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I read Mustang Monthly on occasion and was a previous subscriber. There comes a point where the reader has read everything that they are interested in and then the subject matter has to change. Personally I could care less about paint codes, which wheels are correct for a particular year, and whether or not my air cleaner housing is correct.
I totally agree, and I'm right there with ya, regarding concours requirements (although I agree it's important to have that information around and readily available, just the same).

Some subjects that I would like to see covered in depth that cover all older mustangs include: 3G alternator conversions, 1 wire alternator conversions, high torque mini starters and wiring conversion, which factory gear reduction starters interchange, battery relocation. Tech articles that would help lots of readers would be to fully explain what a vacuum gauge is capable of, how to use a multimeter properly, basic electrical repair i.e the proper way to solder, crimp, size wires make repairs to fusible links etc.
They covered pretty much everything you mentioned within the past 4.5 years... and covered it... and covered it again. It like you said in your first comment about the subject matter needing to change - when you recycle the same or very similar topics in multiple issues within the same calendar year, it's time to find some new material.

I started reading car mags when I was 13-my father wasn't interested in cars and did not teach me the skill set I needed for even basic work.

The internet did not exist. I learned some things from my older brother, but Hot Rod and later Car Craft gave me enough information to go find sources to support my interest and desire. (Keeping a beat up old heap running so I would have a car helped too!)

I doubt anyone is going to like every article or every feature vehicle, but what I have found is that I am drawn to the vehicle builds that are within the abilities and budgets of the average enthusiast. They need not be perfect, just interesting.
I didn't have a father or a car growing up, but that didn't stop me from reading the mags and learning as much about cars as I could (and could actually be learned reading magazines).

 
I am fully aware of CAFE standards, as well as a host of other standards. But NONE of the standards has EVER been about specifically reducing power or performance. The manufacturers have only been required to meet safety, emission and economy standards. How they engineer those achievements into thier product was solely up to them.

Another area that people always seem to get wrong is catlytic converters. They were NEVER a mandatory item on any vehicle, and they still aren't. They were (and still are) just the only financially and technologically best solution available to meet the current standards. If they regs could have ben satisfied in another cheaper, less intrusive manner, they surely would have done so.

So, yes...the stifling regs did serve to hurt performance as a consequence of meeting those regs, but limiting performance itself was never one of its goals...just an unavoidable circumstance.

 
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I’m interested in seeing the ’73 build that Mr. Kinnan mentioned in his post. I actually feel that readers may even be interested in feature articles that highlight Mustangs that are ‘in the works’. As we all know, not everyone has, or can afford, a fully restored classic Mustang. I’d be just as interested to read about a ’10-footer’ F-code with an eye toward performance as I would an all original, restored Q-code. (How innovative would it be to do a centerfold article featuring a hopped-up Mustang sporting deep dish Cragars and primer?)

Rob sounds eager and energetic about the future of Mustang Monthly, and that is a good thing. I can remember, as a young man, spotting a maroon ’73 fastback in a parking lot at Ft. McClellan and thinking to myself that it was the most intimidating musclecar I had ever seen in person. I decided right there that bodystyle was the Mustang for me! I vividly remember grabbing my copy of Mustang Monthly at the post shopette. I wanted to learn everything I could about the car. Several months later, I had a 1971 M-code Mach 1 sitting in our garage. It was rusty, had no engine and no interior, but I didn’t care….I had my Mustang and I couldn’t wait to start working on it.

Over the years I’ve enjoyed articles about classic Mustangs, and naturally I quickly read those featuring ‘71-‘73s; but the more articles I read, the more I noticed a trend of criticism about our Mustangs. It seemed as if most articles (and not just in magazines) made negative reference to the car in some way, shape, or form. Now, I realize that the ’71 design was quite a contrast to the original ‘1964 ½, but that doesn't make it inferior.

I feel 1971 was an innovative evolution in design as bigger engines and performance became a focus with the Mustang.

