OK, now I'm losing my mind. Several times I checked the pin at the plug behind the engine and was getting 6.5V. I was just about to button up the wiring and decided to check again and now its reading 12.5V. What gives
Duraspark II with ram air debacle
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Under what conditions were you checking? Engine on or off? If off, you'll see full battery voltage with points open and about 6V with it closed. With the engine running, you should see something like 1V below battery voltage, which is the average voltage with points being opened and closed rapidly. Your meter may read something different (due to its averaging a variable voltage over time) but something well above 6V and somewhere below full battery voltage.
Just verified:
Engine off, duraspark and coil completely disconnected, and reading directly at the engine wiring harness, I am reading 12.5 volts.
My distributor doesn't have points.
Engine off, duraspark and coil completely disconnected, and reading directly at the engine wiring harness, I am reading 12.5 volts.
My distributor doesn't have points.
mach1sc
Member
Karl Kustoms sells a magnetic pickup distributor for 50$ I have been using it for 6 months now and it has preformed great. Model KPPJM6606 search google with that # and it will come up. I am using it with Duraspark type setup. edit : actually a PT287 Control Module I got from Rockauto out of stock now was for 1974 Ranchero 351 cleavland and cost me $9.60. My original points coil IS powered with original resistance wire that also now powers relay TRIGGER that sends battery power to PT287 control module.
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Good. That's what you should be reading.
How would I verify that the resistance wire in the harness exists and is giving the correct voltage as to not burn out the coil? I thought I should be reading 6.5V from the engine harness.
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The voltage reading will change depending on whether or not the coil is charging, as the draw will reduce the voltage. 12.5V with the DuraSpark disconnected and 6.5V with it connected is what I'd expect to see.
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With the coil disconnected, you don't have a complete circuit, so are reading voltage potential (battery voltage). Measure with the circuit complete and go by MIdlife's earlier post. As for verifying if the resistance wire is present, since you read 6.5 volts at one point, it's there. If you really want to dig deep, you could find both ends under the dash and do an ohm reading. A standard wire will show 0 ohms, and the resistance wire will show something, although I don't remember how much.
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https://7173mustangs.com/threads/distributor-issue.45203/post-455789
This is what I was looking for. Just didn't google enough last night. All is well: 5.8V at the coil while doing the test and and 12.8V with engine running; 14.1V at the battery with engine running.
I ended up buying a cardone distributor off amazon for $75. We will see the quality when it arrives.
This is what I was looking for. Just didn't google enough last night. All is well: 5.8V at the coil while doing the test and and 12.8V with engine running; 14.1V at the battery with engine running.
I ended up buying a cardone distributor off amazon for $75. We will see the quality when it arrives.
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H code with Edelbrock heads
AOD 4 speed Automatic
No. Only the 460 distributors from then. Try a 1975 Thunderbird 460 distributor. Will still need the stock electronic module though.
I went with the cardone 30-2893. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000C46KJO?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title
I haven't installed it yet but the female cap fits as it should! Its branded motorcraft but the shaft seems to spin a little too easy with a little more play than I would expect. I will compare it to the old one when I swap but am waiting until I replace the timing chain first.
I am still concerned about the rotor as well. The replacement rotors I have been purchasing (FD-311) do not seem to be exact to what's already installed in the vehicle. It's about 1/16" smaller and the groove on the inside isn't as deep so its doesn't seem secure. Any thoughts? (see photo below) The blue one is the one I am trying to replace.
I haven't installed it yet but the female cap fits as it should! Its branded motorcraft but the shaft seems to spin a little too easy with a little more play than I would expect. I will compare it to the old one when I swap but am waiting until I replace the timing chain first.
I am still concerned about the rotor as well. The replacement rotors I have been purchasing (FD-311) do not seem to be exact to what's already installed in the vehicle. It's about 1/16" smaller and the groove on the inside isn't as deep so its doesn't seem secure. Any thoughts? (see photo below) The blue one is the one I am trying to replace.
Finally got the Cardone Dizzy recurved and installed. It seems to be a quality rebuild. I still wasn't happy with the fit of the new rotor on the rebuilt dizzy reluctor plate so I ended up using the old distributors' reluctor plate and rotor. The old rotor contact also sticks out about an 1/8" further than the new rotors. Still haven't figured out if I am looking at wrong parts or if manufacturing just changed over time and I am basing my observations on old parts. The old plate is the one on the left without the chamfering.
