NO start - Timming 351w

[Mikes73]

You may just need to loosen the distributor hold down bolt and rotate the dizzy counter clockwise to get the rotor to line up with #1 on the cap.If you can't get enough of a turn on it a restab of the dizzy may be necessary.

 

[kcmash]

Here's the pics of what I observed. The chain has about 1/2" play (right side) left is pretty tight. The dampner looks pretty bad (rubber) one side other looks good. THe tdc marks on gears look right to me (exactly). Its' at TDC when I took pic of the rotor in the 12oclock position. I'ts not close to 1 oclock (#1 piston), I didtn pull rotor but it the teeth/pin down inside BLOCH look ok., no broken rotor. Im far enough out for it not to run, but why didn't the timing set gears jump a tooth? I think harmonic balancer is in rough shape. but nothing explains the jump from 1 oclock to noon straight up. WHAT AM I MISSING? I've got the TDC TOOL coming int he mail. Not exactly SURE its at TDC didn't pull #1 plug yet. Thanks all ! BILL

Wow, I want to make my intake look like yours! what did you use?

I had a previous thread on rough running 351w. I pulled the cap off the distributor and moved crank around to tdc and noticed the rotor was pointing to 12 o clock position not 1 o clock. I had symptoms of rough running to a point where it would shut off, now no start w/backfire. I've got gas & spark. I'm guessing the engine's timing chain jumped a tooth or is too slack. when I see how much the rotor moves from stop(when I reverse direction on crank) from tdc its im guessing 6-8 degrees. but i'm almost blind and can only guess at those numbers. Any suggestions before I pull the TIMING CHAIN? Thanks all! Bill

 

[jbojo]

You may just need to loosen the distributor hold down bolt and rotate the dizzy counter clockwise to get the rotor to line up with #1 on the cap.If you can't get enough of a turn on it a restab of the dizzy may be necessary.

+1

This would be my steps that I would do based on what you've told us.

* Align the 2 gears to their timing marks.

* Remove the dizzy and inspect the pin to ensure that gear is aligned properly.

* Reinstall the dizzy so that the rotor is pointing to the 1:00 o'clock position. (Seems that where you have yours set up)

* Reassemble everything, the timing should be at TDC on the harmonic damper.

* If everything lines up with the steps above rotate the motor back a little so that the timing pointer is at about 8* BTDC. Then rotate the dizzy to align the rotor to #1 cylinder again. Do not remove the dizzy, just rotate. It shouldn't need much.

* Tighten the dizzy down a little so it can't rotate when you try to start the motor.

Then I would double check everything again. I usually work alone so this is how I do it.

* remove the spark plug for Cyl #1

* I usually get a small piece of paper towel and plug the spark plug hole.

* Rotate the motor by hand and as you come up on the compression stroke for #1 you will hear a pop and that is the paper towel coming out of the spark plug hole. Note: make sure that the paper plug has enough hanging out so that you don't accidently suck it into the cylinder on the intake stroke.

* when you hear that pop stop when the pointer is at 8* BTDC,

* Remove the dizzy cap. The rotor should be at your 1:00 o'clock position.

If everything is good you can try to start the car and it starts and then time the motor with the timing light to where you want it.

Hope this helps and makes sense.

Edit: Actually you can do all of this before re-assembling the motor again in case this does not fix the issue. If it checks out ok then reassemble.

 

[hetrickw]

Thanks jbojo/mike, I appreciate the detailed steps. That's what I was going to do, just wanted to understand what occurred. I'm thinking about putting in a different cam. I'm going to replace the timing set and harmonic balancer while ive got it opened up and not sure about the play in the chain and the bad rubber on the balancer. I appreciate the input.

bill

You may just need to loosen the distributor hold down bolt and rotate the dizzy counter clockwise to get the rotor to line up with #1 on the cap.If you can't get enough of a turn on it a restab of the dizzy may be necessary.

+1

This would be my steps that I would do based on what you've told us.

* Align the 2 gears to their timing marks.

* Remove the dizzy and inspect the pin to ensure that gear is aligned properly.

* Reinstall the dizzy so that the rotor is pointing to the 1:00 o'clock position. (Seems that where you have yours set up)

* Reassemble everything, the timing should be at TDC on the harmonic damper.

* If everything lines up with the steps above rotate the motor back a little so that the timing pointer is at about 8* BTDC. Then rotate the dizzy to align the rotor to #1 cylinder again. Do not remove the dizzy, just rotate. It shouldn't need much.

* Tighten the dizzy down a little so it can't rotate when you try to start the motor.

Then I would double check everything again. I usually work alone so this is how I do it.

* remove the spark plug for Cyl #1

* I usually get a small piece of paper towel and plug the spark plug hole.

* Rotate the motor by hand and as you come up on the compression stroke for #1 you will hear a pop and that is the paper towel coming out of the spark plug hole. Note: make sure that the paper plug has enough hanging out so that you don't accidently suck it into the cylinder on the intake stroke.

* when you hear that pop stop when the pointer is at 8* BTDC,

* Remove the dizzy cap. The rotor should be at your 1:00 o'clock position.

If everything is good you can try to start the car and it starts and then time the motor with the timing light to where you want it.

Hope this helps and makes sense.

Edit: Actually you can do all of this before re-assembling the motor again in case this does not fix the issue. If it checks out ok then reassemble.

 

[jbojo]

Yeah, since you have it disassembled to this point that's probably a good idea.

 

[Justin71]

Did you ever just verify healthy spark? I had a problem recently that I SWORE was a timing problem, or slipped chain. In the end, I found a weak spark (timing light was weak/intermittent when over any spark wire). Cause? a $4 "condenser" inside the distributor cap. (I am running points and condenser). Just a thought from out here in left field. Your chain/cam/etc look to be golden visually. I'm not sure I would swap out the cam at this stage?

 

[hetrickw]

Justin, I agree with you the set looks good to me. I am going to replace it (timing set) anyway since it's opened up. I did have good spark, but looks like distributor is off (somehow). I assumed it was the chain. I haven't pulled it yet but that's next. Spent hours removing everything to get at it (about 4 hrs). But, heck its better than sitting in front of the tube. Appreciate your advise. I'll post follow up when I get it figured out. Really want to replace cam and check valves/rods when I pull heads (maybe).

Bill

Did you ever just verify healthy spark? I had a problem recently that I SWORE was a timing problem, or slipped chain. In the end, I found a weak spark (timing light was weak/intermittent when over any spark wire). Cause? a $4 "condenser" inside the distributor cap. (I am running points and condenser). Just a thought from out here in left field. Your chain/cam/etc look to be golden visually. I'm not sure I would swap out the cam at this stage?