It’s easy to write a good review about a Boss 351 or 429CJ, based on their performance alone, but I believe it should come just as easy to do the same for a 351-equipped Mach 1, or even a ‘plain-jane’ 302 coupe. Our cars do offer more than just their powertrains; they had features, personality, and image like no Mustang before.

It would be a breath of fresh air, I think, to read write-ups on ’71-’73s that pay homage and respect to these cars…..without the need for ‘caveat’.

C.

 
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With respect to our cars, didn't CAFE imposed mileage start in 1978? Prior to that there was a period where a vehicle's mileage was listed in the window of new cars nothing was required as far as what the number was IIRC.

 
Hey KIt

in reference to your comment of our "big body cars" not answering the public needs:

1970

Model Wheelbase Overall Length

108 in 187.4 in

curb weight 3227

Height 50.5"

WOOOooooooo WE you got us there!

Why do you not refer to THAT as a big body car? what you didnt want to jump on the fanfair with popular comments by media? I agree its easier to SOUND RIGHT to repeat social mantra...but facts play out and numbers dont lie. guess what car that is!

 
Not exactly sure what you mean, but the conversation was only about 71-73s. Nobody ever said the 69-70s were particularly small...they weren't. But the fact is that that 71-73s were bigger in nearly every dimension than any Mustang that had come before. It grew in one direction, the market moved in another.

The typical trend in Detroit then was that all cars would naturally grow as they "matured". The Mustang was no different in that respect.

It is well known that Iacocca did not agree with that thinking. He hated the HF-II demanded "enlargement' of the 67-68s..he called them a "fat pig"! That is why he rallied so hard for the smaller "Mustang II". That car was definitelty his baby, maybe even more of his influence in it than the original 65'.

He had been lobbying HF-II for several years about "downsizing" the entire Ford line, well aware of the coming onslaught of small foreign imports and the effect they were going to have. He was very prescient in that particular regard.

HF-II would have none of it. He felt if there was to be a smaller car, it would be a new model, not a smaller version of an existing model. The Maverick in '69 was Iacocca's first half-hearted attempt to recapture what he saw as the Mustang's true personality...a small economical sporty car...not the fire-breathing beheamoth it had become. It was very succesfull.

The Thunderbid had become fat and lazy by '72, a hulking psuedo-Lincoln and light-years away from everything the "Thunderbird' had originally been designed as. Its sales peaked at 92,500 in 1960 and had plummeted to 36,000 by 1971.

In '72 it began its 5-year run as a virtual clone of the Lincoln Mark series and sales styed low.

Iacocca pushed for downsizing, Henry Ford II refused saying "America likes big cars". Somehow, Iacocca put the plans in motion for a new, smaller & lighter,and importantly: cheaper Thunderbird for 1977 without HF II really understanding what was happening. (That doesn't make sense to me...)

The new smaller 1977 Thunderbird was a SMASH hit! it sold 320,000 units in ONE YEAR! That is more than a 700% increase over the previous year.

And it is more than 400% higher than any single previous year of Thunderbird.

That generation ran for 3 years: 77-79. production for that 3-year run was over 955,000 units. That is more sales than the previous 16 YEARS combined!

But...the success of the car was Iacocca's downfall. He was celebrated as the mover and shaker at Ford...and HF II did not like anyone having the spotlight. It was shocking at the time, but on the ev of the greatest sales sucess and turnaround of any nameplate in history, HF II fired iacocca, the man responsible for making it happen.

GM downsized thier entire line in 77...and slaughtered Ford in the process until finally HF II gave in and allowed the downsizing, but it took until 1980 to begin, and until 83 or so for it to take full effect of the entire line. Millions of sales were lost to GM.

So, whats the point?

The Mustang did indeed grow every generation, just like every car did back then. The 71-73s would probably would not be so poorly remembered if the market hadn't taken such a swift and dramatic turn in a new direction.

Camaro and Firebird sales had fallen off so much that they were both cancelled in 1971. If not for a couple of very vocal and aggresive GM insiders who lobbied endlessly to keep them going, they would surely have ended there. Herb Adams was one...he is one of the great auto engineers that doesn't get much mention. John Schinella was head of one of GMs design divison...he loved those cars. And of course there is Bill Mitchell, famed Corvette guy...maybe second only to Zora himself.

