Here is my 408C

[73' mach 1]

So here's the deal on the motor. There isn't anyone around me with a really good name for engine building and especially for the Cleveland side of things. I know there are engine builders who specialize is certain engines but I guess what makes them special in squeezing every last bit of HP out of that specific engine. Saying all that to say this...a Chevy guy built my engine! I went with this guy on the recommendation of the guy whos helping me put my car back together. This guy is a math guy who builds some pretty serious LSX race engines. I only wanted one person to build the engine and this guy doesn't have people working for him. 

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I'm sure there are a couple schools of though here but you're either the guy who's just having someone machine everything for you and you'll put it back together, you're the guy who's going to supply everything to the builder and hope that all goes well with what you got...or you can put it all in the builders hands and hope he can come through with your expectations for the car. I know the last requires trust and I trust my friend whos helping me.

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I explained to the builder I wanted to use my factory 4V open chamber heads and was looking for a good reliable 408C street cruiser with good idle that can run on pump gas. The only parts I provided were the blue thunder intake, kevko oil pan and roller master timing chain. 

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Here's what I got back. 

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Scat cast crank with forged I beams and forged pistons.

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Not sure of the valve springs. It says "BRE kit"

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Pushrods are Manley

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Camshaft is a hydraulic roller and the specs are adv dur 286/294 @.050 224/232 with a lift of .586/.609

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Rockers are Scorpion 1.73's

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All bolts are ARP

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Valves were opened up to 2.190 (intake) and 1.710 (exhaust)

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Lifters are Morel

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Compression is 10:1

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Carb is quick fuel 750

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The rest of the set up is a TKO 600 with a .82 5th gear, 3.89's, Bilstein sport shocks, street and track roller perches,  factory upper and lower control arms, TCP 4.5 mid eye leaf springs, global west sub frame connectors, Eaton factory spring rate with 1" drop and addco 1 1/8 front sway bar. I'm sure there is some stuff I'm forgetting.

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The block was bored and honed, decked, hot tank, lifter bore sizing, pin fit, pin fit small ends, mill heads, machine for seals, install bronze liners and size, valve job (Serdi style), assemble and check/set spring heights. Everything was assembled, degreed and valvetrain geometry was verified. Now I've never heard of this machine but he said he used a "whistle" machine to check and verify compression vs calculated and all checked out to 10:1. 

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So now the bad...one is a simple fix. He really wanted to paint it. we'll he did! He painted everything! I for the life of me don't understand why someone paints the gasket surfaces. Some of it got into the exhaust ports. All easily able to be cleaned but the big fail was the lack of machine work for the 1 piece main seal. It just didn't happen. He said he doesn't feel it will leak. So he'll being seeing it again when it starts to leak. 

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So here is the engine how it is. I still have to add everything else. I picked up a koolflow water pump and still need to get a T-stat so what temp is suggested? I'm thinking about an MSD distributor maybe HEI? Thoughts?

 

[Don C]

The original rope style seals used a pin to keep them in position and to keep them from rotating. Just make sure the pin was removed from the rear main bearing cap before he installed the split-lip type seal. I believe this is one reason why people have problems with the rear main seal leaking on stroked or rebuilt engines. When the block is machined for a one-piece rear main seal it is removed by the milling.

I would go with a 192° thermostat.

DuraSpark 2 for the ignition.

 

[turtle5353]

Looks and sounds like a nice build. A duraspark will work well. But I am running an msd set up with billets distributor and 6al. A 750 carb on that size engine seems a bit small to me but I’m no expert. My 408 is running a 850 or 900 cfm quick fuel carb.

 

[73' mach 1]

Looks and sounds like a nice build. A duraspark will work well. But I am running an msd set up with billets distributor and 6al. A 750 carb on that size engine seems a bit small to me but I’m no expert. My 408 is running a 850 or 900 cfm  quick fuel carb.

