Rookie Mistake w/brand new rotisserie

7173Mustangs.com

Help Support 7173Mustangs.com:

Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
269
Reaction score
0
Location
USA - Florida
My Car
1972 Mustang Mach 1
2011 Mustang GT
So...I could barely go to sleep last night w/out thinking about what I did to the rotisserie I just picked up a couple weeks ago.  I was so excited and after lining it up with my car I started to raise it up into position.  It was more difficult than I thought it would be to raise it but thought it's just heavy.  It raised into position (about 5 inches from it's starting point).  After the quick test fit to see how the new Mustang brackets would fit I lowered it back down.  A few minutes later I noticed that the bolt was still going through the neck of the unit...I thought to myself "well that's not good...how did it even raise up at all".  I knew right away why it seemed like there was resistance while I was jacking it up.  Well jack it up I sure did...I immediately began inspecting and saw a split along the bottom weld.  Not only did I split the weld but I'm sure I'm stretched some metal as well in the process.  Anyway...please don't beat me up too bad.  I still days later think about how much of an idiotic rookie move that was and can't believe I messed up my rotisserie.  

I figure I have two options...  Just weld it in place how it sits or heat it up to get it back completely straight and then weld.  Please chime in with thoughts.  





 
Joined
Mar 30, 2017
Messages
2,201
Reaction score
528
Location
The Netherlands
My Car
73 Grande 351C
71 Mach 1 429CJ
So you raised the car up while there was still a bolt there to prevent it moves up or down? No wonder it was heavy!

The weld next to it seams be intact. if the car went up, its likely having damage else where or there are more damages on the welds than visible on the pict.

If any fracture, you need grind deep so both part of the tubes can be welded again. Make sure you weld with lots of power, not just lay some metal, it needs to melt.

 
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
269
Reaction score
0
Location
USA - Florida
My Car
1972 Mustang Mach 1
2011 Mustang GT
So you raised the car up while there was still a bolt there to prevent it moves up or down? No wonder it was heavy!

The weld next to it seams be intact. if the car went up, its likely having damage else where or there are more damages on the welds than visible on the pict.

If any fracture, you need grind deep so both part of the tubes can be welded again. Make sure you weld with lots of power, not just lay some metal, it needs to melt.
No, I didn't actually raise the car up on it.  I was just raising the rotisserie mounts up to the front bumper mounting holes for a test fit of the Mustang brackets I purchased for the rotisserie.  So there was no load on the rotisserie...just a bolt trying to do it's job while I was using that nice 3 ton jack to rip it apart.  ::(

 
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
8,223
Reaction score
963
Location
Springfield, OR
My Car
1971 Mustang Sportroof M code
+1 on making sure you get good penetration on welding it. I would try to get it back to square. With that angle in it you would have problems trying to rotate your car. You would either bend the attachment points on the end of the car or twist it.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
269
Reaction score
0
Location
USA - Florida
My Car
1972 Mustang Mach 1
2011 Mustang GT
+1 on making sure you get good penetration on welding it. I would try to get it back to square. With that angle in it you would have problems trying to rotate your car. You would either bend the attachment points on the end of the car or twist it.
Apply heat at the seam to get it back to square?

 
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
2,013
Reaction score
69
Location
Chattanooga, TN
My Car
72 Mach 1 H-Code (Concourse)
67 GT S-Code 4sp
Applaud your honesty and request for suggestions to fix. We are all rookies at something as we go through life. Better to learn from those mistakes and go on to the next learning opportunity than to dwell on the ones we have had. Get it welded and move on.

 
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
8,223
Reaction score
963
Location
Springfield, OR
My Car
1971 Mustang Sportroof M code
You can see by the reflection in your second picture that even the lower end of the side braces are twisted. Even with heat it's going to take a fair amount of force to return it to square. While the weld on the inside edge has split the rest hasn't, so the tubing has bent. I would grind off as much of the damaged weld as possible, so it doesn't interfere with your straightening effort, as well as giving you a clean weld. You'll need to be careful that you don't bend something else when you straighten it.

I have a heavy duty come-along and heavy duty ratchet straps that that would apply enough pressure to help straighten it, but would need some thought given on attachment points and methods.

You'll also need to be sure you don't overheat and burn/damage the steel in the tubing. Do not use water to rapidly cool it, you don't want to embrittle it.

The best way to straighten metal is to apply force in the opposite direction of the bending force.

 
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
269
Reaction score
0
Location
USA - Florida
My Car
1972 Mustang Mach 1
2011 Mustang GT
You can see by the reflection in your second picture that even the lower end of the side braces are twisted. 
Yeah...I really did a number on it huh!?   :shootself:

I won't mind if it doesn't end up being perfect but I do need to get it as close to straight as possible.  I would rather do it with force as you suggested rather than heat but I'm just not sure if that can be done.

 
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
8,223
Reaction score
963
Location
Springfield, OR
My Car
1971 Mustang Sportroof M code
To try to pull it back into position would be require some heavy steel straps around the upper and lower legs the jack is connected to. I would place the upper pulling point as close to the upright post as possible and the lower one as close to the front wheel as possible, so you maximize the pulling angle. The danger of this is bending that bottom leg, instead of the upright connection. To bend like it did will have slightly stretched the steel in the bottom tube, forcing it back will require that steel to be pushed back, not an easy thing.

