Harmonic balancer

[rottenralph]

I think my harmonic balancer is now the latest part that is going to need replacing. I had an odd knock the other day and it was not rhythmic like a piston knock but a little more random. Guy pulls up next to me and says it sounds like your harmonic balancer is going south. I will check it out this weekend but I would like to know if anyone has had a balancer fail? How long does it take to replace without removing the radiator? Outside of the noise, what else would be the clues to know it is going south? I have changed everything else so why not this plus I need to change timing cover because the yokels that changed my cam somehow did not get it on right and now my car marks its place with a couple of oil spots everywhere I go.

 

[turtle5353]

I have had one make a hell of a vibration before. The rubber in it was shot and just about completely gone. The outer ring can even start to separate from the whole assembly....definitely not good. As far as pulling it with the rad in place might be tough. Gets pretty tight when you put the puller in there, not sure if it will work with the rad in place. But I may be wrong?? Good luck man!

 

[rottenralph]

Any reason why I should buy some of the more expensive balancers over a less expensive pioneer one.

 

[turtle5353]

In my opinion if your not running a built up motor and turning a lot of rpms any NEW balancer is better than a 40+ year old original.

 

[rottenralph]

Guess this is the price of having a 42 year old daily driver. Sooner or later the only part that will be 42 or older will be me at this rate. Looking forward to a few week without any BS to fix. It was the starter last weekend, fuel pump 3 weeks ago and now a I have a crack in the paint that is really pissing me off since I had it fixed 4 months ago and paid extra to have it done "RIGHT".

 

[turtle5353]

I feel your pain with the cracks in the paint! My old motor without sub frame connectors cracked the paint just below the quarter panel roof line. Got my new 408 stroker in and added subframe connectors, helped out a bunch. But I did find some cracked paint on the roof and at the corner of the windshield. Last week I was checking some stuff under the hood and found a crack in the strut tower on top of the shock where the firewall brace is bolted!!!! DAMN!! Got some torque. Gonna have to repair the strut tower but I figure hell with the paint. Its a driver.

Good luck with the balancer. I have a good used one off my old motor before I built the 408. Your welcome to have it and try it to see if your balancer is your problem. Let me know and I can ship it out to ya!

 

[c9zx]

It is a somewhat common failure, I've lost 2 myself. It shakes like crazy. The pioneer piece should be fine. Or maybe these guys. http://www.damperdudes.net//product_info.php?cPath=25&products_id=214

 

[Bill73Ragtop]

I used these folks back in 2002 to rebuild mine.

http://www.damperdoctor.com/

 

[mdunlap]

I used these folks back in 2002 to rebuild mine.

http://www.damperdoctor.com/

Great advice above… I'm in the process of researching the best/value-centric way to replace my damper. The majority of advice given is just like Turtle's. Unless your are building a stroker and/or racing, factory or a reputable company's damper will do. In addition to the Pioneer part, rockauto.com has Dorman and ATP Dampers (search harmonic balancer) for $77 and $91, respectively. On a side-note, it appears that Damperdoctor also rebuilds motor mounts.

 

[midlife]

Yeah, both Damperdocter and DamperDudes (both in Redding, CA!) have good reputations and can repair your damper for less than a new one.

I had mine re-done (just because) while I was restoring Midlife. Two years after the work, we finally fired up the engine and the timing was all screwy! Turned out they installed the damper backwards so whenever I rotated the dizzy to advance, the damper said retard! They willingly took it back and repaired it two+ years after the fact at no charge. I figure it was an honest mistake.

 

[rottenralph]

Turtle, thanks for the offer but I already bought one. I am going to change the timing cover at the same time since the mechanics said they had to modify mine to make it work even though it came off the motor with no problems. Now my car leaks and it did not before so I am starting with the part they "modified" to make it work.

Cracked paint question= My crack is along the body line on the rear fender that starts mid fender and goes back to the back. I suspect the fender was changed but not sure, any thoughts on why it would crack in the same place.

Another question, when I change the timing cover, what is used to seal it. Does it get some kind of permatex or a gasket. I also wanted to know if there is anything special about mounting a timing cover other than putting it on, torqueing to spec and being done.

 

[turtle5353]

Turtle, thanks for the offer but I already bought one. I am going to change the timing cover at the same time since the mechanics said they had to modify mine to make it work even though it came off the motor with no problems. Now my car leaks and it did not before so I am starting with the part they "modified" to make it work.

Cracked paint question= My crack is along the body line on the rear fender that starts mid fender and goes back to the back. I suspect the fender was changed but not sure, any thoughts on why it would crack in the same place.

Another question, when I change the timing cover, what is used to seal it. Does it get some kind of permatex or a gasket. I also wanted to know if there is anything special about mounting a timing cover other than putting it on, torqueing to spec and being done.

Im not sure why they would of needed to modify your timing chain cover?? I have had 4-5 Clevelands built from mild to wild and always used the stock cover with no modifications to it. I have seen the cam retainer eat into the cover before. But installing it is pretty simple. I use the gasket and light coating of RTV to help hold it in place. Torque to spec and done.

If your rear quarter is cracking along that body line, then your rear quarter was probably replaced and that's where they seamed it together. The filler and/or paint is cracking at that seam. They may not have butt welded it and just overlapped it there. Usually if you look in the trunk inside you can see if the rear quarter was replaced. My paint cracked at the factory roof seam, above where your is. And mine cracked vertically just above where yours did. I know my quarters were replaced long before I got the car and theres a lot of bondo in there! I will be replacing the quarters properly when I repaint mine in a few years.

 

[rottenralph]

I put my Pioneer Dampener on and had some fun doing it today. I will post pics of the harmonic balancer that came off and I think it looks crooked an has some odd scrates from hitting the timing indicator or whatever it is called. I also changed my jets today. I went from 70 73 to 68/71 and it seems to have become a bit peppier. I may step it down again after I have had some time to shake it down. My headers are the root of all evil I think. I had to change the gasket on the flange today and had to drive all over the place to find 3.5 inch flange gaskets. I feel like the manifolds moved a hair when I was squeezing the new gasket in. I am going to find some 4v manifolds and start from there. These 3.5 inch pipes are too big and I don't think they are really doing anything good, just bad. Changing the harmonic balancer was actually a pretty easy project and great time to change belts. I also found out the fan shroud I bought is not for my car. go figure. It is too narrow.

 

[turtle5353]

Nice job!! For the header leaks I would get a set of copper gaskets. I have always used copper gaskets and never had a leak. And they are reuseable. Had mine on and off at least half dozen times with no issues.

 

[rottenralph]

Next job will be the pushrod guide plate and adjustable rocker arms. That may finally make the car run right.

 

[rottenralph]

Seems my oil leak has become almost non existent now that my dampener is replaced. Is it possible that all that vibrating was allowing oil to get by something

 

[MotoArts]

Your old balancer probably had a groove worn in it from the rubber seal on the timing cover.

 

[cudak888]

I put my Pioneer Dampener on and had some fun doing it today. I will post pics of the harmonic balancer that came off and I think it looks crooked an has some odd scrates from hitting the timing indicator or whatever it is called.

Those scratches were not on the rear circumference of the damper, were they? Any such scratches would suggest your timing chain cover is not seating correctly on the oil pan and is popping forward on the bottom.

-Kurt

 

[rottenralph]

It is out for some paint repairs. When I get is back I will have a look. thanks for the feedback guys.