Well optioned 1973 Marti says has rear window defogger.

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Here is link to eBay auction for a 1973 Q 4 speed vert that is well optioned. He does mislead buyers by say CJ or Cobra Jet and it has 72 air cleaner and has obviously been painted. They did not black out the lower half for the Decor Group option. I also believe the NASA hood is part of the Q code engine package  and should have hood but no locks or black out.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1973-Ford-Mustang-Convertible-/162687578120?hash=item25e0ef7008:g:EtoAAOSwM0FZylgR&vxp=mtr

I would suggest that it be inspected closely since the owner does not know these cars I bet it is very rusty and hidden.

The rear window defogger puzzles me never seen one on vert did not know it was ever offered either.  The cover letter does not have the defogger but the Marti does.

http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/sxEAAOSw401Zylgq/s-l1600.jpg[/img]

http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/mMMAAOSwLaBZylim/s-l1600.jpg[/img]

 

jeff8877

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Interesting car David...

Pretty sure the rear window defogger is an error.

Ad says car has 30k miles but looks pretty rough for that, bet it's 130k. Still very desirable car for someone looking to do a restoration, the list of options is pretty amazing.

 

secluff

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David, agree while this could be a bargain buy, I believe the present owner is a little off claiming a 30,000 mile untouched original car. A painted 72 Air cleaner with the chrome lid and early CJ decal are not OE for 73. As you also noticed, the missing lower accent color for the décor group also indicates a repaint.

On non Mach 1 applications, the NASA hood included with the Q engine option was a 72 only offering. There was no rear defroster/defogger option for the verts. Since this car has the convenience group option, the missing piece next to the top switch is the park Brake warning lamp bezel. (Good luck on that one)!

Not trying to slam Marti's reports, I'm very grateful that we have access to such information that the GM and Mopar folks only wished they had. But they are also not cheap and therefore the info on those reports should be infallible. If the information was the same on both reports then I would assume the info from Ford was incorrect. But you noticed that the Deluxe report shows the defroster option and the standard does not. I have several Deluxe reports on my cars, two which indicate both my 71 Mach 1's have bumper guards, which they don't and were NOT options on the 71-72 Mach 1's.

Does the window sticker on your 73 indicate 351 4bl or CJ? On my 5/12/72 built 72 Gran Torino the window sticker proclaimed 351 Cobra Jet while the air cleaner decal had "351 4BL".   :)

 

Bill73Ragtop

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I just asked the seller where I could personally inspect the car since it says it's located in Buffalo, NY (which is my backyard). If I get a positive response, I'll check it out and post some pics.

Post addendum: seller has contacted me (that was fast) and I am working on a visit to check it out tomorrow.

 
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On my window sticker it just says "351 CID 4V 8 Cylinder" and cost $107. I am pretty sure Ford dropped the CJ off the air cleaner and off all paperwork sometime in the 1972 model run on mustang. The 72 Q vert I have does say CJ on the Marti.

Be interesting to get a first hand report from a Forum member on this one. It was always a northern car so I think it will have rust but I did not see any on the fender aprons but pic not that great either. When I see pictures made on a roll back or trailer I know it is someone flipping cars or trying to.

 

Bill73Ragtop

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Just talked with the seller and have made arrangements to see it tomorrow morning. He's puzzled as to why the bids are not higher. Although I am not particularly looking for another project, I would regret not checking this out since its in my backyard and has some interesting option features. I'll post my pics and observations after I check it out.

if there are any items anyone wants looked at, let me know.

 
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Just talked with the seller and have made arrangements to see it tomorrow morning.  He's puzzled as to why the bids are not higher.  Although I am not particularly looking for another project, I would regret not checking this out since its in my backyard and has some interesting option features.   I'll post my pics and observations after I check it out.

if there are any items anyone wants looked at, let me know.
I was just back looking at the ad again and he has added some more verbage. He says the reserve is $6,300 and he still says has not been restored. So it will sell. I think it has been painted looks like paint on the bolt heads under the hood. Look for paint on trim, hood hinges, door rubber etc. In the trunk look at the drop off on each side and the wheel house. Look around the tail lights for repair for rust at the gaskets.