That's concerning. I still need a fuel pump also. Can I get away with a High Volume Mechanical Fuel Pump or do I need to do an in tank system? I really hope I can get away with the 750 for a street car. How bad would be? I dont want to undercarb it.

 

[turtle5353]

I am running a stock style fuel pump. Nothing fancy and I have never had my car starve for fuel. The 750 should be fine as long as it’s jetted properly. I’m sure others will chime in about carb also.

 

[Don C]

Although you won't realize your full power potential the 750 will have better street manners than a larger carburetor.

A good mechanical fuel pump will supply your carburetor. You won't need an in-tank pump unless/until you add a fuel injection system. Even then you won't need an in-tank pump if you use a surge tank.

If you do want an electric fuel pump an in-line pump will do just fine.

Even though your rebuilder is mostly a Chevy guy it sounds like he did his homework. The cam choice sounds like a good one. The machine he used to check the compression is a Whistler

https://store.katechengines.com/mobile/whistler-compression-ratio-tester-p174.aspx

Do you know if he installed hardened valve seats?

What transmission and rear end ratio will you be running?

 

[73' mach 1]

Although you won't realize your full power potential the 750 will have better street manners than a larger carburetor.

A good mechanical fuel pump will supply your carburetor. You won't need an in-tank pump unless/until you add a fuel injection system. Even then you won't need an in-tank pump if you use a surge tank.

If you do want an electric fuel pump an in-line pump will do just fine.

Even though your rebuilder is mostly a Chevy guy it sounds like he did his homework. The cam choice sounds like a good one. The machine he used to check the compression is a Whistler

https://store.katechengines.com/mobile/whistler-compression-ratio-tester-p174.aspx

Do you know if he installed hardened valve seats?

What transmission and rear end ratio will you be running?

Looking at the build sheet he used Viton valve seats. That's all it says. He did do a lot of work to the heads. He said with him opening them up he went through and through them. I'm sure most wouldn't of put the time and money into open chamber heads but I'm good with it.

The trans is a TKO 600 with a .82 5th gear and the rear is 3.89's looking at a 28" tall tire.

 

[73' mach 1]

Although you won't realize your full power potential the 750 will have better street manners than a larger carburetor.

A good mechanical fuel pump will supply your carburetor. You won't need an in-tank pump unless/until you add a fuel injection system. Even then you won't need an in-tank pump if you use a surge tank.

If you do want an electric fuel pump an in-line pump will do just fine.

Even though your rebuilder is mostly a Chevy guy it sounds like he did his homework. The cam choice sounds like a good one. The machine he used to check the compression is a Whistler

https://store.katechengines.com/mobile/whistler-compression-ratio-tester-p174.aspx

Do you know if he installed hardened valve seats?

What transmission and rear end ratio will you be running?

Looking at the build sheet he used Viton valve seats. That's all it says. He did do a lot of work to the heads. He said with him opening them up he went through and through them. I'm sure most wouldn't of put the time and money into open chamber heads but I'm good with it.

The trans is a TKO 600 with a .82 5th gear and the rear is 3.89's looking at a 28" tall tire.

Forgot the add that the cam is a 112 LSA

 

[Canted 393]

Here is the top of the line mechanical fuel pump, I am running 2 of them in different 351C cars.

https://www.robbmcperformance.com/products/ford550.html

 

[Don C]

Viton would be the valve stem seals, which are positive seals, instead of the umbrellas.

When you said that he opened up the valves to the larger sizes I'm assuming you have the small valve CJ 4V open chamber heads. I'm guessing that when he did that he installed the hardened seats, as he would have had to machine them, anyway.

There's nothing wrong with the open chamber heads, especially with a stroker. If you had the closed chamber heads you would have had to use dished pistons to get the compression ratio down to a controllable level, which would result in the loss of some of the quench effect of the closed chamber heads. He likely used flat top pistons with your heads. With 10:1 CR and your cam your dynamic compression ratio will be low enough that you shouldn't have any pinging problems.

