
Click to expand...

Well I was going to but I didn't want to sound bias, lol.

By the way, hows the remodeling going?

.

.

 
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Got two General Contractors (finally!) to look at the house and make bids; roofers started today and fencing on 2nd of 3rd day of work. Progress! Still looking a 4-6 months before we can fully move back into the house.

 

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