I had the 16L side welded up then ground down to .410" which makes is a 10L. I ended up using one medium spring from the old distributor and one Mr Gasket 925D spring. I would like to get the dizzy checked at some point to see where the numbers actually stand. My car doesn't have a tach and I am working on it by myself so I have no way to tell the RPMS but my best guess is the timing is all in somewhere around 3000 RPMS. Initial timing set at 15 degrees and total at 35. I may play with that a little more. I moved my vacuum advance to the ported side of the carb.
So I went to put everything back together and I about lost my gdamn mind. I still cant figure out what happened so maybe yall can shed some light. The magnetic pick up spun smooth and the snap ring came off with ease on disassembly but when I went to reinstall the magnetic pickup back over the breaker plate, the snap ring would no longer fit in the slot. I cleaned off all the grease and tried to make sense of it for about a half hour (trying every combination of old and new parts) before I resorted to milling down the top of the magnetic pickup to make room for the snap ring. There are literally no moving parts and nothing was interfering with the fit. I am baffled. Once I ground it down, it fit and worked fine. I don't know, maybe I just ruined it..
Last question: are these cam gears different materials? The black one is the Cardone rebuilt and I am decently certain I have a stock cam in my engine.
Funny story to wrap this thread up. I took the Mach 1 to the local Hot Rod shop to talk about some work I was interested in and we start talking about everything I just did with the distributor to make it fit under the Ram Air assembly. He chuckled and told me that one time a guy came in with a unmolested Boss 302 with Ram Air and demanded he install an MSD for him. After he installed it, he informed the customer that it didn't fit under the Ram Air. The customer told him to make it fit and that he didn't care what he did so hot rod guy cut a piece of the air cleaner out for clearance, spun it around and welded it back in. Customer was happy.
And in my personal saga: my Ram Air assembly is very beat up and no longer seals around the carb; so I am not even using it at the moment.
I had the 16L side welded up then ground down to .410" which makes is a 10L. I ended up using one medium spring from the old distributor and one Mr Gasket 925D spring. I would like to get the dizzy checked at some point to see where the numbers actually stand. My car doesn't have a tach and I am working on it by myself so I have no way to tell the RPMS but my best guess is the timing is all in somewhere around 3000 RPMS. Initial timing set at 15 degrees and total at 35. I may play with that a little more. I moved my vacuum advance to the ported side of the carb.
So I went to put everything back together and I about lost my gdamn mind. I still cant figure out what happened so maybe yall can shed some light. The magnetic pick up spun smooth and the snap ring came off with ease on disassembly but when I went to reinstall the magnetic pickup back over the breaker plate, the snap ring would no longer fit in the slot. I cleaned off all the grease and tried to make sense of it for about a half hour (trying every combination of old and new parts) before I resorted to milling down the top of the magnetic pickup to make room for the snap ring. There are literally no moving parts and nothing was interfering with the fit. I am baffled. Once I ground it down, it fit and worked fine. I don't know, maybe I just ruined it..
Last question: are these cam gears different materials? The black one is the Cardone rebuilt and I am decently certain I have a stock cam in my engine.
Funny story to wrap this thread up. I took the Mach 1 to the local Hot Rod shop to talk about some work I was interested in and we start talking about everything I just did with the distributor to make it fit under the Ram Air assembly. He chuckled and told me that one time a guy came in with a unmolested Boss 302 with Ram Air and demanded he install an MSD for him. After he installed it, he informed the customer that it didn't fit under the Ram Air. The customer told him to make it fit and that he didn't care what he did so hot rod guy cut a piece of the air cleaner out for clearance, spun it around and welded it back in. Customer was happy.
And in my personal saga: my Ram Air assembly is very beat up and no longer seals around the carb; so I am not even using it at the moment.
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You did exactly what I did on mine to get a 10L slot and also the springs. Spring tension is important too.
As for the cam gear, Cardone do say they are made to the original specs, but are they? That's probably why the new Chinese made Cardone distributor is still in my junk box.
As for fitting the magnetic pickup, that's weird, so no idea. Mine of course was a points to Pertronix II conversion.
Maybe Santa will bring you a new fully adjustable timing light with tach built in.
As for the cam gear, Cardone do say they are made to the original specs, but are they? That's probably why the new Chinese made Cardone distributor is still in my junk box.
As for fitting the magnetic pickup, that's weird, so no idea. Mine of course was a points to Pertronix II conversion.
Maybe Santa will bring you a new fully adjustable timing light with tach built in.