Your transmission and rear end should give you an enjoyable ride. You certainly won't have any problem smoking the tires.

 

[OzCoupe72]

Looks like a good set up especially cam selection. Carby should be fine, Holley recommends the 770 based on my similar setup to yours.

Pity about the machining for the seal not done. From memory the Scat 4.000 inch cranks do away with the oil slinger so one piece seal is almost mandatory.

Can also recommend the Rob Mac fuel pump just remember you may need to upgrade your fuel lines to 1/2 inch and this pump sits close or even touches the oil filter, no problem just need to put a small dent in the filter once installed for clearance.

Good luck with the build

 

[73' mach 1]

Ok cool. I'll look into those pumps. So...I know I'm not taking this engine apart to cut the main. How bad of a leak/drip can I expect here? With regards to oil he said I can use regular Valvoline 10W-30. I imagine synthetic would make it worse.

 

[Canted 393]

Just use Valvoline VR1 10w30

 

[73' mach 1]

Just use Valvoline VR1 10w30

Yes, he did say VR1. Thanks

 

[c9zx]

If the rear main two part seal was properly installed it shouldn't be a problem. What will be a problem, if not addressed, is the flywheel bolt holes in the crank are through drilled by SCAT (and most others). The oil will leach around the bolts causing an annoying leak that many mistake for a rear main seal leak. Getting it sealed up can be a challenge.

For street use the 750 is fine. If you turn it into a dedicated drag car something larger is in order. Allstar sells a mechanical pump that will work for street use. I don't know if it would work in a pure race environment. Traction under acceleration will be very hard to find and chassis wind-up will be pronounced (fun at first, then annoying). Enjoy the build. Chuck

 

[73' mach 1]

If the rear main two part seal was properly installed it shouldn't be a problem. What will be a problem, if not addressed, is the flywheel bolt holes in the crank are through drilled by SCAT (and most others). The oil will leach around the bolts causing an annoying leak that many mistake for a rear main seal leak. Getting it sealed up can be a challenge.

For street use the 750 is fine. If you turn it into a dedicated drag car something larger is in order. Allstar sells a mechanical pump that will work for street use. I don't know if it would work in a pure race environment. Traction under acceleration will be very hard to find and chassis wind-up will be pronounced (fun at first, then annoying). Enjoy the build. Chuck

Any suggestions on addressing the bolts or holes to avoid leaks? I'm sure traction will be interesting. I'm doing the best I can with traction bars, weld on subframe connectors, big tires and good leaf springs. Only problem that will still have to get addressed is the 28 spline. I don't plan to drive like a complete ass but definitely some spirited driving.

 

[turtle5353]

Yes traction will be a problem but its a fun problem!! I can land on the throttle at 45-50mph and the tires will go up in smoke. Just be careful its a handful!!! if you roll onto the throttle instead of stabbing it, it pulls like a freight train!

 

[73' mach 1]

Yes traction will be a problem but its a fun problem!!   I can land on the throttle at 45-50mph and the tires will go up in smoke.  Just be careful its a handful!!!  if you roll onto the throttle instead of stabbing it, it pulls like a freight train!

Man! I haven't driven power in a long time so I will definitely be easing into it. I went this way with the power right out of the gate because I know how I am. If I went through all this as a real mild build sooner than later I would of been kicking myself wishing I went with more power. I'd rather have the power and adjust to it vs wanting more and not having it.

What tires are you using? I'm torn because I'm trying to find a good compromise between the stickiest street tire I can find and a DR. I'm worried that a good DR might stick too good and break it sooner than later. I'm not ready to change the spline out. I figured the best street tire with some slip would be good enough. Again, not driving like a complete ass.....at first!

 

[turtle5353]

I am running cooper cobras on it now. Nothing fancy at all.  They are relatively cheap. And I go through a set either every year or every other year.  So I don't buy good tires because I'm very immature and love doing burnouts!!!! lollerz

:banana: :banana: