Ram air and distributor issues

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Hello all, new to this forum but not forums in general.

To avoid a duplicate question, I've been doing a fair amount of reading through the topics here and can't seem to locate the answer. Chances are it was there but missed and now just need to get rolling with better weather approaching!😁

Supposedly, my '72 convertible was originally sold with a host of dealer installed goodies, one of which is ram air (above a 2bbl, Calif. car). The second and previous owner installed a Pertronix distributor and abandoned the ram air (among other things like the floor console, clock, map light and instrument cluster) . From what he said, sold it all for a ton of cash at the time. Arrggghhhh!!!!! I'd complain more but it is a California car and sitting in my garage in Virginia so that's good enough.

Unfortunately, that leaves me with a problem trying to reinstall all the Dealer goodies so for this post, my question has 2 parts;
  1. Currently, I'm continuing with it being a 2bbl Ram air so what spacer is needed to clear the disty but remain using the seal for the plenum?
  2. Down the road, I am considering a 4bbl carb/manifold combo so is there a specific rise manifold I can use that would be similar in height to the 4bbl Cleveland with Ram Air?
I'd like to stay away from spacers since it's only a driver and the dang car is squirrely enough with the 2bbl when you stand on it. Before anyone rolls their eye's or questions the hesitancy, it's been close to 50 years since I owned my '66 notch0back with the engine from a '69 Mach 1 having been installed and know my limitations.

Btw, I'm certain it was never a 4bbl car because of Calif. Emissions.

Thanks in advance for the help.
 
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In my 71 fastback I have 4V heads with a Blue Thunder manifold and Ram Air. I use a Fitech TBI which is the same height as the Holley 4bbl I had. I modified and lowered the plenum so I can even fit a 1/4" spacer. However, I am hesitant to say for sure if you can fit a BT manifold under every Ram Air because engine mounts changed for 72. I know the Pertronix does not fit under the Ram Air plenum w/o mods because I already tried. There is limited space there so you are left with standard Duraspark like distributors. Carb wise it will all depend on its height, either be 2bbl or 4bbl.
 

jdomke1

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From my recollection, ‘71 was the end of Ram Air. The hood stayed the same but the put blanks in place of the air doors. 2bbl and Ram Air seems like an oxymoron. I’ve got two ‘72s. One is a Mach 1 that I’m changing over to a Boss 351. My hood was so bad I just bought a new one from Dynacorn. I got the one with holes for the hood pins and the kit to make it a full Ram Air. Luckily few changes were made from ‘71 to ‘72. Makes changing over pretty easy. All the base components are still there in ‘72 but just missing the main stuff. I.e. those blanks and mounting points for the hood pins. I could ever see where the pins had cutouts under the hood. It would be easy to convert but rust sealed the deal. I’m anxious to get it on. The box that sucker comes in is enormous.
 

KevinP

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In my 71 fastback I have 4V heads with a Blue Thunder manifold and Ram Air. I use a Fitech TBI which is the same height as the Holley 4bbl I had. I modified and lowered the plenum so I can even fit a 1/4" spacer. However, I am hesitant to say for sure if you can fit a BT manifold under every Ram Air because engine mounts changed for 72. I know the Pertronix does not fit under the Ram Air plenum w/o mods because I already tried. There is limited space there so you are left with standard Duraspark like distributors. Carb wise it will all depend on its height, either be 2bbl or 4bbl.
Engine mounts only chawed in 73 I believe. The 73 ram air cleaner base is different to account for taller manifold with EGR plate. A lot of people say that the '73 air cleaner base fits well with a blue thunder manifold.
 

machphil

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Engine mounts only chawed in 73 I believe. The 73 ram air cleaner base is different to account for taller manifold with EGR plate. A lot of people say that the '73 air cleaner base fits well with a blue thunder manifold.
Didn't the '73 change to the captive engine mounts on the 351 like they used on the convertible?
 

