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TuTone Hood Black or Argent Layout


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Hope this is right place to post this info.

I was looking at jpaz last posts on the repair of his crashed car. With all the miss information on the net about the size and position of the black or argent flat paint on the hood thought I would post a side by side of his car and mine about the same size. For some reason I cannot get it to work. I took both pictures and cropped them to close to same size but cannot reduce the file size for some reason.

System will not let me do a screen print either says too large.

His black looks to be positioned front to back about right but the width is for sure small. The flatness of the paint with today's paint is what you get. I would expect the factory used lacquer in the day to dry fast.

So here is what I have.

 

jpaz.jpg

 

Original.jpg

When a man is in the woods and talks and no women are there is he still wrong??:P

David

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David I do see what you mean. This why in a reply post to you, I asked the question (paraphrased) "does anybody know IF there were any changes to the hood black-out size and shape between 1971 and 1973" We all know Ford changed thing almost 'at will'. The side stripes on the 73 are totally different, so I wondered If by chance someone in the design studio decided the hood black-out needed a refresh, hence it's bigger. I guess I'm curious in case I decide to repaint my '71 hood and get it right.

Geoff.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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I hope the date codes on the other hoods I have with original paint are early hoods so I can compare them. Will be next week before I can get to them.

When a man is in the woods and talks and no women are there is he still wrong??:P

David

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Seems to be at least another inch wider on each side on David's car!

 

 From an esthetics and proportional view point, the layout on jpaz's car looks better than the wider black-out on David's car. That's just my opinion of course.

 Adding to my above reply, dose anybody have a picture of a 71 and 72 hood with factory black-out?  I'm just getting way to curios now, I need answers!!!

Geoff.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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I hope the date codes on the other hoods I have with original paint are early hoods so I can compare them. Will be next week before I can get to them.

 

Ah, you have other factory hoods! Yes indeed it would be interesting to know of any differences.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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This is a picture from the Ford Sales Brochure for 71 and the black does look to be more narrow for sure.

The 1972 Brochure does not have a pic and the 73 looks smaller than mine. Lots of things changes from the early cars in the brochure for sure.

b_1973%20Ford%20Mustang-12-13.jpg

637x1034http://oldcarbrochures.com/static/NA/Ford_%20Mustang/1971_Ford_Mustang/1971%20Ford%20Mustang%20Brochure/1971%20Mustang-14.jpg[/img]

When a man is in the woods and talks and no women are there is he still wrong??:P

David

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I see what you mean too David. But I did tell my painter to go by the layout from Kit Sullivan’s 71 429 Mach, and I am very happy with how it turned out. Kit was a member on this site, as I’m sure many of you remember. Anyway if I remember correctly he said that if you use the 2” rule for the layout you would be right on. He had a great wright up on it here. So what that means, if you measure 2” from the contours of the hood to the outside edge of the outline, then it would leave it 2” back from the leading edge of the front of the hood. I forgot how much is in between the outline and main part, 1/2” I think. He said that's how his original hood was done from the factory and that’s the hood that Graphics express made their template from. It’s the same one used today.

Here’s a yellow and black hood on the 429 mega site. I think mine looks very similar, definitely close enough for me. So maybe there was a change, which I find hard to believe that Ford would spend more money on paint. But guess they may have or were the templates that they used that different?

7-CFAF595-E550-4017-80-A3-3-C3979-D6-BBFF.jpg

John - 72 Q Code

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It's really difficult to tell for sure, John's picture is taken from a lower angle and with a shorter lens. If you take a straightedge and line up with the outside (small) stripe the straightedge will line up with the inside of the hood lock in both pictures. Really need the measurements on John's blackout. I know that David measured one of his at about 6-3/16 inches.

https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-incorrect-ram-air-hood-paint?pid=316933&highlight=hood+stripe#pid316933

 

 

“If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.”

--Albert Einstein

 

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Original paint 73's for comparison... First pic is from car that sold a while back that had original paint and 2k miles on it. Second pic is kind of hard to see but you can see stripe outline.