The front bumper has also been painted should have black out in the recess under the grill. The Mach 1 grill is correct for a Decor Group car and the black on the headlight trim rings is also correct.

The air cleaner is not a 73 should have the cold air hook up flex hose stapled to the snorkel and going to the plastic air box that connects to the radiator support. Look for rust under hood on the shock towers where they go under the fenders. Maybe pop out the grills in the cowl and take picture inside of the vent going into the car. Since Air car only vent on passenger side.

As a point of reference I paid $7,200 for a 73 with Decor group, tilt, air, PDB, gauges, woven interior, Convenience Group and had the fancy wheel covers like mags. and also came with non factory wheels and new tires and new top in box. Mine is automatic H code. My car did have about 80% original Ford paint and 100% original interior except for carpet.

If this car is not rusty and floors are solid and the current paint is pretty good I would say $8,000 would be a great buy. You could spray the black out back on the bottom of the car and it will look much better. Take a rubber refrigerator magnet with you to search for body filler.

I do not know of a Delete option for the black out for the Decor Group but if there was it would show up on the build sheet that he says is under the back seat. It would also have a 6 digit DSO code if it had any non factory adds or deletes. They show up under the main part of the build sheet and special instructions are typed in by the computer to show any ads or deletes that are not standard options.

I have too many now so I will take another pill and keep my finger off the enter button on ebay, lol. If you bid just decide what you are willing to go for at max and I usually bid with 3 seconds left on their clock and have got a couple cars that way. Someone else may have entered a higher bid just like you can get it anyway.

I did look at the current bidders and a couple of them are serious. Some are just joke bidders with retractions in last 6 months. Still almost 4 days left on the auction. He keeps saying something about going to help hurricane victims. Might be a carpenter or builder don't know. He did not answer my inquiry through eBay from a couple days ago.

This car is much more desirable as far a how it is optioned.

 

Bill73Ragtop

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Just talked with the seller and have made arrangements to see it tomorrow morning.  He's puzzled as to why the bids are not higher.  Although I am not particularly looking for another project, I would regret not checking this out since its in my backyard and has some interesting option features.   I'll post my pics and observations after I check it out.

if there are any items anyone wants looked at, let me know.
I was just back looking at the ad again and he has added some more verbage. He says the reserve is $6,300 and he still says has not been restored. So it will sell. I think it has been painted looks like paint on the bolt heads under the hood. Look for paint on trim, hood hinges, door rubber etc. In the trunk look at the drop off on each side and the wheel house. Look around the tail lights for repair for rust at the gaskets.

The front bumper has also been painted should have black out in the recess under the grill. The Mach 1 grill is correct for a Decor Group car and the black on the headlight trim rings is also correct.

The air cleaner is not a 73 should have the cold air hook up flex hose stapled to the snorkel and going to the plastic air box that connects to the radiator support. Look for rust under hood on the shock towers where they go under the fenders. Maybe pop out the grills in the cowl and take picture inside of the vent going into the car. Since Air car only vent on passenger side.

As a point of reference I paid $7,200 for a 73 with Decor group, tilt, air, PDB, gauges, woven interior, Convenience Group and had the fancy wheel covers like mags. and also came with non factory wheels and new tires and new top in box. Mine is automatic H code. My car did have about 80% original Ford paint and 100% original interior except for carpet.

If this car is not rusty and floors are solid and the current paint is pretty good I would say $8,000 would be a great buy. You could spray the black out back on the bottom of the car and it will look much better. Take a rubber refrigerator magnet with you to search for body filler.

I do not know of a Delete option for the black out for the Decor Group but if there was it would show up on the build sheet that he says is under the back seat. It would also have a 6 digit DSO code if it had any non factory adds or deletes. They show up under the main part of the build sheet and special instructions are typed in by the computer to show any ads or deletes that are not standard options.

I have too many now so I will take another pill and keep my finger off the enter button on ebay, lol. If you bid just decide what you are willing to go for at max and I usually bid with 3 seconds left on their clock and have got a couple cars that way. Someone else may have entered a higher bid just like you can get it anyway.