 
Joined
Jul 6, 2015
Messages
4,241
Reaction score
92
Location
Iowa
My Car
1973 Mustang Grande 351C 2v
This is going to be extremely difficult to get back straight without bending something else or weakening the structure. Not to mention this is going to be very dangerous, using straps and come-alongs. Think about the amount of force that will be required to being this back to straight, then think about that amount of force if a strap fails or worse yet the rest of the weld fails on the bottom creating a massive projectile. I would strongly suggest talking to a local fab shop about having them straighten and weld it up. Also, I'm not familiar with your shop set up, but do you even have points that you could anchor to in order to create the amount of force that will be needed.

 
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
269
Reaction score
0
Location
USA - Florida
My Car
1972 Mustang Mach 1
2011 Mustang GT
To try to pull it back into position would be require some heavy steel straps around the upper and lower legs the jack is connected to. I would place the upper pulling point as close to the upright post as possible and the lower one as close to the front wheel as possible, so you maximize the pulling angle. The danger of this is bending that bottom leg, instead of the upright connection. To bend like it did will have slightly stretched the steel in the bottom tube, forcing it back will require that steel to be pushed back, not an easy thing.
Yes it definitely stretched the steel in the bottom tube.  If I reach into the backside of that bottom tube and feel right where that weld separated I can feel that the steel has raised up.  That makes me think heat will be necessary to fix this rather than forcing it back down.  But I'm not completely sure on that...  Maybe it will be easier than I think.  Either way I think my first step is to pull out my square and check all areas to see what actually bent/stretched.  I can compare to the other end to see how far off it is.

Otherwise talk to a metal fab/welding shop like Jason suggested.  If people can build these things from scratch then certainly someone can fix this if I can't.

 
Joined
Mar 30, 2017
Messages
2,201
Reaction score
528
Location
The Netherlands
My Car
73 Grande 351C
71 Mach 1 429CJ
Sounds like a good safe plan, these shops have usually tubing laying around, cutting tools and guys to weld them.

As others said, it happens only to those actually doing something.

You simply got yourself a bonus story with a nice twist to tell after your car will be done! :)

 
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
8,223
Reaction score
963
Location
Springfield, OR
My Car
1971 Mustang Sportroof M code
Yeah, it's not an easy one, I tried to figure out a way to straighten it on a frame machine, or some kind of fixture for holding it so pressure could be applied.

The only other way would be to cut the top leg off completely and apply some heat and hammer to get that tubing straight. Then it would require a very good weld/welder to make sure it wasn't going to come apart when somebody is under the car.

 
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
269
Reaction score
0
Location
USA - Florida
My Car
1972 Mustang Mach 1
2011 Mustang GT
Here is the inside...right where it was forced up and split the weld you can see how it raised/pulled up on the inside of this piece as well.  I think I will take the advice of contacting the company to see if there are any options there.  Then if that doesn't go anywhere I'll probably contact a local metal fab and welding shop.  I think for something as important as a rotisserie I need to make sure this things is fixed correctly and that I can trust it when the car is up on it's side.





 

LeglessOne

Well-known member
Joined
May 23, 2018
Messages
81
Reaction score
5
Location
Adelaide
My Car
73 Mach 1 - 460
Here is the inside...right where it was forced up and split the weld you can see how it raised/pulled up on the inside of this piece as well.  I think I will take the advice of contacting the company to see if there are any options there.  Then if that doesn't go anywhere I'll probably contact a local metal fab and welding shop.  I think for something as important as a rotisserie I need to make sure this things is fixed correctly and that I can trust it when the car is up on it's side.



Easiest fix would probably be to remove all the ancillary stuff like the ram etc. Then cut the main tube off at the base where the weld has split along with the side braces - get this as close to the bottom section where the weld is as you can.

Then clean the base up and get it flat where the weld tore and where you cut the side braces off. Then cut a piece of 6 or 10mm flat bar the same width as the square tube base to go right across the bottom tube from about 20mm either side of where the braces where welded. Then stitch weld this into place. This will strengthen everything and give you good flat base to weld everything back together. You just have to shorten the braces and main post to match the height of the other end.

Hope that wasn't too confusing the way I stepped it out and you are ok with your welding skills? :) 

Shane

 
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
269
Reaction score
0
Location
USA - Florida
My Car
1972 Mustang Mach 1
2011 Mustang GT
So I just wanted to give a quick update on this. I reached out to AutoTwirler who is the manufacturer of my rotisserie. I received a call from THE OWNER of the company. Impressive. He stated that the recommended fix would be to use a come along winch to reverse the effects of my rookie mistake. Once I get it back to straight grind/clean up the affected weld a bit and re-weld. Sounds pretty simple but we'll see. I do not own a come along winch so I'm going to order one. Seems like something that could be useful in many other situations and can't be a bad thing to have laying around in the garage.

I'm so impressed that the owner himself called me and he even gave me his number in case I had anymore questions going forward. That's some grade A customer service!

 
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
8,223
Reaction score
963
Location
Springfield, OR
My Car
1971 Mustang Sportroof M code
Yes, I've had a come-along for many years, and have used it for a lot of things, from pulling a car onto a trailer to lifting heavy objects, such as pulling engines using a tripod or A-frame.

It was nice the owner called you. Let us know how it goes.

 
Top