 

hood-blackout-73-2k-original-mile-car.jpg

 

 

 

 

hood-flat-black-original-paint-73m.jpg

Jeff

1972 Q Code Convertible

 

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It's really difficult to tell for sure, John's picture is taken from a lower angle and with a shorter lens. If you take a straightedge and line up with the outside (small) stripe the straightedge will line up with the inside of the hood lock in both pictures. Really need the measurements on John's blackout. I know that David measured one of his at about 6-3/16 inches.

https://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-incorrect-ram-air-hood-paint?pid=316933&highlight=hood+stripe#pid316933

I will measure it when I get it back. I did tell my painter that they would end up with about 6” from outside edge of the outline to the edge of hood next to the scoops and about 5 1/2” at the back edge. I did say also if it wasn’t working out with the way I had him lay it out to let me know. But they were happy with what I told them and went ahead and painted it. Maybe I misunderstood what Kit was saying about his original layout. Anyway I’m happy with it, plus it’s soooo much better than it was and all I had to do was run into a utility pole to fix it, lol.

John - 72 Q Code

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Mine was set at 6" from the edge of the hood to the outside edge of the 1/4" stripe all the way down. It was at the front of the hood dimension were I messed up.

In the pic it shows what it should be (approx.), not what I have at 3"

 

 

IMG-3665-LI.jpg

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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Question.  Do most of the front to rear positioning errors occur due to painters  measuring from the back side of the lead edge trim instead of the front side of that trim?

 

Just curious after watching all these discussions.

 

Wish I had my hood on so I could show pics!

 

kcmash

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Well some got wrong from measuring from the front of the hood without the trim, so from the front of the hood is wrong. It must include the trim and it should be 2” from the leading edge of the hood, which means that it includes the trim, or whatever you want to call it.

But the main or the big reason this has been done wrong is because of the Mustang Monthly article. It states that the pattern is 3” back from the leading edge of the hood instead of 2”. The width of the pattern really gets screwed up when it gets put back to far. So many have had this done by mistake. My painter even said he used this. Good thing I asked him about it or he would have had to re do it. I flat out asked him what pattern he used for it and when he said it was from the mm article I told him Not to do the blackout till I went to check it out. Now maybe I didn’t tell him exactly how to do it right after seeing David’s hood next to mine,but I’m still happy. But this is a great place to figure it out, and my painter/shop would surely be interested in the correct way. He was extremely glad that I knew something more that he didn’t, just so it would be done correct.

John - 72 Q Code

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John, That's exactly what I did, told the painter it was 2" from the front of the hood, but forgot the "trim piece" was not yet on, so I ended up with 3". My mistake, so it is what it is. Most people looking at the car don't know the difference anyway, just us. If the black-out ever gets scratched or otherwise damaged, I'll redo it (more) correctly.

Geoff.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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This is one of those situations we would all like to talk to the engineer at Ford or the actual painter on the line that did the work.

For sure there is no way they could have applied the tape by hand for all the curves. It would have to be a pre cut template. I do not think they could have used a vacuum mask like when they painted like the headlight bezels on 73. The edge would not be crisp enough.

For sure mine is not centered on the hood in the rear. When I measured it some for a member it was way off. The spacing between the main black and the outline is shown in pic. looks like 1/2". The measurements from edge of hood to the outside border at the windshield looks like 5 3/4" on the drivers side and 5" on the passenger side. So 3/8" out of center. Close enough for rough work, lol.

I do not see how they made any money on the tutone hood and hood locks for $18.00. Look at all the components in the hood lock and special machined pins for the locks. Shows you how cheap Ford got the parts.

After I get the car cleaned up I will do some better pics and measurements and post here for future reference. Then get the other two hoods out of storage and check dates and measure them also.

 

DSC-2477.jpg

 

DSC-2478.jpg

 

DSC-2479.jpg

 

DSC-2481.jpg

When a man is in the woods and talks and no women are there is he still wrong??:P

David

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This is one of those situations we would all like to talk to the engineer at Ford or the actual painter on the line that did the work.