Retired2014

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Ford got caught trying to certify the 4bbl w/ram air using the 2bbl emission stats and the EPA said ‘no deal’. I remember reading there were a few 4bbl w/ram that made it off the assembly line before the EPA shut that down in late 71 production of the 72 model year. You have to remember back in 72 the Feds were clamping down on emissions and strangling performance in the process. The 4300D 4bbl was designed around emissions requirements and tuning the carb to overcome those limitations was problematic. Most owners gave up on the 4300D and swapped them out. When I ordered my Mach in Nov 71, I couldn’t get the ram air with my 4bbl from the dealership so I ordered the pieces and parts from their parts department and installed my own. The air cleaner can needed to be ‘modified’ with a hammer to clear the 4300D carb body and carries those scars to this day. When you’re 19 years old in 1972, pounding dents in an air cleaner can to get it to ‘fit’ wasn’t considered sacrilegious.
 

Roland

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Ford got caught trying to certify the 4bbl w/ram air using the 2bbl emission stats and the EPA said ‘no deal’. I remember reading there were a few 4bbl w/ram that made it off the assembly line before the EPA shut that down in late 71 production of the 72 model year. You have to remember back in 72 the Feds were clamping down on emissions and strangling performance in the process. The 4300D 4bbl was designed around emissions requirements and tuning the carb to overcome those limitations was problematic. Most owners gave up on the 4300D and swapped them out. When I ordered my Mach in Nov 71, I couldn’t get the ram air with my 4bbl from the dealership so I ordered the pieces and parts from their parts department and installed my own. The air cleaner can needed to be ‘modified’ with a hammer to clear the 4300D carb body and carries those scars to this day. When you’re 19 years old in 1972, pounding dents in an air cleaner can to get it to ‘fit’ wasn’t considered sacrilegious.
I do have a 72 Q-code with original Ram Air, a gold glow, it‘s on the marti report and the build sheet
 

Hemikiller

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I do have a 72 Q-code with original Ram Air, a gold glow, it‘s on the marti report and the build sheet

Roland, can you post your report in the Marti Reports section? I'm sure everyone would like to see it.

From all my documentation, Ram Air was available from '71 through '73 on any 351 or 429, with the exception of two of the 351 engines, the '72 R-code 351HO, and the '73 Q-code 351-4v engine. I've heard/read several versions of the reason why the Ram Air 351-4V didn't make it to production in '73. The most plausible "story" was that the engineers at the test track performing the EPA certification runs deviated from the test procedure and the data for several powertrain combinations was considered unusable. Ford then decided to bin the bad data and re-run only those that made economic sense within the available timeframe, and the Q-code lost out. There is a lot of bad and confusing data on the web, much of it copy/pasted from stories in magazines and books by some prominent authors for magazines like Mustang Monthly, Modified Mustangs, etc. No matter what the real story, RamAir was available in '73 only on the H-code 351-2V.

Convertibles used a different motor mount and frame bracket than the hardtop/sportsroof for all three years, supposedly to help correct a vibration within the convertible platform. '73 used a unique captured style motor mounts and the frame brackets were changed again. The captured mount conformed to new Federal safety regulations, previous years mounts would fail and the engine/trans could be ejected in a severe crash.
 

Roland

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Roland, can you post your report in the Marti Reports section? I'm sure everyone would like to see it.

From all my documentation, Ram Air was available from '71 through '73 on any 351 or 429, with the exception of two of the 351 engines, the '72 R-code 351HO, and the '73 Q-code 351-4v engine. I've heard/read several versions of the reason why the Ram Air 351-4V didn't make it to production in '73. The most plausible "story" was that the engineers at the test track performing the EPA certification runs deviated from the test procedure and the data for several powertrain combinations was considered unusable. Ford then decided to bin the bad data and re-run only those that made economic sense within the available timeframe, and the Q-code lost out. There is a lot of bad and confusing data on the web, much of it copy/pasted from stories in magazines and books by some prominent authors for magazines like Mustang Monthly, Modified Mustangs, etc. No matter what the real story, RamAir was available in '73 only on the H-code 351-2V.

