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building a 351c 4v on a budget!


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If you need a crank i can donate my old one to save ya a couple bucks. You pay shipping. I will check it out when i get the motor tore down. But it should be fine. i believe its cut 10-10. Only about 5000 miles Maybe??? Im going with a scat crank. May be able to donate some ARP rod and main bolts also that are in the bottom end. I believe my new kit comes with all arp fasteners so i wont need my old ones.

Kevin
1971 Mach 1

408C Stroker - C4 w/3,000 stall - 8.8" Rear w/3.73's - Disc brakes all way around.
https://youtu.be/SoW1fhaFPzY  Burn Out Video. 

 

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thats a great offer ill let you know! would a crank from a 351 2v work? i have one of those also i wanna start calling around to local machine shops to get some prices but i dont wanna sound like an idiot.

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thats a great offer ill let you know! would a crank from a 351 2v work? i have one of those also i wanna start calling around to local machine shops to get some prices but i dont wanna sound like an idiot.

 

They are all the same. 2v and 4v. Where in pa you located?

Kevin
1971 Mach 1

408C Stroker - C4 w/3,000 stall - 8.8" Rear w/3.73's - Disc brakes all way around.
https://youtu.be/SoW1fhaFPzY  Burn Out Video. 

 

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there is a small machione shop locally that the guy said he would re do each head for 250 each? 3 angle valve job and i forget what else new seatS? obviously i wanna put some higher quality valves in it for sure


Those valves will need to be replaced to be safe. Another member lost an engine recently to a set of factory ford cleveland valves :(

 

Definately replace those valves or things can get ugly fast!!!

 

1zg80g0.png


Those valves will need to be replaced to be safe. Another member lost an engine recently to a set of factory ford cleveland valves :(

 

o wow! valves are top of my list!

 

Definately replace those valves or things can get ugly fast!!!

 

1zg80g0.png

 

2jte1w.png

 

dm8i39.png

Are you planning on sleeving that cylinder with all the debri in it??? Somethings not right there!!!:s Looks like a big hole in the side of it, unless I am not seeing it correctly!!!!:dodgy:

1973 Mach 1 Q code, 4 speed toploader w/3.70 traction lock

Freshly rebuilt with boss closed chambered heads, flat top pistons, adjustable roller rockers, Erson flat tappet cam, ARP bolts thru out, 10/10 crank, port plates, edelbrock performer intake, Holley 4160 750cfm duel feed, Hooker Comp. full length headers, custom h-pipe to dual Hooker mufflers. Specs out to 415 H.P.

In the words of Ricky Bobby, " If you ain't first your last" Ha, Ha, Ha :P

 

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there is a small machione shop locally that the guy said he would re do each head for 250 each? 3 angle valve job and i forget what else new seatS? obviously i wanna put some higher quality valves in it for sure


 

Definately replace those valves or things can get ugly fast!!!

 

1zg80g0.png


 

o wow! valves are top of my list!

 

Definately replace those valves or things can get ugly fast!!!

 

1zg80g0.png

 

2jte1w.png

 

dm8i39.png

Are you planning on sleeving that cylinder with all the debri in it??? Somethings not right there!!!:s Looks like a big hole in the side of it, unless I am not seeing it correctly!!!!:dodgy:

 

I talked to the machine shop and they said they could resleeve the cylinder but i decided to just get a new block and start from scratch. I had a valve break and take out the piston, rod and cylinder wall. There is a long thread on here i posted a while ago. Decided to build 408 cleveland stroker.

Kevin
1971 Mach 1

408C Stroker - C4 w/3,000 stall - 8.8" Rear w/3.73's - Disc brakes all way around.
https://youtu.be/SoW1fhaFPzY  Burn Out Video. 

 

044.jpg

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thats a great offer ill let you know! would a crank from a 351 2v work? i have one of those also i wanna start calling around to local machine shops to get some prices but i dont wanna sound like an idiot.

 

They are all the same. 2v and 4v. Where in pa you located?

 

near allentown pa u?

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thats a great offer ill let you know! would a crank from a 351 2v work? i have one of those also i wanna start calling around to local machine shops to get some prices but i dont wanna sound like an idiot.

 

They are all the same. 2v and 4v. Where in pa you located?

 

near allentown pa u?