I did look at the current bidders and a couple of them are serious. Some are just joke bidders with retractions in last 6 months. Still almost 4 days left on the auction. He keeps saying something about going to help hurricane victims. Might be a carpenter or builder don't know. He did not answer my inquiry through eBay from a couple days ago.

This car is much more desirable as far a how it is optioned.
Thanks David.  I printed out your notes to take along.

 
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Pastel Blue

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David, agree while this could be a bargain buy, I believe the present owner is a little off claiming a 30,000 mile untouched original car. A painted 72 Air cleaner with the chrome lid and early CJ decal are not OE for 73. As you also noticed, the missing lower accent color for the décor group also indicates a repaint.

On non Mach 1 applications, the NASA hood included with the Q engine option was a 72 only offering. There was no rear defroster/defogger option for the verts. Since this car has the convenience group option, the missing piece next to the top switch is the park Brake warning lamp bezel. (Good luck on that one)!

Not trying to slam Marti's reports, I'm very grateful that we have access to such information that the GM and Mopar folks only wished they had. But they are also not cheap and therefore the info on those reports should be infallible. If the information was the same on both reports then I would assume the info from Ford was incorrect. But you noticed that the Deluxe report shows the defroster option and the standard does not. I have several Deluxe reports on my cars, two which indicate both my 71 Mach 1's have bumper guards, which they don't and were NOT options on the 71-72 Mach 1's.

Does the window sticker on your 73 indicate 351 4bl or CJ? On my 5/12/72 built 72 Gran Torino the window sticker proclaimed 351 Cobra Jet while the air cleaner decal had "351 4BL".   :)
I went through this bumper guard issue on my Pastel Blue vert also. The deluxe Marti report shows them, but the Eminger Report does not... No evidence of them ever being installed on the original bumpers... I actually discussed this with Kevin at the recent Mid-Michigan car show at the Ford HQ in August. Initally he said that the Deluxe report was gospel and that the Eminger report could be wrong. In the end, he wanted me to send him an e-mail with the info so he could look at it. I guess I should do this soon. I have found other cars in the same situation, so my guess is that for some unkown reason, the Marti-Reports are having these show up as an option, but may not be accurate. Would love to get to the bottom of this...

 
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Pastel Blue

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Just talked with the seller and have made arrangements to see it tomorrow morning.  He's puzzled as to why the bids are not higher.  Although I am not particularly looking for another project, I would regret not checking this out since its in my backyard and has some interesting option features.   I'll post my pics and observations after I check it out.

if there are any items anyone wants looked at, let me know.
I thought about it...

 
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The reason nobody is bidding is serious buyers do not bid until the end last few seconds. He also did a very lousy presentation of the car. You should never take the pictures on a roll back or in a cluttered setting. Should be in nice well lit outside with nice background setting with lots of pictures showing the details. Yes you have to pay for more pictures but it is much more impressive. Look at all the overpriced USED Mustangs the high dollar classic car places have on there with video and 75 pictures of a rattle can restored mustang wanting $35,000 for it. They call them restored when all they did was polish it a sprayed the bottom of the car black.

Bad pictures scare me off. Last two I bought off of Ebay I had over 70 emails with the PO getting more pictures and pictures of things I wanted to see. The one special order with six digit DSO he did not even have a picture of the door sticker. I requested one and he was puzzled as to why. When I saw the 6 Digit DSO I knew it was real but no other bidders knew that.

Good clear pics of the car puts the bidder at ease. The pictures do lie for sure and you should always do an in person review before you close the deal.

The white car if not rusty is a great one to get if it is real.

 

computercarguy

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But you noticed that the Deluxe report shows the defroster option and the standard does not. I have several Deluxe reports on my cars, two which indicate both my 71 Mach 1's have bumper guards, which they don't and were NOT options on the 71-72 Mach 1's.
I went through this bumper guard issue on my Pastel Blue vert also. The deluxe Marti report shows them, but the Eminger Report does not... No evidence of them ever being installed on the original bumpers... I actually discussed this with Kevin at the recent Mid-Michigan car show at the Ford HQ in August. Initally he said that the Deluxe report was gospel and that the Eminger report could be wrong. In the end, he wanted me to send him an e-mail with the info so he could look at it. I guess I should do this soon. I have found other cars in the same situation, so my guess is that for some unkown reason, the Marti-Reports are having these show up as an option, but may not be accurate. Would love to get to the bottom of this...
Add my father's Boss to the list of Marti reports listing bumper guards that don't exist.