For sure there is no way they could have applied the tape by hand for all the curves. It would have to be a pre cut template. I do not think they could have used a vacuum mask like when they painted like the headlight bezels on 73. The edge would not be crisp enough.

For sure mine is not centered on the hood in the rear. When I measured it some for a member it was way off. The spacing between the main black and the outline is shown in pic. looks like 1/2". The measurements from edge of hood to the outside border at the windshield looks like 5 3/4" on the drivers side and 5" on the passenger side. So 3/8" out of center. Close enough for rough work, lol.

I do not see how they made any money on the tutone hood and hood locks for $18.00. Look at all the components in the hood lock and special machined pins for the locks. Shows you how cheap Ford got the parts.

After I get the car cleaned up I will do some better pics and measurements and post here for future reference. Then get the other two hoods out of storage and check dates and measure them also.

 

DSC-2477.jpg

 

DSC-2478.jpg

 

DSC-2479.jpg

 

DSC-2481.jpg

 

I did use some of the pics and measurements you have taken from your car too David. I showed the shop owner these, as well as some other original hood pics I could find. Like I said we were trying to just average it all out and make it look good. I’ll be sure to check all the measurements out to compare. It would be nice to figure this out, seems like more hoods get painted wrong instead of right. 

I can for sure see why an original hood pattern would be off center. I think it’s pretty amazing how well they actually did it. And for cheap too.

John - 72 Q Code

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John, That's exactly what I did, told the painter it was 2" from the front of the hood, but forgot the "trim piece" was not yet on, so I ended up with 3". My mistake, so it is what it is. Most people looking at the car don't know the difference anyway, just us. If the black-out ever gets scratched or otherwise damaged, I'll redo it (more) correctly.

Geoff.

 

Geoff, I actually showed my painter this picture too. I pointed out the difference between an original one and what happened with yours. He made the same mistake as your painter did in the past, I’m just lucky I asked him about it. I’m also very glad that you posted what happened with your hood, it definitely helped me out.

John - 72 Q Code

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John, That's exactly what I did, told the painter it was 2" from the front of the hood, but forgot the "trim piece" was not yet on, so I ended up with 3". My mistake, so it is what it is. Most people looking at the car don't know the difference anyway, just us. If the black-out ever gets scratched or otherwise damaged, I'll redo it (more) correctly.

Geoff.

 

Geoff, I actually showed my painter this picture too. I pointed out the difference between an original one and what happened with yours. He made the same mistake as your painter did in the past, I’m just lucky I asked him about it. I’m also very glad that you posted what happened with your hood, it definitely helped me out.

 

 Hey John, that make me feel good that this mistake has helped you and maybe others do it (somewhat) right. Yes for sure it definitely appear that these hoods got painted differently, yet the same. For me, the ones that do piss me off are the ones where no effort has been made make it look even somewhat right. We all know what I mean I'm sure.

Geoff.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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John, That's exactly what I did, told the painter it was 2" from the front of the hood, but forgot the "trim piece" was not yet on, so I ended up with 3". My mistake, so it is what it is. Most people looking at the car don't know the difference anyway, just us. If the black-out ever gets scratched or otherwise damaged, I'll redo it (more) correctly.

Geoff.

 

Geoff, I actually showed my painter this picture too. I pointed out the difference between an original one and what happened with yours. He made the same mistake as your painter did in the past, I’m just lucky I asked him about it. I’m also very glad that you posted what happened with your hood, it definitely helped me out.

 

 Hey John, that make me feel good that this mistake has helped you and maybe others do it (somewhat) right. Yes for sure it definitely appear that these hoods got painted differently, yet the same. For me, the ones that do piss me off are the ones where no effort has been made make it look even somewhat right. We all know what I mean I'm sure.

Geoff.

 

So it seems that the 2 main reasons for this getting done wrong is from not including the front trim piece and the damn MM article being wrong. Those two different things equal about the same wrong placement. Glad we can learn from each other’s mistakes and hopefully help out a few others along the way.

John - 72 Q Code

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