 

about hr north of pittsburgh

Kevin
1971 Mach 1

408C Stroker - C4 w/3,000 stall - 8.8" Rear w/3.73's - Disc brakes all way around.
https://youtu.be/SoW1fhaFPzY  Burn Out Video. 

 

044.jpg

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o nice! im going to do some reasearch around to see my expenses for getting the block checked and cleaned up as well as my rods reconditioned, what pistons are everyone using i wanna be able to run pump gas 93.

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They are all the same. 2v and 4v. Where in pa you located?

 

near allentown pa u?

 

about hr north of pittsburgh

 

Erie County?

2rr7aiv.png

 

Just cruising along minding our own business when BAM!!! The LAWS show up.

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near allentown pa u?

 

about hr north of pittsburgh

 

Erie County?

 

No, Butler county. erie is another hr and half north of me .

Kevin
1971 Mach 1

408C Stroker - C4 w/3,000 stall - 8.8" Rear w/3.73's - Disc brakes all way around.
https://youtu.be/SoW1fhaFPzY  Burn Out Video. 

 

044.jpg

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My high school (1982) '73 Grand Torino Sport had a ultra low budget drivetrain.

 

73Torino83trophy.jpg

 

I'm sure there will be nay-sayers, but the transplanted 351W in it was a lot of fun. Picked from a junkyard '72 Torino (surely it wasn't original at that), we put in a mildly lumpy hydraulic Crane cam (IIRC it was under 230* duration), a totally mismatched Offy 360* single plane (it was a cheap swap meet score), 750 vac secondary carb (waaay too big), unknown headers and stock, slushy FMX. The rest was stock... complete original cast dished piston bottom end, mildly ported closed chamber '69-70 heads with stock original valves and guides... no guideplates...

We may have put rings and bearings in, maybe. A big maybe.

Coulda been original valvesprings, been too long ago to remember.

 

I ran the crap out of that car for at least 2 years.

Everything was mismatched in the engine/trans/heavy car... it ran 15.40's with 4.11's and 26" tires, 16.40's with the 2.73's.

Valves floated at 5600 r's, even though it ran out of breath at 5100.

Didn't care.

It was fun.

The car looked friggin' awesome.

Didn't burn oil. No knocks. Never left me stranded.

IIRC, it even got some acceptable gas mileage.

 

Me? Hell yes, I'd do that again.

Certainly have become a bit more educated since 1982, so my component choices would be different. BUT... if on a SCHOOL BUDGET, and bores were "acceptable", valve guides weren't egged out, crank didn't look like a Molly Hatchet "Flirtin' With Disaster" record album... damned right I'd slap a cam and dual plane on it and fire it up!

 

The fun factor's there, man. I would, however, worry about breaking that 4 bolt block with a redneck rebuild. Source yourself another 2 bolter, and have at it.

So it might run 14.0's instead of 13.0's.... turn 5200 instead of 6500 R's... PFFFTTTTT!!!! SO WHAT???

Big spender for a cruiser?

Not me, Bub.

 

Pete

Pete - MotoArts Decals and Signs

'71 Sportsroof 351C-4V/4-speed - FINALLY under construction - no, wait, on hold again...

'90 Mustang 7-Up 5.0 ragtop, rolling beater - SOLD

'66 Sunbeam Tiger Mk.IA, survivor

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that sounds like just a all around fun ride, im more worried about how it looks and just want it to have some muscle andd sound good! as i will probaly put a blower on my 87 in the future since its built for it if i want something really quick to zip around in . the car will def turn heads when its done as far as i know in my area ive only seen one 72 mach so im looking to stand out!

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A 351 Windsor with 9.5:1 compression, Edelbrock heads, 750cfm carb and a cam: 224/232 @ .050 535/545-112 will make 400 flywheel HP. If the Cleveland heads are that much better, you should get at least that. I would go with the Edrebrock Air Gap intake over a single plane.

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Okay...here is the analogy I should have posted...

 

In my opinion, your motor is like Pam Anderson's body. It is pretty tough to get to the bottom end, so you better take care of business while it is out. But the top end is always open to poetic license.

 

And, I took the time to apologize to 87fox72mach for my rudeness. Sorry to you guys too. Your better than that.

11jmcuc.png

351C Bold Manners, Brash Attitude

Favorite Teams: Michigan Wolverines and Whoever Is Playing Ohio State.

