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Revisiting installing a Hayden 2710 fan clutch and Derale 17118 fan.


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I am running the 2947 on my 460 with the 18" Derale fan and a slightly modified 351C fan shroud. The 2947 is so low profile that putting the nuts on the studs can be challenging. The fan depth in the shroud is not optimal but it cools fine. The fan is not loud. I am contemplating going to the 429 shroud and 19" fan not that it is needed.

73 conv. 460, D0VE large valve heads, Performer RPM manifold, Voodoo 227/233 cam, Holley 950 HP carb, C6 trans, 3.25 trak-loc.

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Chris, there are two versions of the 2710, one thermal, one not. I think you have the non-thermal one. It says right in the description about the non-thermal staying engaged.  As for a spacer, I

I believe the non-thermal is 1710. The thermal fan still spins at a reduced rate (20-30%) when disengaged.

You're absolutely right Don. I just went on R/A site and confirmed that and was just about to correct myself. Ya beat me too it!  

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59 minutes ago, TommyK said:

I am running the 2947 on my 460 with the 18" Derale fan and a slightly modified 351C fan shroud. The 2947 is so low profile that putting the nuts on the studs can be challenging. The fan depth in the shroud is not optimal but it cools fine. The fan is not loud. I am contemplating going to the 429 shroud and 19" fan not that it is needed.

Thanks for that Tommy.

I've decided to order the 2710 and the Derale 18" fan and IF I find I need a lower profile 2765, I'll address that as and when. I'm not sure I like the looks of the Dorman stud kit, they look "cheap" compared to the professional fixtures I'm used to using.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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Well it's done. I ordered the Hayden 2710 and Derale 17118 fan from Summit Racing. Shipping and taxes cost as much as the fan!! Oh the joy of not living in the US........ but on the other hand!!!!

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Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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I looked through my order history and found out mine is a 2710 not the 1710. So possibly defective. The reviews on these clutches are very hit and miss. 

Chris - BIG RED MACH 1

Born in '73 - Drive a '73

Former U.S. Army 63B10-H8

1st Infantry Division - The Big Red One

 

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For whatever it is worth it I used a Hayden 2710 with a Flex-a-lite 14544 1/2" spacer, a 3-core radiator and stock fan. The fan sticks out about 1/3 out of the shroud. I can't say that this will be the same in every car. At least in my case, my drivetrain is at a little steeper angle than stock due to the TKO600 which changes the fitment of the fan.

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20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg

 

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump

Strange center section with Truetrac, 3.5 gear and 31 spline axles, 4-wheel disc brakes

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2 hours ago, Big Red Mach 1 said:

I looked through my order history and found out mine is a 2710 not the 1710. So possibly defective. The reviews on these clutches are very hit and miss. 

 Did you think to compare pictures of the two. Is there a chance you happened to have been shipped the wrong one and you didn't realize? Hemikiller just changed one after 15 years, so I hope the one I get outlasts the time I'll own the car.

There are alternative manufacturers for similar fan clutches. Rock Auto list 3. Hope I made the right choice.

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Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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7 hours ago, TommyK said:

I am contemplating going to the 429 shroud

Unless you have one, let me know where you can find these. Got one last year from Ecklers, also avail from few others and all made by mac's antiques. They are expensive ABS pieces of junk, that's all they are. Certainly no shroud.

73 modified Grande 351C. (Finally back on the road woohoo!) 

71 429CJ. ( In progress )

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47 minutes ago, tony-muscle said:

For whatever it is worth it I used a Hayden 2710 with a Flex-a-lite 14544 1/2" spacer, a 3-core radiator and stock fan. The fan sticks out about 1/3 out of the shroud. I can't say that this will be the same in every car. At least in my case, my drivetrain is at a little steeper angle than stock due to the TKO600 which changes the fitment of the fan.

Thanks Tony for the spacer number. Jpaz also mentioned using a 1/2" spacer. I'll keep that in mind when I finally get started on this next little project.

I just got my order confirmation from Summit to find out the Derale 17188 18" fan is on backorder for two months, despite them showing it as "in stock". It's a good thing I'm in no rush as I don't want to order parts from different vendors and deal with extra shipping cost.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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6 minutes ago, Stanglover said:

Thanks Tony for the spacer number. Jpaz also mentioned using a 1/2" spacer. I'll keep that in mind when I finally get started on this next little project.

I just got my order confirmation from Summit to find out the Derale 17188 18" fan is on backorder for two months, despite them showing it as "in stock". It's a good thing I'm in no rush as I don't want to order parts from different vendors and deal with extra shipping cost.

Just in case you need it: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000CNLCHK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg

 

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump

Strange center section with Truetrac, 3.5 gear and 31 spline axles, 4-wheel disc brakes

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2 hours ago, tony-muscle said:

Awesome, thanks. I should order one just in case I do need it. It's not that expensive just to sit in a box if I don't need it.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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On 1/11/2021 at 2:23 PM, Stanglover said:

 Did you think to compare pictures of the two. Is there a chance you happened to have been shipped the wrong one and you didn't realize? Hemikiller just changed one after 15 years, so I hope the one I get outlasts the time I'll own the car.

There are alternative manufacturers for similar fan clutches. Rock Auto list 3. Hope I made the right choice.

Yup. I definitely have the right one. Just doesn't work as it should. 

Chris - BIG RED MACH 1

Born in '73 - Drive a '73

Former U.S. Army 63B10-H8

1st Infantry Division - The Big Red One

 

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11 hours ago, Big Red Mach 1 said:

Yup. I definitely have the right one. Just doesn't work as it should. 