History likes to paint Ford Motor as a doofus company for selling the "wrong" Mustang in 71-73. But there is no way they could have forseen any of this in 67-68, when the car was being designed and planned. The design of the car is a logical and expected result of what would have naturally been predicted back in 68. They just designed what they thought peoiple were going to want.

And they all got caught: Chrysler dumped its Cuda/ Challenger twins after dismal sales form 71-74, the Camaro-Bird barely survived, and everything else died: No more Javelins or AMXs,no more small-ish Chevelles, Skylarks, Regals or Cutlasses.

The only pony car that really survived unscathed was the only pony car to begin with: the Mustang.

Personally I don't think of the 71-73s as "too big", not by a long shot. I think of them as "just right". But...I do think of previous generations of Mustang as too small! Cramped, poor handling and rough-riding, thats my own opinion of 65-70 Mustangs, as compared to our 71-73s.

But, I am also a pretty big guy: 6'3", about 280 lbs. I was well over 230 in my youth when I first got the car, so I need a bigger Mustang!

Its funny, most people remember the last Torinos as "huge" cars, but mine (a 74 and a 75) actually seem smaller than I remember every time i get in it and drive it. To me, it is just the right size (basically, exactly the same car as the 77-79 Tbird, 72-75 Montego, 74-79 Cougar, 74-76 Elite) That chassis got quite a workout in the Ford line!

 
Speaking of "roomier," I'm floored by how much more legroom our "smallish" Mustang have compared to, say, 1963 Galaxie 500 XLs. My pal Jim's car, as huge as it is seems cramped and tiny inside compared my Mustang. Granted, I moved my seats back 2" and I don't have a fixed-column-mounted "bus driver" steering wheel to contend with, but seriously - I'm amazed at how small the interiors of some of the bigger cars actually are. Forget trying to fold up my 6'5" frame into my pal Gonzo's Camaros. LOL

Actually, the roof height of our model years are over an inch shorter than the '67-'68s, and a half inch lower than the '69-'70s... since we're getting to the details.

I'm sorry, but a few inches more in length, width, and a lower roof height still does not make our Mustangs "Intermediate Sedans." By way of comparison, the Torinos (closest thing to an "intermediate sedan") were substantially bigger, and up to 800lbs heavier than our Mustangs.

And yes, I'm still stuck on those words. It's one thing to hear it from a VMF'er or some other know-it-all vintage Mustanger, we've all been there. But to see it in print from an authority who has the 'ear' of the gamut of Mustang enthusiasts, is just unacceptable, IMHO. "If you don't have anything nice to say..." seems to apply here. But by the same token, don't feed the fire when the opportunity comes along.

13 more issues to change my mind. Although I'm sure the prospect of losing one more '71 Mustang owner as a subscriber is keeping them up at night. rofl

 
Not exactly sure what you mean, but the conversation was only about 71-73s. Nobody ever said the 69-70s were particularly small...they weren't. But the fact is that that 71-73s were bigger in nearly every dimension than any Mustang that had come before. It grew in one direction, the market moved in another.

The typical trend in Detroit then was that all cars would naturally grow as they "matured". The Mustang was no different in that respect.

It is well known that Iacocca did not agree with that thinking. He hated the HF-II demanded "enlargement' of the 67-68s..he called them a "fat pig"! That is why he rallied so hard for the smaller "Mustang II". That car was definitelty his baby, maybe even more of his influence in it than the original 65'.

He had been lobbying HF-II for several years about "downsizing" the entire Ford line, well aware of the coming onslaught of small foreign imports and the effect they were going to have. He was very prescient in that particular regard.

HF-II would have none of it. He felt if there was to be a smaller car, it would be a new model, not a smaller version of an existing model. The Maverick in '69 was Iacocca's first half-hearted attempt to recapture what he saw as the Mustang's true personality...a small economical sporty car...not the fire-breathing beheamoth it had become. It was very succesfull.