 

When I drive past a herd of cows, the cows MOO at me

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thats a great offer ill let you know! would a crank from a 351 2v work? i have one of those also i wanna start calling around to local machine shops to get some prices but i dont wanna sound like an idiot.

 

They are all the same. 2v and 4v. Where in pa you located?

 

Cranks are the same size but

There are 4MA stamped cranks for the 4 V cars, they were suppose to be stronger

Ohio Mustang Supply

440-949-2556

 

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I have never broke a Cleveland crank. Built several for drag racing over the years and always used 2 bolt blocks and 4V open heads with pop up pistons. When I came across 4 bolt blocks or quench heads I always sold them to fund my other projects. Not needed even for racing.

 

Find a good established local machine shop and have them do a basic street rebuild on what you have (with new valves and bolts). 1500 to 2 grand and you should be ready to roll. You will have a solid 350 hp and can run all day long on the cheap stuff.

 

Craigslist "351" and you will see that there is always a complete 351 2V engine for sale locally if the machine shop finds an issue with your parts. There is a very rusty 72 351 Cougar for sale in this area for 800.00 that runs, drives, shifts, and stops. No smoke, good compression, needs a tune up and a smaller carb.

 

Our heavy "bigstangs" will not compete on the street unless you spend well over 5k - so why even try? Take the money you save and put in an agressive rear end gear and enjoy the kick in the pants feeling that you are looking for.

 

My son is building a cleveland for a 73 vert and between trading parts and keeping it basic he will have less than 900.00 bucks TOTAL in the long block. 4v heads, 4 barrel carb on a stock intake, pertronix ingnition in the stock distibutor, headers and magnaflo exhaust........

 

He should have around 3K total in the entire drivetrain front to rear and it will last for hundreds of thousands of miles.

 

He will have a polite 325hp engine that sounds wicked at idle and will be able to roast the rear tires if he thinks he can afford to.

 

Good luck on you project!

 

- Paul

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i plan on building everything myself to save some cash, heads, shortblock etc .whats a good brand of piston to use for a decent price, obvsiouly not going to using nitrous or a blower just want something reliable

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i plan on building everything myself to save some cash, heads, shortblock etc .whats a good brand of piston to use for a decent price, obvsiouly not going to using nitrous or a blower just want something reliable

 

Spend some time with calculators like this http://www.wallaceracing.com/cr_test2.php before buying pistons. Be aware of considerations such as piston compression distances, piston dish/dome volumes, chamber volumes, and how far down the piston is when it is at top dead center (deck height). Among other things, they all affect static compression ratio. Don't assume all pistons for a 351C have the same basic dimensions. Chuck

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i plan on building everything myself to save some cash, heads, shortblock etc .whats a good brand of piston to use for a decent price, obvsiouly not going to using nitrous or a blower just want something reliable

 

This is what I purchased for my build: 351C 4V closed chamber, 351CJ/Boss Build, expecting 10.5-11.0 compression: Speed Pro L2379F30 (30= .030 over) $40 each.

 

SLP-L2379F.jpg

 

I have the equivalent in a 351W with 40k miles. Very solid.


Spend some time with calculators like this http://www.wallaceracing.com/cr_test2.php before buying pistons. Be aware of considerations such as piston compression distances, piston dish/dome volumes, chamber volumes, and how far down the piston is when it is at top dead center (deck height). Among other things, they all affect static compression ratio. Don't assume all pistons for a 351C have the same basic dimensions. Chuck

 

Heres how I measure chamber volume:

 

http://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-how-i-measured-head-combustion-chamber-volume?pid=64848&highlight=chamber#pid64848

11jmcuc.png

351C Bold Manners, Brash Attitude

Favorite Teams: Michigan Wolverines and Whoever Is Playing Ohio State.

 

When I drive past a herd of cows, the cows MOO at me

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so speeed pro is a decent middle of the road brand? i would like to have the motor run off 93 gas, so a basica boss rebuild would be fine with me just want it to sound good with a good thump, and have some good street manors. since the motor is numbers mtching i would likely be using the original block and trans. i have a spare 2v motor and 2 460's which ill probably stuff in something else to make a fast car :)

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I do not know how to judge middle of the road. It is my understanding this is a good, solid replacement for the original piston. My experience with this piston type/brand in a 351W so far would attest to that. But, I really won't know for another 140k miles.

