Unusual request

[c9zx]

Can someone with a 351C measure the overall (straight line) installed length of the dipstick tube from the block to the top of the tube? Mine measures 7.5 inches. Thanks Chuck

 

[Doug's 73 Mach1]

My 1973 351C Q code, 4 speed measures 8 1/4"

 

[jpaz]

On my 72 Q code auto, it’s 8 1/4

 

[c9zx]

My thanks to both of you for taking the time to measure for me. I remeasured mine, with better lighting, it is just under 8 1/4. I'm trying to figure out why the oil level is .75 inch too high on the dip stick. The dipstick seems to be correct D0AE-6750-A. The Canton pan says it brings "system" capacity to 7 quarts with filter. Did I just mis-count quarts at last oil change, is Canton wrong, or am I missing something obvious? Chuck
P. S. No, there is not gas or coolant in the oil.

 

[tony-muscle]

My thanks to both of you for taking the time to measure for me. I remeasured mine, with better lighting, it is just under 8 1/4. I'm trying to figure out why the oil level is .75 inch too high on the dip stick. The dipstick seems to be correct D0AE-6750-A. The Canton pan says it brings "system" capacity to 7 quarts with filter. Did I just mis-count quarts at last oil change, is Canton wrong, or am I missing something obvious? Chuck
P. S. No, there is not gas or coolant in the oil.

I am assuming that you are counting the about 1/2 quart in the oil filter. It is possible that they assume the Boss dip stick which has the marks higher to allow for one more quart of oil, which makes sense because any Cleveland should be able to run that extra quart.

 

[c9zx]

I have no idea what Canton assumed. I guess I shouldn't care much. The car almost never sees more than 1/2 throttle and barely gets driven, less than 1000 miles since completion in 2012. I changed the oil again last year out of false guilt. So, I'm not concerned about excess windage. Anyone want to buy a 529 HP/ 496 TQ Concours Driven Gold Mustang? Thanks for the replies guys. Have a good weekend. Chuck

 

[Stanglover]

I know that my oil dipstick is a repop, the engine builder broke the original, and it is 8 -8 1/4" depending on which side of it you measure.
I typically run with the level about 1 pint high on the stick or about 1/4". That's about 4.5 liters.

 

[c9zx]

Stanglover, It sounds like I may have added an extra quart or so. I normally don't make such mistakes but, perhaps. Thanks for the reply. Chuck

 

[tony-muscle]

Just measured mine and it is 8 1/4" as well.

 

[jpaz]

My thanks to both of you for taking the time to measure for me. I remeasured mine, with better lighting, it is just under 8 1/4. I'm trying to figure out why the oil level is .75 inch too high on the dip stick. The dipstick seems to be correct D0AE-6750-A. The Canton pan says it brings "system" capacity to 7 quarts with filter. Did I just mis-count quarts at last oil change, is Canton wrong, or am I missing something obvious? Chuck
P. S. No, there is not gas or coolant in the oil.

Chuck, mine is the same way. I did an oil change and I just put little scrape mark on the dipstick. I just figured it must be a repo mistake and I just made sure I had 5 quarts in.
No problem to help you out, not only do you help everyone out on here if you can, but I’ll never forget you taking time out to talk with me on the phone about my engine build.

 

[Stanglover]

Stanglover, It sounds like I may have added an extra quart or so. I normally don't make such mistakes but, perhaps. Thanks for the reply. Chuck

If it really really bothers you, you could either take the filter off, drain and replace it, or pull the plug, but that get's a bit messy. Ask me how I know!
For the oil change I did last Spring, I bought a 5 liter (1.32US Gal) jug of Castrol 10W30 and, knowing an extra (US) quart is ok, I added the entire jug. The oil level was about 1/2" above the mark, so then I got nervous and drained some out. I wasted a top-up.
The issue I realized and correct me if I'm wrong, but the Boss oil pan has a windage tray or baffle in it whereas a normal 351C does not, allowing oil to slosh around more.

 

[Hemikiller]

From my time at Canton, we always told people to put in the recommended amount of system quarts, run the engine to fill the filter, then mark the dipstick at the new "full" mark.

