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Ford; Found On Road Dead, broke another throttle cable today.


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2 hours ago, tony-muscle said:

This is my spare from ACP. The length is 23.5", but I have not tried it on. I hope I am not surprised the day I need it that it doesn't work. If it is longer at least you can jerry rig it to make it work for an emergency, better than too short.

20210615_104403.thumb.jpg.1afa1e2b65c63a08aa748a3e14297f46.jpg

Tony, On the pre 7/10/72 cable, I've come to realize the critical length is from the inside of the firewall fastener to the center of the eye. On the one I just took out, I'm almost certain that the cable pull out as I see on this one, the  little stop block thingy is right up against the "eye" as I'm calling it. The one I shortened is now the same. That length ought to be around 2 1/2" to 2 3/4". if you would like to confirm that, I'd appreciate it.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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2 hours ago, Stanglover said:

Tony, On the pre 7/10/72 cable, I've come to realize the critical length is from the inside of the firewall fastener to the center of the eye. On the one I just took out, I'm almost certain that the cable pull out as I see on this one, the  little stop block thingy is right up against the "eye" as I'm calling it. The one I shortened is now the same. That length ought to be around 2 1/2" to 2 3/4". if you would like to confirm that, I'd appreciate it.

The one pictured measures 3" from the "firewall" surface of the flange to the center of the eye.

  • Thanks 1

20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg

 

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump

Strange center section with Truetrac, 3.5 gear and 31 spline axles, 4-wheel disc brakes

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1 hour ago, tony-muscle said:

The one pictured measures 3" from the "firewall" surface of the flange to the center of the eye.

Ok thanks Tony. That is pretty close to my estimate within a 1/4".  

I think a possible reason why the eye end might have pull out ( I wish I could have found that piece!!) is there is no positive pedal stop at WOT. Even tough the carb stop is there, excess pressure on the pedal could be applied, straining the cable crimp.

Again, thanks for measuring that for us. Great info to have imo.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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5 hours ago, Stanglover said:

Ok thanks Tony. That is pretty close to my estimate within a 1/4".  

I think a possible reason why the eye end might have pull out ( I wish I could have found that piece!!) is there is no positive pedal stop at WOT. Even tough the carb stop is there, excess pressure on the pedal could be applied, straining the cable crimp.

Again, thanks for measuring that for us. Great info to have imo.

Ideally the stop would be the pedal hitting the floor.

20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg

 

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump

Strange center section with Truetrac, 3.5 gear and 31 spline axles, 4-wheel disc brakes

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8 hours ago, tony-muscle said:

Ideally the stop would be the pedal hitting the floor.

True, but maybe my problem was stomping on the loud pedal too hard, pushing the pedal deep into the carpet. It's a pity there is no way to adjust the free play on that cable to get proper function at both ends.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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48 minutes ago, Stanglover said:

True, but maybe my problem was stomping on the loud pedal too hard, pushing the pedal deep into the carpet. It's a pity there is no way to adjust the free play on that cable to get proper function at both ends.

Mine was a bit too long at the carb so I added washers at the manifold bracket to bring the cable back.

20160929_171923_edit2_small.jpg

 

1971 M-Code Mach 1 w/Ram Air, 408 stroker, 285/291 0.558" roller cam, Blue Thunder intake, TKO600, Hooker headers with electric cut-offs, FiTech EFI w/ RobBMC PowerSurge pump

Strange center section with Truetrac, 3.5 gear and 31 spline axles, 4-wheel disc brakes

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1 hour ago, tony-muscle said:

Mine was a bit too long at the carb so I added washers at the manifold bracket to bring the cable back.

 I see, interesting. It seems there might be two different lengths available, 22 1/2" and 23 1/2" overall. Without comparing the two, I have no idea if the carb end or the cable end is different. That said, this is confusing, the old one I just took out would have only measured 21 1/2". The one I put in after shortening the pedal end by 1", fit the carb attachment end the same as the one I took out. I'm wondering if the vendors are selling the same cable for the 429 and the 351 (302). I've not looked at a specific 429 cable to know of any difference. I'm just wondering. Weird!

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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Hello Geoff,

Sorry to hear you had a problem with your car... which is also at the same time all your Chevy buddies will just happen to drive by and give you words of encouragement!

I hate to say things like "That has never happened to me" cause you do know what will happen next. I don't know how my pewter Mach 1 (Money Pitt #1) ever survived me. I was involved in a lot of very illegal late-night drag racing at one time. Since I ran against some big-block cars, I had the pedal more than firmly mashed to the floor. Besides the indentation of the pedal in the vinyl insert part of the carpet, I broke the black plastic part of the pedal twice, but never the cable. 