 

Do you have original pistons? They have a "button hole" in them. I am looking for a couple to add to my museum.

11jmcuc.png

351C Bold Manners, Brash Attitude

Favorite Teams: Michigan Wolverines and Whoever Is Playing Ohio State.

 

When I drive past a herd of cows, the cows MOO at me

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i plan on building everything myself to save some cash, heads, shortblock etc .whats a good brand of piston to use for a decent price, obvsiouly not going to using nitrous or a blower just want something reliable

 

This is what I purchased for my build: 351C 4V closed chamber, 351CJ/Boss Build, expecting 10.5-11.0 compression: Speed Pro L2379F30 (30= .030 over) $40 each.

 

SLP-L2379F.jpg

Same ones I bought for my build. Speed Pro, Sealed Power and federal mogul. Same part number, same pistons. I ended up with 10.2:1 Runs great on pump gas 93 octane.

 

I have the equivalent in a 351W with 40k miles. Very solid.


Spend some time with calculators like this http://www.wallaceracing.com/cr_test2.php before buying pistons. Be aware of considerations such as piston compression distances, piston dish/dome volumes, chamber volumes, and how far down the piston is when it is at top dead center (deck height). Among other things, they all affect static compression ratio. Don't assume all pistons for a 351C have the same basic dimensions. Chuck

 

Heres how I measure chamber volume:

 

http://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-how-i-measured-head-combustion-chamber-volume?pid=64848&highlight=chamber#pid64848

1973 Mach 1 Q code, 4 speed toploader w/3.70 traction lock

Freshly rebuilt with boss closed chambered heads, flat top pistons, adjustable roller rockers, Erson flat tappet cam, ARP bolts thru out, 10/10 crank, port plates, edelbrock performer intake, Holley 4160 750cfm duel feed, Hooker Comp. full length headers, custom h-pipe to dual Hooker mufflers. Specs out to 415 H.P.

In the words of Ricky Bobby, " If you ain't first your last" Ha, Ha, Ha :P

 

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  • 5 months later...

to reincarnate a dead thread i spoke to a local engine shop who i have bought three poduction motors for my cars from, i spoke with the guy about my options for a motor rebuild, i said mosly stock with a bump in the cam and 1 piece valves are a must as well as arp rod bolts. he said hed use a comp cam, sealed power pistons at maybe a .20 overbore depending on what my block needs, all machine work (valve job, block etc), balancing etc for a long block 2500-3000k does this sound reasonble? im still going to shop around but the guy was great to work with and its a big reputable shop no a redneck back ally job :)

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to reincarnate a dead thread i spoke to a local engine shop who i have bought three poduction motors for my cars from, i spoke with the guy about my options for a motor rebuild, i said mosly stock with a bump in the cam and 1 piece valves are a must as well as arp rod bolts. he said hed use a comp cam, sealed power pistons at maybe a .20 overbore depending on what my block needs, all machine work (valve job, block etc), balancing etc for a long block 2500-3000k does this sound reasonble? im still going to shop around but the guy was great to work with and its a big reputable shop no a redneck back ally job :)

 

Machine work can be expensive. Shop around for deals, they can be found. I was able to pick up a rebuilt C6 and engine for $3500.00 that was rebuilt/balanced with everything needed and never run. The person decided to sell off his project. He even provided me with the receipts for machine work etc. You can see the motor here with the specs.

http://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-bojo-s-73-project

 

Lots of the peices aren't going to be used so I will be selling them shortly, all new and in their boxes.

Here are some of the items that I remember off hand:

Demon Carb

Chromed 1 wire alternator high output

Torker Manifold that was clay extruded and black powered coated

March Pulley set

Some of the brackets that are black powered coated

and more

-john

(jbojo)

351C 4V cc heads, 10.5 : 1 CR, 290 Herbert cam, Flat top forged pistons, forged connecting rods, Atomic efi,

C6 with Gear Vendor overdrive, 3.89 Tru Trac, Hooker Super Comp with 2 1/2" Pypes Exhaust.        

 

Some Mod pictures can be seen at: [button=http://www.7173mustangs.com/forum-garage?filterxt_uid=2026]Bojo's Garage[/button]

 

 

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Any more input on whether that price for a rebuil snds fair?

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Founded:
July 2010

By:
Webfinity Design

From:
Latrobe, PA

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