Starting Problems

[Don C]

Or, the float in the carburetor is stuck, flooding the engine, causing your original fouled spark plug problems.

 

[icejawa]

Any way I can check this? If I do find it stuck can I fix that also? The original plugs looked like they weren't changed in 20 years they were so rusty, but I think I am the one who fouled them that badly by screwing with the carb. Thanks again for the help

 

[Don C]

Crank it for 15 or 20 seconds to give the fuel pump time to pump some and pull the top off the top of the carburetor to see what the fuel level is. Also look in the bottom of the fuel bowls for debris. If the fuel level is too high get a repair kit and pull the carburetor and rebuild it.

If there is debris in the bowls replace the fuel filter.

 

[icejawa]

I took the top of the carb off and it appears that everything is working just a bit of carbon here and there but I cleaned it off. The fuel bowls aren't flooded or anything and no debris in them. I recharged battery to 95% and cranked it a few times and still it will not start. i did notice there is a puddle under the passenger's floor pan. The liquid is a yellowish appearance. Could this be fuel mixed with oil leaking from somewhere? Or coolant or trans fluid? I can not tell since it smells like nothing.

 

[73pony]

Yellow or yellowish green? If it was fuel or oil you would smell it. Might be coolant. Trans fluid you would smell as well as you have a 4 speed correct. It would be an oil like texture. Can you see where it is coming from?

 

[icejawa]

I will have to lift the car tomorrow to see exactly, there are drips coming off the passenger side floor panel close to the jack spot. Also I think it is possible my float in my carb is broken and causing a flooded condition in the carb, I can smell gas in there really pungent. After taking the carb top off a 2nd time after a few attempts to start the car there is a puddle of gas in the fuel bowls and the float is just sitting in it.

The new spark plugs solved the engine knock noise, which probably means that was the fouled spark plugs igniting the fuel on them. Perhaps now no gas is getting to the engine since the float appears to be broken...

 

[Fabrice]

You have now multiple issues thats obvious and you will have to check everything from beginning... Tho, I asked if you tested the wire volts on coil KOEOFF. While this may sound totally off the equation, you replied later on that it starts but won't fire up. I know 2 guys overhere who were having same start probs with same engine, same year. Turns out the keyswitch has one design flaw and can loose contact when you stop kranking. As the cleveland can be flooded very quickly, the problem gets increasingly hard to locate every time you try. For the flooding issue, just remove the plugs, dry them. Wait a few put them back. If you retry, and carb is loaded, floor pedal, do not pump. As you have compression, too much fuel, if timing is set to safe, say 10 deg btdc, vaccum advance removed, distributor cap with no cracks and wires set in right order. Even if carb is way too rich, it should start, with black colored exaust fumes for sure, but it should run at least for few seconds before die because of too rich condition. If it does, carb is likely the bad guy, if not, recheck timing and distributor.

 

[Bill73Ragtop]

i did notice there is a puddle under the passenger's floor pan. The liquid is a yellowish appearance.

It's antifreeze coolant leaking out of your heater core.   You can disconnect the hoses in the engine compartment where they connect to the heater core at the firewall and hook them together.  This will create a loop by-passing the core until you resolve your starting issues.

Although some have been successful in replacing the core without pulling the dash and the heater plenum, its almost just as much work either way.  IMO you get better results pulling the plenum and the dash.

 

[icejawa]

I took the whole carb off of the engine and cleaned it out, and readjusted the floats. Then I recharged the battery to full. The problem is probably for sure my distributor being set wrong, which is also why it was running rough at idle and misfiring while it still did start. I am going to check it a second time and try using a jump cable from my battery's + terminal to the + end of the ignition coil.

And yes the leak is coolant it is a yellow green color. It indeed is leaking from the heater core area and I hooked the hoses together to bypass it while I try to fix the start problem

 

[Fabrice]

yes bypassing the ignition key circuit, will tell you directly if this line is playing a role...

Regarding the heater core, I changed mine on the 73, on my previous 5.0 91 t-bird and my current 5.0 93. It's like Ford places a heater core on floor and build cars around it. It's the only part that makes me swear that much per minute! The designers behind this, should be send a week to a "heater core change camp" )

 

[icejawa]

The distributor is almost timed correctly, enough for the car to run I would think. Is it possible my old battery is not putting out enough crank amps? When I took it out I could hear the liquid inside sloshing around inside of the battery, which means alot must be gone. I had to recharge this battery at least 3 times this year. I am honestly unsure of the age of the battery but I will replace it and the terminal cables.

The battery is only 600 cold crank amps anyways, I am going to try to get the highest cranking amps that will fit in the compartment. I am thinking a everstart maxx 24f battery from walmart since I hear they're pretty good, and they have 750 CCA so I would assume 935 CA?

 

[73pony]

Almost timed correctly??????

What is almost timed correctly? What does the timing show when cranking?

A weak battery will not keep your car from starting if it has enough juice to turn it over.

Have you pulled the new plugs to see what they look and smell like after all of this cranking?

 

[icejawa]

Pulled them and they smell lightly of gas, look new still.

I have a MSD Pro billet distributor and the points look new still and gaps are what the manual says they should be. The rotor is new looking still too

as for the timing 18 deg and I set initial at 16. That gives me 34

 

[73pony]

Did you verify that it is at 16 with a timing light while cranking? Also in my past experience MSD distributors are junk.

 

[icejawa]

Yes I did and yeah MSD probably is crap due to the hell I am going through with it lol

 

[73pony]

16 might be a little much initial depending on your set up but that would not keep it from starting and running.

 

[icejawa]

Now the carb makes a squirt noise and shoots gas out of the barrels thoughts?

 

[Don C]

Sounds to me like the float is not shutting off the fuel flow into the carburetor.

I agree with Jason, I would back the timing off some (after you get your carburetor sorted out). Are you running ported or manifold vacuum advance?

 

[icejawa]

Ported advance I have the carb off and there is a pool of gas in the passenger side manifold barrel

 

[73pony]

You have raw fuel pooling inside the manifold? How much? Have you pulled the valve covers to verify the valves are opening and closing and at the right time? Also "shoots gas out of the barrels"? Is it coming out the top??