The "lost" Boss 302 (1F02H100053) - observations + "The blue Boss 302"

[71BossPrototype]

Someone must have made a replica then (and might have been faking its originality even back then), because that blue Boss 302 prototype was turned into a Boss 351 prototype at the hands of Ford:-Kurt

Kurt, do you have any info concering the conversion of that blue Boss car? The reason I ask is because there are photos of the Boss 302 motor residing under the hood of a blue 302 car at one time, and I have an email from a Ford engineer stating that he drove the Blue car in Michigan on the proving grounds and that he believed that car was later crushed. But, I also don't remember a black spoiler on that particular car, as depicted in the photo you posted. I can see the decal changes, though. And, the exhaust cutouts are still covered in the rear valance in your posted photo ! Must be the same car?

Would be neat to track some of this info down. I keep hoping someone will have photos from the 1970 Las Vegas Show at the LV Convention Center in or around August of 1970 where my car was displayed. That was the first year the LVCC was open.

I see that Big Block MACH is from Huntington Beach, where my car was originally sold at Wilson Ford. Interesting. I'm looking for a Wilson Ford license plate frame.

 

[Big Block MACH]

Someone must have made a replica then (and might have been faking its originality even back then), because that blue Boss 302 prototype was turned into a Boss 351 prototype at the hands of Ford:-Kurt

Kurt, do you have any info concering the conversion of that blue Boss car? The reason I ask is because there are photos of the Boss 302 motor residing under the hood of a blue 302 car at one time, and I have an email from a Ford engineer stating that he drove the Blue car in Michigan on the proving grounds and that he believed that car was later crushed. But, I also don't remember a black spoiler on that particular car, as depicted in the photo you posted. I can see the decal changes, though. And, the exhaust cutouts are still covered in the rear valance in your posted photo ! Must be the same car?

Would be neat to track some of this info down. I keep hoping someone will have photos from the 1970 Las Vegas Show at the LV Convention Center in or around August of 1970 where my car was displayed. That was the first year the LVCC was open.

I see that Big Block MACH is from Huntington Beach, where my car was originally sold at Wilson Ford. Interesting. I'm looking for a Wilson Ford license plate frame.

I'll look for a Wilson Ford license plate frame at the next Long Beach swap meet in nNovember.

 

[cudak888]

Kurt, do you have any info concering the conversion of that blue Boss car? The reason I ask is because there are photos of the Boss 302 motor residing under the hood of a blue 302 car at one time, and I have an email from a Ford engineer stating that he drove the Blue car in Michigan on the proving grounds and that he believed that car was later crushed. But, I also don't remember a black spoiler on that particular car, as depicted in the photo you posted. I can see the decal changes, though. And, the exhaust cutouts are still covered in the rear valance in your posted photo ! Must be the same car?

It's very likely that the under-hood shot is of the same car. Given that the only two cars ever seen wearing "BOSS 302" markings are the yellow and blue cars, these two are pretty much all we have to work with - and the NACA hood w/Ram Air is only present on the blue car:

Incidentally - note that it has a 3-core radiator for a 351C in it. Not that it means anything at the moment, but it stuck out - the F-code 302's use two-core radiators.

My guess is that it was crushed, seeing as those plated out cutouts scream "engineering prototype," along with the fact that no others are in the Marti database. FYI - the blue car is also the Boss 351 that was tested by Car & Driver; pre-prepped with headers and other performance goodies (by a fellow hired by Ford who did this for most of their cars - forgot his name). C&D's whole article is essentially a review of this specific car.

Would be neat to track some of this info down. I keep hoping someone will have photos from the 1970 Las Vegas Show at the LV Convention Center in or around August of 1970 where my car was displayed. That was the first year the LVCC was open.
I see that Big Block MACH is from Huntington Beach, where my car was originally sold at Wilson Ford. Interesting. I'm looking for a Wilson Ford license plate frame.

I'm equally curious about the same show, as Michael Alameda's 429 car (the one that claims it's from DAF, but is actually from this show) should have been present as well.

-Kurt

 

[71BossPrototype]

I'll look for a Wilson Ford license plate frame at the next Long Beach swap meet in nNovember.

That would be great ! Please let me know what you find. Thanks!

FYI - the blue car is also the Boss 351 that was tested by Car & Driver; pre-prepped with headers and other performance goodies (by a fellow hired by Ford who did this for most of their cars - forgot his name). C&D's whole article is essentially a review of this specific car.

-Kurt

Interesting. The Ford engineer that emailed me about the blue car at the Ford proving grounds in Michigan said that Ford usually had to destroy this type of "plant" or "non-regular production" car as it would not have standard safety features and usually used thinner gauge metal for the body stampings. I suppose that would make for a pretty quick e.t. when the press tested it too. Somewhere along the line I was also told that these engineering cars did not usually have a standard VIN and used an "S" number of some kind.

 

[69hurstsc]

New to the board and what a fun read this thread has been. I haven't seen this photo posted of the Blue car so I thought I would share.

 

[Boss1Ray]

This pic shows the pre-production Boss 351 at a early press release photo shoot.

Interesting pic of the Boss. The wheels look to be the non-chrome magnums similar to those on the 69 Boss 302's and of course the flat hood!



Ray

 

[Carolina_Mountain_Mustangs]

Interesting thread I read since it just came up again. One of the comments that the Ford engineer said the early cars were made with thinner material would be a stretch. Having working in the automotive stamping business for many years if you put thinner material into a draw die the parts will come out looking like crap, loose wavy and not stretched properly. It would take weeks to re spot all the dies to make the thinner parts then re spot to go to regular so I doubt that statement.

There were times that we quoted going to a thinner thickness to reduce cost for Ford and that included all the re spotting time of the dies, it was not free.

The only Ford vehicle that I do know that used two different thickness of metal was the F series of pickups before the new designs hit. The old box styles the F150 used thinner material than the F-250 HD. We were asked to do the run out of production on the bed sides at model change and when I went to view the tooling running they had the F-150 material in and there were areas of loose metal or waves. I ask the Ford engineer if that was acceptable and he told me that the F-250 HD model used thicker metal and they could not get the thinner metal to look as good.

When you quote a job to anyone, not just Ford, you quote the material usage to the nominal material thickness and then order your material to the minimum. A few thousandths of an inch over the area of the panel for thousands of panels adds up. They eventually started to come in when you started production and did an actual weight of the blank and wanted money back. You just could not make a buck.

There are always several prototype cars out there during early testing. I have seen all aluminum Taurus sedans in the 1990's that never made it to market. [/align]

David

 

[71BossPrototype]

David, I just saw your post concerning the stamping process. Very interesting info. It's always great to get information from somebody in the business who has hands-on experience. Your post also reminded me of the nineteen-thirty-four (?), Fords that were stamped in stainless steel. Given the extra hardness of the stainless-steel, I bet that was a real trick for the press operators! I don't know if you read Muscle Car Review these days, but they have a running discussion about so-called pilot cars. Multiple persons have written articles about their personal experiences in the Chevy Camaro manufacturing process back in the late sixties. Very interesting stuff. Thanks again for sharing your knowledge.

Also, re: Boss1Ray, thanks for posting the above photo. That is really a clear copy that I had not seen before. Sure looks like mine..... we need VIN numbers for these vehicles. Thanks again.