The original OE throttle cable is D1ZZ-9A758-D @ 22.50". It was replaced by D1ZZ-9A758-H @ 22.50". Both of these are eyelet and clip style. Although the part number never changed, there was a running change on the accelerator pedal assembly where some over-travel brackets were added. Money Pitt #1 is a late build car (7-28-71) that has the brackets on the accelerator pedal, so evidently, that modification was the fix for overstressing the cable. 

An additional change took place in late '72 production (6-19-72) where the '73 style accelerator pedal and cable were now OE. The D3ZZ-9A758-C cable is 23.25" and attached to the accelerator with a snap-in grommet. A much easier solution for those of us that are not quite as limber and with perfect eyesight as we processed...... a "few" years ago!

I have a couple of sources you can check since the repo cables don't seem reliable. I have used them before but can't guarantee reasonable prices. Both of these vendors specialize in NOS parts obtained from Ford and Ford Lincoln/Mercury dealers, so they understand the value of NOS versus repo parts. Green Sales shows one and NOS Parts shows two. Not sure how often their inventory is updated but that is what is shown today. 

https://nospartsltd.com/product/d1zz9a758h/

http://www.greensalescompany.com/

If you haven't already found a cable you could contact these two sources to check the availability. If these don't pan out let me know. I have one other source that shows D1ZZ-D and H but can be a PIA to deal with and I only use as a last resort!  

The red arrows point to the brackets on the "new and improved" D1ZZ-9725-A

Second picture illustrates the grommet hole on the D3ZZ-9725-A

9725-D1ZZ-A.jpg

9725-D3ZZ-A1.jpg

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Steve

 

No Officer...I really don't know how fast I was going, my speedometer stopped at 140!

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3 hours ago, secluff said:

Hello Geoff,

Sorry to hear you had a problem with your car... which is also at the same time all your Chevy buddies will just happen to drive by and give you words of encouragement!

I hate to say things like "That has never happened to me" cause you do know what will happen next. I don't know how my pewter Mach 1 (Money Pitt #1) ever survived me. I was involved in a lot of very illegal late-night drag racing at one time. Since I ran against some big-block cars, I had the pedal more than firmly mashed to the floor. Besides the indentation of the pedal in the vinyl insert part of the carpet, I broke the black plastic part of the pedal twice, but never the cable. 

The original OE throttle cable is D1ZZ-9A758-D @ 22.50". It was replaced by D1ZZ-9A758-H @ 22.50". Both of these are eyelet and clip style. Although the part number never changed, there was a running change on the accelerator pedal assembly where some over-travel brackets were added. Money Pitt #1 is a late build car (7-28-71) that has the brackets on the accelerator pedal, so evidently, that modification was the fix for overstressing the cable. 

An additional change took place in late '72 production (6-19-72) where the '73 style accelerator pedal and cable were now OE. The D3ZZ-9A758-C cable is 23.25" and attached to the accelerator with a snap-in grommet. A much easier solution for those of us that are not quite as limber and with perfect eyesight as we processed...... a "few" years ago!

I have a couple of sources you can check since the repo cables don't seem reliable. I have used them before but can't guarantee reasonable prices. Both of these vendors specialize in NOS parts obtained from Ford and Ford Lincoln/Mercury dealers, so they understand the value of NOS versus repo parts. Green Sales shows one and NOS Parts shows two. Not sure how often their inventory is updated but that is what is shown today. 

https://nospartsltd.com/product/d1zz9a758h/

http://www.greensalescompany.com/

If you haven't already found a cable you could contact these two sources to check the availability. If these don't pan out let me know. I have one other source that shows D1ZZ-D and H but can be a PIA to deal with and I only use as a last resort!  

The red arrows point to the brackets on the "new and improved" D1ZZ-9725-A

Second picture illustrates the grommet hole on the D3ZZ-9725-A

9725-D1ZZ-A.jpg

9725-D3ZZ-A1.jpg

Hello Steve.

Thank you so much for the very interesting reply. You're a mine of information for sure. I will check out the suppliers you mention. I'd rather pay a little extra ( a lot extra) to hopefully have something that will last my lifetime of driving. 

As mentioned before, I see it that the length of cable between the firewall bracket and the eyelet (centerline), is most important rather than overall length. Obviously the part between the cable attachment bracket to the block and the carb post, needs to be correct, but the rest of the cable is not as important. 

I would think that probably the 73 pedal may be shaped differently, hence the need for the extra length listed, 23 1/2". I wouldn't mind swapping out my earlier pedal for one with the "new and improved" stops though, might help when I mash the loud pedal as I do quite often.