 

OLE PONY

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secluff

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Ken, I remember our conversation on your bumper guards. As I posted earlier, Marti does a great job of providing us with info in his reports that the GM and Mopar owners only wished they had access to. But at the same time they are not free or inexpensive, and I would expect more accuracy for the money. I feel he got it backwards when he told you the Marti reports were Gospel and the Eminger reports could be in error. The Standard, Deluxe, and Elite reports are his fabrications and not Ford's. The Eminger report is the actual invoice that was used by Ford to bill the dealer. They listed all the major standard equipment and ordered options. Retail, dealer cost, shipping, holdback, X Y Z D purchase plan prices, shipping, and several other category's were included. It enabled the Dealer to get the vehicle inventoried and into their accounting system. I have also seen some of them with the FA and FB key codes. So to me, the Eminger report is the one that I would consider the "Gospel" report. :)

 

Bill73Ragtop

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Thought I would pass along my observations after looking over the car for about 2 hrs.   First, I believe the seller is trying to be fair with his description of the car, but he is not very knowledgeable about 71-73 mustangs as many on this forum may be, and he was not very happy as I found quite a bit of buried rust that he was not initially aware of.   He mentioned he was going to update the Ebay description with information gleaned from my inspection.  We will see.  He was not angry with my observations, more resigned to not having the jewel he thought he had.  

I walked away from it.   Way too much rust for my liking.  Teflon magnet revealed both rear quarters with extensive bondo and the trunk drop-offs where gone with patch panels covering over original sections that were only 20% intact on the inside.  Floor pan underside has a thick layer of undercoating over some rough metal with rust showing at all seams.  All door, trunk and hood seam edges showed rust coming thru.  Cowl is rusty (see pic).  Buck tag is gone.  Car was poorly re-sprayed and is missing quite a few of the smaller trim items.  Lots of bondo inside door openings all the way around.  I did not bother with starting it or driving it since I knew within 10 minutes I was not going to make an offer on it.  Surprisingly, there was not an extensive amount of oil on the engine.  The convertible top appeared to be relatively new (no wear on it in corners, it fit well).  Weather stripping appeared to be original and very worn.  Doors closed well (no sag).  Current Magnum 500's are nothing special and original sport covers long gone (no spare tire or jack assembly)

Here's the strange aspect.  The seats and interior appear original (as does spark plug wires and other odds and ends) but do not show the wear I would expect with 130K miles.  It appears to be a rough 30K car with lots of rust problems.  Title is clean (he purchased the car from elderly couple in Lewiston, NY (in the WNY region). Lots of original paperwork in a folder with the car.   He told me what he paid for it and I expect he is going to take a beating on the Ebay sale.  Power windows all work, solenoids inside seats for latches still work.  There is no question that it's a true highly optioned Q-code, but to restore it back to very nice condition is going to take some serious body & paint work.  Engine, drive train and suspension are intact, but would need complete refurbishment to bring it back to pristine condition.  I'm not sure today's market would support as much work it would take to bring it back to top condition.

Here are some pics which will tell you much of the story on this one.  Apologies for the poor focus quality of a few pics -- I could not review them at the time I took them.  

EGR spacer is still on engine, but 4300D is gone and replaced with Holley. 







Trunk floor is covered with a thick coat of sloppy gummy spray paint that appears to be an attempt to replicate

'splatter' finish.







Below is out of focus but you can make out the rust on the inside of the front fenders...







https://ibb.co/hU92Ow[/URL]

https://ibb.co/hU92Owonline safety pics

https://ibb.co/hU92Ow 

https://ibb.co/hU92Ow


 
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I figured it would be rusty with the lack of pictures in places where rust shows. I would love to have the accessory rear antenna. My car has hole for it but somebody removed it and put one in fender.

So with the rust it is really a parts car they just are not worth fixing them.