Convertibles used a different motor mount and frame bracket than the hardtop/sportsroof for all three years, supposedly to help correct a vibration within the convertible platform. '73 used a unique captured style motor mounts and the frame brackets were changed again. The captured mount conformed to new Federal safety regulations, previous years mounts would fail and the engine/trans could be ejected in a severe crash.
I‘m confused, in the Red Book for Ford Mustang the Ram Air ist not listed as an option for the 72 Q-Code Mach1? Currently I do not have the Marti Report available on my ipad to load it, sorry for that, but will instead load the original Data Sheet…
 

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Hemikiller

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Thanks, that settles it then. My assumption would be the Red Book (and many other publications) took it's data from the 1972 Ford Sales Book, which does not show a specific Ram Air option listing for the 72 Q-code engine (nor in 71), whereas it did show a specific ram air listing in 1971 for the M-code. The Q-code only had two options for axle ratios, the 3.25 and 3.50. The M-code had three, 3.00, 3.25 and 3.50, but you could not get the 3.00 with the Ram air optioned M-code, hence the need for a specific listing.




1972 power teams

1647102551433.png


1971 power teams

1647102862204.png
 
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To further confuse the issue, the 1972 Facts Book Rev 10-71 shows the ram air available on both 2V and 4V 351s on page 18, while the Rev 1-72 shows it available only on 3512Vs. This leads me to believe that the first 3 months that the 72s were sold ram air was available on 4Vs (Q codes). Maybe Roland can verify this, or not, with his build date.

Maybe an admin can post these on the Wiki? The 10-71 revision was on the old forum.
 

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Roland

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Thanks, that settles it then. My assumption would be the Red Book (and many other publications) took it's data from the 1972 Ford Sales Book, which does not show a specific Ram Air option listing for the 72 Q-code engine (nor in 71), whereas it did show a specific ram air listing in 1971 for the M-code. The Q-code only had two options for axle ratios, the 3.25 and 3.50. The M-code had three, 3.00, 3.25 and 3.50, but you could not get the 3.00 with the Ram air optioned M-code, hence the need for a specific listing.




1972 power teams

View attachment 60605


1971 power teams

View attachment 60606
following my Marti Report, just found it on my iphone
 

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Roland

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pictures showing my engine bay
 

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Sheriff41

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My 72 Q-code was built with the Ram Air Option. Build date Jan 12, 1972.
 
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Hello all, new to this forum but not forums in general.

To avoid a duplicate question, I've been doing a fair amount of reading through the topics here and can't seem to locate the answer. Chances are it was there but missed and now just need to get rolling with better weather approaching!😁

Supposedly, my '72 convertible was originally sold with a host of dealer installed goodies, one of which is ram air (above a 2bbl, Calif. car). The second and previous owner installed a Pertronix distributor and abandoned the ram air (among other things like the floor console, clock, map light and instrument cluster) . From what he said, sold it all for a ton of cash at the time. Arrggghhhh!!!!! I'd complain more but it is a California car and sitting in my garage in Virginia so that's good enough.

Unfortunately, that leaves me with a problem trying to reinstall all the Dealer goodies so for this post, my question has 2 parts;
  1. Currently, I'm continuing with it being a 2bbl Ram air so what spacer is needed to clear the disty but remain using the seal for the plenum?
  2. Down the road, I am considering a 4bbl carb/manifold combo so is there a specific rise manifold I can use that would be similar in height to the 4bbl Cleveland with Ram Air?
I'd like to stay away from spacers since it's only a driver and the dang car is squirrely enough with the 2bbl when you stand on it. Before anyone rolls their eye's or questions the hesitancy, it's been close to 50 years since I owned my '66 notch0back with the engine from a '69 Mach 1 having been installed and know my limitations.