The Thunderbid had become fat and lazy by '72, a hulking psuedo-Lincoln and light-years away from everything the "Thunderbird' had originally been designed as. Its sales peaked at 92,500 in 1960 and had plummeted to 36,000 by 1971.

In '72 it began its 5-year run as a virtual clone of the Lincoln Mark series and sales styed low.

Iacocca pushed for downsizing, Henry Ford II refused saying "America likes big cars". Somehow, Iacocca put the plans in motion for a new, smaller & lighter,and importantly: cheaper Thunderbird for 1977 without HF II really understanding what was happening. (That doesn't make sense to me...)

The new smaller 1977 Thunderbird was a SMASH hit! it sold 320,000 units in ONE YEAR! That is more than a 700% increase over the previous year.

And it is more than 400% higher than any single previous year of Thunderbird.

That generation ran for 3 years: 77-79. production for that 3-year run was over 955,000 units. That is more sales than the previous 16 YEARS combined!

But...the success of the car was Iacocca's downfall. He was celebrated as the mover and shaker at Ford...and HF II did not like anyone having the spotlight. It was shocking at the time, but on the ev of the greatest sales sucess and turnaround of any nameplate in history, HF II fired iacocca, the man responsible for making it happen.

GM downsized thier entire line in 77...and slaughtered Ford in the process until finally HF II gave in and allowed the downsizing, but it took until 1980 to begin, and until 83 or so for it to take full effect of the entire line. Millions of sales were lost to GM.

So, whats the point?

The Mustang did indeed grow every generation, just like every car did back then. The 71-73s would probably would not be so poorly remembered if the market hadn't taken such a swift and dramatic turn in a new direction.

Camaro and Firebird sales had fallen off so much that they were both cancelled in 1971. If not for a couple of very vocal and aggresive GM insiders who lobbied endlessly to keep them going, they would surely have ended there. Herb Adams was one...he is one of the great auto engineers that doesn't get much mention. John Schinella was head of one of GMs design divison...he loved those cars. And of course there is Bill Mitchell, famed Corvette guy...maybe second only to Zora himself.

History likes to paint Ford Motor as a doofus company for selling the "wrong" Mustang in 71-73. But there is no way they could have forseen any of this in 67-68, when the car was being designed and planned. The design of the car is a logical and expected result of what would have naturally been predicted back in 68. They just designed what they thought peoiple were going to want.

And they all got caught: Chrysler dumped its Cuda/ Challenger twins after dismal sales form 71-74, the Camaro-Bird barely survived, and everything else died: No more Javelins or AMXs,no more small-ish Chevelles, Skylarks, Regals or Cutlasses.

The only pony car that really survived unscathed was the only pony car to begin with: the Mustang.

Personally I don't think of the 71-73s as "too big", not by a long shot. I think of them as "just right". But...I do think of previous generations of Mustang as too small! Cramped, poor handling and rough-riding, thats my own opinion of 65-70 Mustangs, as compared to our 71-73s.

But, I am also a pretty big guy: 6'3", about 280 lbs. I was well over 230 in my youth when I first got the car, so I need a bigger Mustang!

Its funny, most people remember the last Torinos as "huge" cars, but mine (a 74 and a 75) actually seem smaller than I remember every time i get in it and drive it. To me, it is just the right size (basically, exactly the same car as the 77-79 Tbird, 72-75 Montego, 74-79 Cougar, 74-76 Elite) That chassis got quite a workout in the Ford line!
LMAO....you spend an awful lot of time finding a way to be RIGHT. So the answer is its a 70 Mach I. So the point is you jumped out there with the popular response that our cars were big old cars. Its your car and you can call it whatever but I'm enjoying the denial and twisting in the wind. I'm simply pointing out how was the 70 so popular and nobody referred to IT as a big body car at pretty much the same size as 71's But with your response is MORE material for me to play with. I bet you're a HOOT at a party. dancebanana

 
Hmm...still a little confused at what the 70 Mach 1 has to do specifically with anything we were talking about here.