Thanks for the report back.

 
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Pastel Blue

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Ken, I remember our conversation on your bumper guards. As I posted earlier, Marti does a great job of providing us with info in his reports that the GM and Mopar owners only wished they had access to. But at the same time they are not free or inexpensive, and I would expect more accuracy for the money. I feel he got it backwards when he told you the Marti reports were Gospel and the Eminger reports could be in error. The Standard, Deluxe, and Elite reports are his fabrications and not Ford's. The Eminger report is the actual invoice that was used by Ford to bill the dealer. They listed all the major standard equipment and ordered options. Retail, dealer cost, shipping, holdback, X Y Z D purchase plan prices, shipping, and several other category's were included. It enabled the Dealer to get the vehicle inventoried and into their accounting system. I have also seen some of them with the FA and FB key codes. So to me, the Eminger report is the one that I would consider the "Gospel" report. :)
Exactly! I will always go by the Eminger report first, before other documents of this nature... My goal is to have both documents showing the same information, which they should be when you purchase them... I was quite surprised by his comment, but not binge totally conversant with the actual Ford information he has access to, I want to see what his response is when I send him my evidence... I give him credit for looking at the information to see where we stand... I think he provides a good honest service to the hobby, but like anything, there can be anomalies...

 
P

Pastel Blue

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Thought I would pass along my observations after looking over the car for about 2 hrs.   First, I believe the seller is trying to be fair with his description of the car, but he is not very knowledgeable about 71-73 mustangs as many on this forum may be, and he was not very happy as I found quite a bit of buried rust that he was not initially aware of.   He mentioned he was going to update the Ebay description with information gleaned from my inspection.  We will see.  He was not angry with my observations, more resigned to not having the jewel he thought he had.  

I walked away from it.   Way too much rust for my liking.  Teflon magnet revealed both rear quarters with extensive bondo and the trunk drop-offs where gone with patch panels covering over original sections that were only 20% intact on the inside.  Floor pan underside has a thick layer of undercoating over some rough metal with rust showing at all seams.  All door, trunk and hood seam edges showed rust coming thru.  Cowl is rusty (see pic).  Buck tag is gone.  Car was poorly re-sprayed and is missing quite a few of the smaller trim items.  Lots of bondo inside door openings all the way around.  I did not bother with starting it or driving it since I knew within 10 minutes I was not going to make an offer on it.  Surprisingly, there was not an extensive amount of oil on the engine.  The convertible top appeared to be relatively new (no wear on it in corners, it fit well).  Weather stripping appeared to be original and very worn.  Doors closed well (no sag).  Current Magnum 500's are nothing special and original sport covers long gone (no spare tire or jack assembly)

Here's the strange aspect.  The seats and interior appear original (as does spark plug wires and other odds and ends) but do not show the wear I would expect with 130K miles.  It appears to be a rough 30K car with lots of rust problems.  Title is clean (he purchased the car from elderly couple in Lewiston, NY (in the WNY region). Lots of original paperwork in a folder with the car.   He told me what he paid for it and I expect he is going to take a beating on the Ebay sale.  Power windows all work, solenoids inside seats for latches still work.  There is no question that it's a true highly optioned Q-code, but to restore it back to very nice condition is going to take some serious body & paint work.  Engine, drive train and suspension are intact, but would need complete refurbishment to bring it back to pristine condition.  I'm not sure today's market would support as much work it would take to bring it back to top condition.

Here are some pics which will tell you much of the story on this one.  Apologies for the poor focus quality of a few pics -- I could not review them at the time I took them.  

EGR spacer is still on engine, but 4300D is gone and replaced with Holley. 







Trunk floor is covered with a thick coat of sloppy gummy spray paint that appears to be an attempt to replicate

'splatter' finish.







Below is out of focus but you can make out the rust on the inside of the front fenders...







https://ibb.co/hU92Ow[/URL]

https://imgbb.com/online safety pics

 


yes, definitely needs a total restore. For the money, it is not a bad start but, one would have to be dedicated to completely tearing this car down and investing many hours and $$$. Ask me how I know (minus the rust...). Good job Bill on this visit. You have a nice vert already!



 
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