Btw, I'm certain it was never a 4bbl car because of Calif. Emissions.

Thanks in advance for the help.
Hi - Looks like your questions kicked off a tangent, so not sure if you have the answers you need. Whether or not my response is useful depends on how much you want to maintain originality.

To address question #2, In my 71 Mach 1, I have a 351c with ram air. I have a reproduction air cleaner on top of the edelbrock 2665 intake and a QF 670 carb. I do have a 1/4 inch spacer between the carb and air cleaner to avoid scratching the paint on bottom of the air cleaner. One thing to be aware of, if you have stock 4V heads, the intake I use WILL work, but the port size is smaller on the intake, more of a match for aftermarket/aluminum heads like the trick flows.

On the street, you should not notice any difference in performance, its just not a perfect match if that is a concern for you. Not sure if this is an option, but wanted to provide something to think about.
 
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Took a while to find but the suggestion by 71coop mentioned that Pertronix had a stock replica Flame Thrower I was unbelievably helpful, Thank you! Purchased it two weeks ago and installed it last week. All under the hood now remains stock from the date of purchase except for the new distributor and the replacement ram air set-up. What an unbelievable difference between the then and now! Just working out the vacuum lines to make sure everything is as it should be. The schematics I've found in my shop manuals aren't much help. Wish I would've held on to those Chilton's I had.

One of the guy's from our car club has a shop a short distance from the house so he helped me out with the install and set timing around 12deg adv.. I've got the tools but glad I decided to ask for the help. Last distributor I installed was an Accell Dual point just about 40 years ago and I remember needing to go fishing for the oil pump shaft and wasn't going through that again!:eek:

Really just wish I had a 4spd. instead of the FMX. I believe the guy before me installed a shift kit given how stout it does shift but that 2: something rear, even though it's a 9", really doesn't do the Cleveland and ram air justice. Still dreaming of a possible upgrade to the Holley Street Avenger 500cfm 2bbl carb Actually purchased one but the profile was way too short and the spacer needed was not available at the time. Maybe now? Still dreaming about a conversion to the 4spd. and a limited slip 3:something gear but we're running out of time where I would enjoy it. Only so much life remaining in the legs. Getting old is God's way of showing his sense of humor. 😝
 
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Took a while to find but floating around out there in the numerous posts, someone mentioned Pertronix having a stock replica Flame Thrower I. Purchased it two weeks ago and installed it last week. All remains stock from the date of purchase except for the new distributor and the replacement ram air set-up. What an unbelievable difference between the then and now! Just working out the vacuum lines to make sure everything is as it should be. The schematics I've foubnd are not much help nor is the shop manuals. Wish I would've held on to those Chilton's I had.

One of the guy's from our car club has a shop a short distance from the house so he helped me out with the install and set timing around 12deg adv.. I've got the tools but glad I decided to ask for the help. Last distributor I installed was an Accell Dual point just about 40 years ago and I remember needing to go fishing for the oil pump shaft and wasn't going through that again!:eek:

Really just wish I had a 4spd. instead of the FMX. I believe the guy before me installed a shift kit given how stout it does shift but that 2: something rear, even though it's a 9", really doesn't do the Cleveland and ram air justice. Still dreaming of a possible upgrade to the Holley Street Avenger 500cfm 2bbl carb Actually purchased one but the profile was way too short and the spacer needed was not available at the time. Maybe now? Still dreaming about a conversion to the 4spd. and a limited slip 3:something gear but we're running out of time where I would enjoy it. Only so much life remaining in the legs. Getting old is God's way of showing his sense of humor. 😝
Although it's not a replacement for a stick going to a ratchet shifter can make driving fun and saves the wear and tear on the legs. I have a C6 with B&M Quick Silver and love using it when feeling frisky. :LOL:
 
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