When I say or agree with others that the 71-73s are "big", it is clearly only in relation to other Mustangs that came before it. In those terms it can certainly be truthfully called "big" because it is fact bigger in most dimensions than any other Mustang up to that point in the history of the model.

Of course, no one (myself included in that) is trying to say, or has ever said that the 71-73 Mustang is a "big car" as a definition of its size class.

I think the Mustang has always classified as an "compact" ( or was it just called "small"?) car, class size-wise. Even the 69-70, or 71-73 versions were still clearly "compact/ small" cars by class. It never left its original class, I agree with that.

Unlike the Cougar, which clearly moved from "compact" in 73 into the "intermediate" size class in '74. We should all be thankful the marketing nit-wits at Ford never did that to the Mustang!

Can you imagine a Torino-based Mustang? Yuck. That would have killed it for sure.

And yes, I do tend to ramble on a bit...and a bit more. But I'm a car guy, and a Ford guy, and a Mustang guy, and a lot of other guys too...and when the the valves in my head start popping and my brain gets to percolating, I get a torrential flow of meaningless trivia that starts to pour out.

Not trying to prove I'm "right" about anything...its just casual internet ******** I talk about most times. Slightly less valuable than a wooden nickel.

Its all good.

:) :)

 
OK - finally found what I was looking for (kind of).

Now - which car "looks" bigger again?

23v1b0z.jpg


There's also another pic with these two cars nose to nose (by one of our members, FasTnNefariouS) that shows how much bigger the '70 "looks" in comparison, but I can't find it, and the link in the same thread I found this pic is broken.

This one's a bit of an eye opener as well - look how huge the '07 Saleen looks compared to the '70 - if ours are such a disappointment because of the bloated size, this should be REALLY horrible... but it's not, apparently.

DSC00263-1-1.jpg


Just sayin' ;) :D

 
here's a good comparison

uploadfromtaptalk1424549339110.jpg

 
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SEE what I mean 72? ITS POINT 1 INCHES BIGGER ....its ahhhh MONSTER CAR!!!! according to the media aka car mags and some followers :D

Thanks dude that is a PERFECT comparison!!! :D:D:D


DahhhhGA Kit... I dont want to get banned for politics but it sounds like some denial and redirecting to avoid the truth.

"Hmm...still a little confused at what the 70 Mach 1 has to do specifically with anything we were talking about here.

When I say or agree with others that the 71-73s are "big", it is clearly only in relation to other Mustangs that came before it" (shhhh but I THINK the 70 in question came BEFORE the 71)

git'n some double talk go'n on there. :D

with that said I believe that 1/2 inch here and .1" there another .2 etc and 48 lbs is a glaring example of subjective opinion and a lack of professionalism. The extent of Mustang Monthly's intent not to consider the 71-3 cars brings to question what kind of car they promote or what and who "influences" them. Social acceptance follows by wannabe's of knowledge wanting to be popular and parroting what they THINK is fact/rule/acceptable positions through out conversations internationally. I do acknowledge that technically .1" IS bigger or .2" is BIGGER but to declare a car TOO BIG AND TOO HEAVY? If anybody can look at a car and visually see .1" difference and then refer to our car as BIG BODY I'll pay them 2000.00 out of my pocket!

 
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here's a good comparison
Try the height of the S197 (or just about any mass-produced modern car today) against the '71-73, and it's painfully obvious which Mustang has been eating doughnuts in the styling department.

Ditto for that damn beltline. At least the beltline has been scalloped on the 2015/S550 to hide the bulk.

-Kurt

 
Both smart-looking, well-proportioned designs. I dare say the '70 would look even closer in height to the '71 if it weren't raised in the back.

-Kurt

 
DahhhhGA Kit... I dont want to get banned for politics but it sounds like some denial and redirecting to avoid the truth.

"Hmm...still a little confused at what the 70 Mach 1 has to do specifically with anything we were talking about here.