The Boss 351, 351HO and the 351CJ had the rear scraper and the slosh baffle over the sump. Many 70-74 351C had the sump baffle only.

 

[basstrix]

Some additional info. These measures are from the pan rail to the level of water in a level OEM H code pan. I also did this with an 8 quart pan I was installing to replace the OEM. The 2 quart number is the distance from pan rail to top of baffle.

 

[timachone]

From my time at Canton, we always told people to put in the recommended amount of system quarts, run the engine to fill the filter, then mark the dipstick at the new "full" mark.

The Boss 351, 351HO and the 351CJ had the rear scraper and the slosh baffle over the sump. Many 70-74 351C had the sump baffle only.

View attachment 67212

Same here with my Moroso 351c 7 qts capacity oil pan (8 in.). It has the typical t-shaped front sump (3 in.) with the slosh baffle and a rear side scraper. I always thought that it is constructed for the OEM dip stick to match if you fill the advised capacity. But with 7 quarts (+ 1/2 in the filter) and an OEM dipstick with tube it is way over the OEM full mark. I first thought I made a mistake by filling it with one quart too much or so. I released the whole oil and made it again, quart by quart. But I was correct, almost 7 quarts in there. I now made the decision to made that the new full and marked the dip stick from there. Which I now see confirmed thanks to this thread.

Tim

 

[tony-muscle]

For whatever is worth it I wanted to post this picture I took when I assembled my engine. This is with a Kevco pan. The instructions stated to fill up to the top of the T sump. As you can see in the picture the top of the T sump is about 1/2" above the mark on the dipstick. In the picture the top of the blue tape corresponds to the full mark, while the bottom of the horizontal steel bracket corresponds to the top of the T sump.

 

[MikeyV]

Sorry for bringing up a semi-old post - but I'm going thru the same thing with a Moroso/Canton 7 quart pan looking way overfull on a stock dipstick.

I've heard a lot of things.
Engine guy says it holds 7 quarts plus whatever is in the filter. I can usually get 20 oz or so into the filter.
Internet guys say they run between 4 and 7 quarts.

I've been putting in 6 quarts total for the engine's first three oil fills. Seems fine.

What I can't understand is why the full fill would be so high above the stock level - which a stock dipstick would read no matter how much oil was below the stick in the pan of whatever volume.

So why do they raise the oil level from the stock level the Ford engineers designed? Did the Boss 351 take 6 quarts in the same old pan?
If so, then maybe they're using that higher oil level to get to 6, and the T shaped pan to get the 7th quart?

Anyway, I feel good at 6 quarts total (which reads a little more than 1/4" over full mark on a stock stick), but it also is good to hear HemiKiller say that Canton recommended the 7 quarts and marking a new full mark on the dipstick. That's what the "verbiage" on the website seems to imply. 7 quart system capacity - total.

Also, I'm sure there's at LEAST 1/2 quart left in the pan after draining. The bung is not flush with the bottom of the pan really. So I don't think it all comes out when it's changed. I try to tilt the car, but can only tilt so much.

Cheers!

 

[cjstaci]

Oil level with engine running is lower due to the volume of oil throughout the engine. Maybe that’s a consideration when oil capacity is listed.

 

[MikeyV]

Oil level with engine running is lower due to the volume of oil throughout the engine. Maybe that’s a consideration when oil capacity is listed.

That's a good point. Never thought of that. Soon as you start the engine, there's probably a quart or two up in the engine and not in the pan.

 

[Q1SVT]

... Ford designed the Boss and 4V heads to hold more oil within the heads. It helps to cool the valve springs. 2V heads drain more oil into the block valley then the pan. It drains faster than a Boss/4V heads. And why you always want to run more oil with boss/4V heads [unless you drive like an old lady...] Sustained high RPM can run the oil pan dry.

Look at the area of the heads on the intake side between the pushrod holes...

69 boss, 70+ 2V, 70 4V pictures

 

[basstrix]

... Ford designed the Boss and 4V heads to hold more oil within the heads. It helps to cool the valve springs.

Interesting....I've never heard that about intentionally holding oil in the top end. There certainly is a huge difference in the available area for drain-back in the 2v vs the 4v. Do you have any articles or direct references from Ford that state this?