Again Steve, thanks for the great information.

 

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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Hello Geoff,
Glad to help when I can. Sometimes things like the accelerator pedal and cable are not given a lot of thought since they are only a small part of the thousands of parts on a car. Sorta like the broken five-dollar bolt that grounds a multi-million dollar aircraft. Then you find out about service part replacements, running changes on the assembly line, and major changes during or close to model year change over.
Also wanted to tell you when you check the part number on the Green Sales site to not use any spaces between the prefix and suffix when entering the basic part number. Ford (and most vendor sites) used a dash, hyphen, or a comma to separate the prefix and suffix from the basic number. If not properly formatted the site will show no stock.
I would also suggest that you check with Don @ OMS if looking for an accelerator pedal with the brackets. A few years back bkdunha was looking for a replacement pedal for his immaculate '72 Mach 1 as he prepared for an MCA national show. Don had several of the three different pedals used and could also let you know if there were any size or shape differences between the '73 and earlier pedals. If Don no longer has them, Mike at Motor City Mustang could probably help you as he also has parts cars.
Please don't hesitate to contact me if you need any additional info. :classic_smile:

Steve

 

No Officer...I really don't know how fast I was going, my speedometer stopped at 140!

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7 hours ago, secluff said:

Hello Geoff,
Glad to help when I can. Sometimes things like the accelerator pedal and cable are not given a lot of thought since they are only a small part of the thousands of parts on a car. Sorta like the broken five-dollar bolt that grounds a multi-million dollar aircraft. Then you find out about service part replacements, running changes on the assembly line, and major changes during or close to model year change over.
Also wanted to tell you when you check the part number on the Green Sales site to not use any spaces between the prefix and suffix when entering the basic part number. Ford (and most vendor sites) used a dash, hyphen, or a comma to separate the prefix and suffix from the basic number. If not properly formatted the site will show no stock.
I would also suggest that you check with Don @ OMS if looking for an accelerator pedal with the brackets. A few years back bkdunha was looking for a replacement pedal for his immaculate '72 Mach 1 as he prepared for an MCA national show. Don had several of the three different pedals used and could also let you know if there were any size or shape differences between the '73 and earlier pedals. If Don no longer has them, Mike at Motor City Mustang could probably help you as he also has parts cars.
Please don't hesitate to contact me if you need any additional info. :classic_smile:

Steve, thanks so much, that's awesome help. I will for sure look into your suggestions on Monday. Funny thing is I wondered why there was not a solid stop on that pedal. Now I know Fords wonderful engineers didn't think of it at the time.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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34 minutes ago, Stanglover said:

Now I know Fords wonderful engineers didn't think of it at the time.

I'm guessing that they didn't think it was necessary, and would reduce time spent on the assembly line. With the positive stop the cable needs adjusting so the pedal hits the stop at the same time the throttle blades are fully opened.

 

 

“If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.”

--Albert Einstein

 

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11 hours ago, Don C said:

I'm guessing that they didn't think it was necessary, and would reduce time spent on the assembly line. With the positive stop the cable needs adjusting so the pedal hits the stop at the same time the throttle blades are fully opened.

Probably you're right, but obviously they added a stop on later 71/72's. An adjustable cable would have been a good idea due to stretch, but more money I guess, so not done. With a stop, the cable would have be better and "engineered" to the correct length, calculating any stretch. 

A simple way to "adjust" the cable would be to add washers (spacers) behind the firewall bracket between the bracket and firewall.

This simple cable break on the road, has turned into much more. Thanks to all for your input and knowledge.

 

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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It's amazing how "bean counters" could override engineering decisions. Due to NHTSA and lawsuits the "bean counters" wised up (somewhat) and take into consideration the possibility of litigation if they make the wrong decision (risk assessment). Customer satisfaction also has a lot to do with it. The Japanese, with their Quality Control methods and philosophy, really turned Detroit and European car manufacturers upside down.

 

 

“If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.”

--Albert Einstein

 

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1 hour ago, Don C said:

It's amazing how "bean counters" could override engineering decisions. Due to NHTSA and lawsuits the "bean counters" wised up (somewhat) and take into consideration the possibility of litigation if they make the wrong decision (risk assessment). Customer satisfaction also has a lot to do with it. The Japanese, with their Quality Control methods and philosophy, really turned Detroit and European car manufacturers upside down.

Didn't they ever!

In my years of prototyping automotive air induction systems, it was often the case where the "bean counter" got control and the engineers lost out, the result, a so-so product and often "ugly" because the esthetics side of the design suffered.

Geoff.

 I learn something new every day!

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