When I say or agree with others that the 71-73s are "big", it is clearly only in relation to other Mustangs that came before it" (shhhh but I THINK the 70 in question came BEFORE the 71)

git'n some double talk go'n on there. :D

with that said I believe that 1/2 inch here and .1" there another .2 etc and 48 lbs is a glaring example of subjective opinion and a lack of professionalism. The extent of Mustang Monthly's intent not to consider the 71-3 cars brings to question what kind of car they promote or what and who "influences" them. Social acceptance follows by wannabe's of knowledge wanting to be popular and parroting what they THINK is fact/rule/acceptable positions through out conversations internationally. I do acknowledge that technically .1" IS bigger or .2" is BIGGER but to declare a car TOO BIG AND TOO HEAVY? If anybody can look at a car and visually see .1" difference and then refer to our car as BIG BODY I'll pay them 2000.00 out of my pocket!
Carter, you sure do seem to be spoiling for a fight here.

You can try and twist around my words all you want, but you are never going to be able to claim that a 71-73 Mustang is not the biggest classic Mustang there ever was...because it was.

Yes, as you continually point out to the point of redundancy...the 71's are only very marginally bigger than the70s. So minor a difference as to be virtually insignificant.

And I also agree with you that ( I think you said this...it is difficult to be sure) the sleeker styling of the 71 makes it appear to be maybe smaller than the bulkier styling of the 70, even though it is ( barely) bigger.

No magazine, article or book that I have ever read concerning Mustang ( and I have read a lot of them) has EVER said that the 71-73 Mustang is too big as directly compared to the 70...which is the statement you keep making over and over. I also have never said that, even though you keep saying that I did.

All of the "too big" statements made over the years are comparing the 71 Mustang to the original 65 Mustang and are making the observation that the 71-73 Mustang is "too big", relative to the size if the original 65.

The press started thier "too big" mantra when the 67s came out...clearly there were many who wished the Mustang never grew even an iota from its original design.

Using the size of the '14 Mustang as an example of how that car is near exactly the same size as the 71s is meaningless: The press have generally been complaining for at least 10 years now that this generation of Mustang is too big and too heavy.

To me, comparing a 70 to a 71 may be reasonable, but comparing a 71 to a 14? Utterly ridiculous...there is 43 years difference there! So many regulatory and technological differences, plus drastically different consumer demands make that a meaningless comparison.

I have tried to be a gentleman about your belittling posts directed at me and shrug them off, but apparently you think you are going to educate me about how wrong my opinions on this and (now in other posts) vinyl roofs are.

Well, just like you I am stubborn as an old mule. Try as you might, you are not going to convince me to change my opinions, views or recollections about these cars.

But here's the wierd part: we are both fans of the same thing: 71-73 Mustangs!

Why the f*** are we arguing at all?!

I love this Mustang over all others, and I think you might also.

So, if you are agreeable...let's just drop it and get back to loving these cool old cars.

 
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Overall, I believe this has been a GREAT thread as it has brought forward a couple of very good points.

First of all, it has allowed us to bring to the attention of the editor for "Mustang Monthly" some of our (1971 - 1973 Mustang owners) dissatisfaction with what is seen by some as a lack of quality coverage of our cars. It has also allowed the editor the opportunity to respond to those criticisms.

Secondly, it has shown that even among ourselves we often have "different" perceptions as to what has caused the "bias" against our cars over the years...Good stuff overall (in my opinion) but probably more appropriate for discussion in the non-public forum.

With that said, I am leaving this thread open but caution everyone to try to keep to the original focus of the thread, i.e., our feelings as to how "Mustang Monthly" is addressing what we would like to see in the magazine. The editor is now a member of this site and I would think he (or members of his staff) will periodically check in with us.

Again, GREAT thread so lets not get "off track."

Thanks:)!

BT

 
Compared to the older Mustangs the 71-73 was bigger, but compared to it's competition at the time it wasn't. Do people go on about the size of the 71 Plymouth Barracuda and GTX, AMX Javelin, Charger or Challenger?

For me I love the size of the 71-73s, they're proper muscle cars and the 64-66s look a bit *****.

 
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