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logged in just to say this is probably my next purchase
https://www.harborfreight.com/autom...timing-lights/digital-timing-light-57678.html
That looks identical to one of the Innova models....I have the Innova Pro and really like it.logged in just to say this is probably my next purchase
https://www.harborfreight.com/autom...timing-lights/digital-timing-light-57678.html
I'm thinking this is the same piece as the HF light you're considering.
https://www.amazon.com/INNOVA-3568-...r_1_5?c=ts&s=automotive&sr=1-5&ts_id=15707511
I wanted to check back in to say that I discovered the vacuum advance can was leaking which was causing issues getting the engine tuned correctly. Make sure you check that if you buy a cardone "rebuilt"
Wanted to stop back in one last time to post some information that I couldn't seem to find anywhere on the internet.
From my understanding there are 2 types of Vacuum cans as far as adjustments go: One type will limit the total amount of degrees of advance. The other type of can you cannot adjust the total number but rather you can adjust the vacuum at which the can operates. It is nearly impossible to figure out which one is which online.
It appears that if you go to rockauto.com and purchase a vacuum can for a 71 distributor with points, you will see the option for the Standard brand VC31. I currently have this can in my possession and have confirmed that this one is indeed the type that the adjustment limits the total number of degrees the can will give.
If you go to a 76 elite (which has the duraspark 2 distributor), you will see that your option is the Standard brand VC210. I have not purchased this one to confirm but I am willing to bet that this can is the one that does not adjust the total degrees of advance but rather you adjust at what vacuum the advance comes in. I may purchase this one out of curiosity and if I do I will reply here to confirm or deny these thoughts and findings.
From my understanding there are 2 types of Vacuum cans as far as adjustments go: One type will limit the total amount of degrees of advance. The other type of can you cannot adjust the total number but rather you can adjust the vacuum at which the can operates. It is nearly impossible to figure out which one is which online.
It appears that if you go to rockauto.com and purchase a vacuum can for a 71 distributor with points, you will see the option for the Standard brand VC31. I currently have this can in my possession and have confirmed that this one is indeed the type that the adjustment limits the total number of degrees the can will give.
If you go to a 76 elite (which has the duraspark 2 distributor), you will see that your option is the Standard brand VC210. I have not purchased this one to confirm but I am willing to bet that this can is the one that does not adjust the total degrees of advance but rather you adjust at what vacuum the advance comes in. I may purchase this one out of curiosity and if I do I will reply here to confirm or deny these thoughts and findings.
Good info on the vacuum cans. Have you measured the control range on the VC31 can? I'll be interested in getting ahold of one.
The can installed on the Cardone 2893 is as you suspect the VC210's behavior. In one of the other recent threads, I posted up the advance curve vs applied vacuum at a few different adjustment positions. Also, I noticed the advance plate was welded? Did your Cardone 2893 have a 10L plate installed? Mine did (as was described by Scotty at Reincarnation).
The can installed on the Cardone 2893 is as you suspect the VC210's behavior. In one of the other recent threads, I posted up the advance curve vs applied vacuum at a few different adjustment positions. Also, I noticed the advance plate was welded? Did your Cardone 2893 have a 10L plate installed? Mine did (as was described by Scotty at Reincarnation).
@basstrix That was an amazing post and I think it would be helpful to post that chart here as well for anyone who stumbles upon this thread.
EDIT: I did not record the total number the VC31 gives. I was shooting for 50-52* total at cruise so I found what vacuum my engine usually gives at cruise (~17") then subtracted 35 (my total mechanical advance) from 52 = 17. I then set my can to give 17* by using a timing light at idle and pulling 17" of vacuum with a vacuum pump.
My cardone did not have the 10L plate in it which is why I ended up welding and grinding it to 10L spec. The vacuum can that came on my cardone is the type that adjusts the vacuum at which the advance is applied and not total advance supplied by the can. I would like to verify that the Standard VC210 is in fact the same design.
EDIT: I did not record the total number the VC31 gives. I was shooting for 50-52* total at cruise so I found what vacuum my engine usually gives at cruise (~17") then subtracted 35 (my total mechanical advance) from 52 = 17. I then set my can to give 17* by using a timing light at idle and pulling 17" of vacuum with a vacuum pump.
My cardone did not have the 10L plate in it which is why I ended up welding and grinding it to 10L spec. The vacuum can that came on my cardone is the type that adjusts the vacuum at which the advance is applied and not total advance supplied by the can. I would like to verify that the Standard VC210 is in fact the same design.
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