Hmmm, that's disturbing!

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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8 minutes ago, Stanglover said:

Hmmm, that's disturbing!

Not entirely surprising if you real all of the reviews on them. Seems like it's certainly not the only one. I'd bet 85% of them are good, but obviously with anything mass produced, especially these days, it's gonna happen. I may not change it for a while...at least it's cooling! : )

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Chris - BIG RED MACH 1

Born in '73 - Drive a '73

Former U.S. Army 63B10-H8

1st Infantry Division - The Big Red One

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Well folks, I just got my Hayden 2710 fan clutch and the Derale 17118 fan delivered from Summit. My first thought is these two together are considerably heavier than the factory fan, so I'm wondering if the extra load on the water pump shaft bearing will be an issue in future. I know several of you are using this combo, so has anyone had or noticed any problems? 

For now, although the car is sitting in my garage which is not heated, I may decide to trial fit it as long as it's above freezing. I'm getting very bored under our current lockdown, so looking for stuff to do. The "Honey-Do" list is all but done (for now), so working in a cold garage seems like a plan. IF I find I need a 1/2" spacer as some have indicated, I have an extra factory spacer I can get cut down at my former machine shop if I talk nicely to my former boss. 

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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No problems with the extra weight for me, so far anyway. Actually I never really thought about it.

John - 72 Q Code

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53 minutes ago, jpaz said:

No problems with the extra weight for me, so far anyway. Actually I never really thought about it.

 Good to know John. That's just how my mind works, always thinking about possible problems. 

I forgot to mention that the water pump on the engine was replaced in 2016, so quite new, therefore not expecting any issue with it.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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Ford did make a HD water pump for the 351 C has roller bearing instead of ball. Hard to find for sure. The NASCAR guys used them. Might have been part of Boss not sure.

 

When a man is in the woods and talks and no women are there is he still wrong??:P

David

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1 hour ago, Carolina_Mountain_Mustangs said:

Ford did make a HD water pump for the 351 C has roller bearing instead of ball. Hard to find for sure. The NASCAR guys used them. Might have been part of Boss not sure.

 

Thanks David, I'll look into that as an option. Failing that, pick up a spare w/pump! However, I'm pretty sure a relatively new pump will last a while yet.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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9 hours ago, Hemikiller said:

Installed mine in 2003, no issues with fan or water pump. 

 Thanks Hemikiller, Sounds like all will be okay for good while. 

Q, did you need to add a spacer to get the fan located in the shroud correctly? Some have said to add a 1/2" spacer.

Thanks to all for the help on this.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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Not with the 302. The 351C is going in within a month or so, so we'll see where it ends up as I'm moving to the larger 26" radiator and shroud. 

 

 

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46 minutes ago, Hemikiller said:

Not with the 302. The 351C is going in within a month or so, so we'll see where it ends up as I'm moving to the larger 26" radiator and shroud. 

 Thanks Hemi. I found the original spacer I have, but I don't think I can cut it down the way it's made unless I install a long 5/8"sleeve through it. I may just order one in case and be done. It's not getting fitted for a while yet anyway unless I get really bored and want something to do in the near freezing garage.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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Today I'm bored so I decided to test fit the Hayden fan clutch and Derale 17118 fan. I started by fitting the fan to the clutch. The instruction sheet with the clutch calls for min. G5, 5/16 x 18 x 5/8" bolts and torque to 15-18 ft/lbs or 20-24 Nm. Ok all well and good, but 5/8 bolts are not your average standard at the hardware store. I had G5 3/4" so cut them down. They do not call for washers, flat or spring and with the thickness of the fan material, 5/8" is a tad too long and might bottom out. The rule of thumb is 7 threads for full engagement or in this case about .390". the bolt hole measured just over 1/2" of full thread. I cut my bolts to .550" +. I was hesitant to add washers when not called for, but instead use blue loktite. With the clutch, they supply a bronze bushing and 4 spring washers which are for attaching the fan clutch to the water pump with a description of how to place the "split" on the flange. 

Well after a 1/2 hour freezing my ass off in the garage and without suitable 5/16 x 24 G8 bolts to finish the job, I was able to see approximately how far the fan will be within the shroud. My guess is about 75 % and the hub about 3-4" form the rad. As some have added a 1/2" spacer at the water pump, that I think would put the fan tips a bit too far into the shroud to be effective. As it is, the new fan is slightly further in that the old 4 blade taken out.

So, with that, any opinions? I'm in no rush, it's going to wait till it warms up now........... unless I get really bored!!

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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Well, I didn't wait for it to warm up too much. Today I got the G8 bolts, alloy steel split lock washers and braved the 35f temp in the garage and got it on. A PITA to do as there is only room to use a standard open end wrench, or at least I had just grabbed a 1/2" ratchet / open wrench. The ratchet wouldn't fit so I just used what was in my hand. Too lazy to dig out a box end wrench I guess. Not relying on just the lock washer, I also used blue loktite. Anyway I have not fired it up and that can wait till whenever I need to move the car.

Job done............. I hope!

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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As usual, I forgot to take some pictures as I do jobs on the car. So today, I took a few pictures of the fan clutch install. I think the fan looks to be set in the shroud about right, blade tips past the edge of the shroud by about 3/4". The 'square' part of the blade tip is within the shroud's flat area, which is where I believe it should be. 

I know some have used a 1/2" spacer, but looking at it, I think that would in effect bury the blades inside the shroud, which would cut the efficiency of the fan. Thoughts?

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Edited by Stanglover
Added pic 1265 as Old v New fan comp.
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Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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