3- Point Seat Belts w/o neck rash!

[Mister 4x4]

No worries - and I wasn't bashing your set-up, sorry if you took offense on that. I don't have kids either, so the back seat is really not much more than a formality for me. Your set-up works for you, and you like it just fine... and that's all that really matters.

The fully sheathed plastic just looks kinda "late-model cheap" to me... again, my opinion. Then again, I'm also that guy who thinks wood grain vinyl trim belongs on the side of a Country Squire Station Wagon... not in a hot rod like a Mach 1.

Jeff's idea could also lend itself for a restomod-minded individual to maybe take it to the next level and make an artistic statement with the pieces, a la Ring Brothers 5-point harness mounts on the Dragon show car (for example).

 

[Austin Vert]

I love my droplink (that's mine in the fourth image on your post). Weird that they seem to be readily available here in Australia and not in the rest of the world though; I would have thought they'd be used everywhere in the US with the amount of different hardtops built in the US over the years. When I first bought my car it was the first thing I noticed that the original seat belt was cutting into my neck and I remember thinking surely they wouldn't have come out of the factory this way?? I had to change the seat belts to Australian Design Rules approved though, so made sure the new belts I got had a droplink in them.

Hi Brett,

Quick question. Has your State Government recently relaxed the seat belt laws regarding classic cars? They have in Queensland, and now i'm allowed to have lap only belts in my Vert, and factory belts in my Mach 1. ( the Mach has original factory belts installed already) I was angry over this, as i spent a large sum of money and went to great deal of trouble to install and modify new lap and sash belts for the Vert after i bought it in 2011. You HAD to have lap and sash belts installed back then. The position of the shoulder anchor bolt has to be located in a small confined area, and so now, the quarter window winder cranks hits the anchor bolts covers every time you wind the glass up and down. That's a real pain in the neck. Now i can use the original American factory belts that were in the car when i bought it.:shootself:

Sorry Eric, didn't mean to hi jack your post.

Greg.

 

[MT91106]

lol great fix guys but you have to remember this was built in the 70's where your mom's arm was your safety as a kid no child safety seats etc. Shoulder harness was detachable because they did not see a use for them back in the day they did not even want to put seat belts in cars because they "Implied they were not safe" so modern upgrades are the trick to make our cars safer or you just do like our parents did and risk it.

 

[EBSTANG]

I love my droplink (that's mine in the fourth image on your post). Weird that they seem to be readily available here in Australia and not in the rest of the world though; I would have thought they'd be used everywhere in the US with the amount of different hardtops built in the US over the years. When I first bought my car it was the first thing I noticed that the original seat belt was cutting into my neck and I remember thinking surely they wouldn't have come out of the factory this way?? I had to change the seat belts to Australian Design Rules approved though, so made sure the new belts I got had a droplink in them.

Hi Brett,

Quick question. Has your State Government recently relaxed the seat belt laws regarding classic cars? They have in Queensland, and now i'm allowed to have lap only belts in my Vert, and factory belts in my Mach 1. ( the Mach has original factory belts installed already) I was angry over this, as i spent a large sum of money and went to great deal of trouble to install and modify new lap and sash belts for the Vert after i bought it in 2011. You HAD to have lap and sash belts installed back then. The position of the shoulder anchor bolt has to be located in a small confined area, and so now, the quarter window winder cranks hits the anchor bolts covers every time you wind the glass up and down. That's a real pain in the neck. Now i can use the original American factory belts that were in the car when i bought it.:shootself:

Sorry Eric, didn't mean to hi jack your post.

Greg.

...my thread, your thread, our thread, it's all good to me Greg...come and hang out anytime. ::thumb::

No worries - and I wasn't bashing your set-up, sorry if you took offense on that. I don't have kids either, so the back seat is really not much more than a formality for me. Your set-up works for you, and you like it just fine... and that's all that really matters.

The fully sheathed plastic just looks kinda "late-model cheap" to me... again, my opinion. Then again, I'm also that guy who thinks wood grain vinyl trim belongs on the side of a Country Squire Station Wagon... not in a hot rod like a Mach 1.

Jeff's idea could also lend itself for a restomod-minded individual to maybe take it to the next level and make an artistic statement with the pieces, a la Ring Brothers 5-point harness mounts on the Dragon show car (for example).

It's all good E, I was just bustin' your balls...and they say us northerners are harsh, we got nothin' on a Texan I know! rofl

You know, you could just not use the "ugly rubber sleeve," and hang it just like this...or cut it shorter (the sleeve) to look like Brett's. I think I now definitely have a sleeve complex!

 

[Jeff73Mach1]

Y'all are both looking at solutions that fit your particular problems. I don't think there are "right" answers. My solution is not elegant, but my intent is to add either a roll cage or at least a custom harness bar, so my solution was more of a quick and dirty modification with parts I had laying around. I was discussing modifications with a friend and we came to the conclusion that a hot rodder would make a modification that works and then move on, rather than getting bogged down with the idea of making it perfect (ala my wheel well enlargement we could have made all our cuts perfect and welded it up in a manner that would have been virtually invisible-instead we lapped panels and welded both seams and covered it all with plenty of seam sealer and undercoating. Good enough) Making a restomod can result in a higher level of finish. You are both working as craftsmen- and that requires a higher level of artistry to be involved. I think both of your solutions are fantastic.

I am clearly a hot rodder

 

[EBSTANG]

Y'all are both looking at solutions that fit your particular problems. I don't think there are "right" answers. My solution is not elegant, but my intent is to add either a roll cage or at least a custom harness bar, so my solution was more of a quick and dirty modification with parts I had laying around. I was discussing modifications with a friend and we came to the conclusion that a hot rodder would make a modification that works and then move on, rather than getting bogged down with the idea of making it perfect (ala my wheel well enlargement we could have made all our cuts perfect and welded it up in a manner that would have been virtually invisible-instead we lapped panels and welded both seams and covered it all with plenty of seam sealer and undercoating. Good enough) Making a restomod can result in a higher level of finish. You are both working as craftsmen- and that requires a higher level of artistry to be involved. I think both of your solutions are fantastic.

I am clearly a hot rodder

I wanna be a hot rodder, I just can't help myself.:-/

 

[Flatback72]

Hi Brett,

Quick question. Has your State Government recently relaxed the seat belt laws regarding classic cars? They have in Queensland, and now i'm allowed to have lap only belts in my Vert, and factory belts in my Mach 1. ( the Mach has original factory belts installed already) I was angry over this, as i spent a large sum of money and went to great deal of trouble to install and modify new lap and sash belts for the Vert after i bought it in 2011. You HAD to have lap and sash belts installed back then. The position of the shoulder anchor bolt has to be located in a small confined area, and so now, the quarter window winder cranks hits the anchor bolts covers every time you wind the glass up and down. That's a real pain in the neck. Now i can use the original American factory belts that were in the car when i bought it.:shootself:

Sorry Eric, didn't mean to hi jack your post.

Greg.

Hi Greg

There's a bloke at my work who is getting a LHD '71 Torino ready for registration. I asked him yesterday about the seat belts and he said his engineer expects Australian Design Rules approved sash seat belt for all four corner seats, and he is allowed to use ADR approved lap belts for the centre seats only. So no, it doesn't look like they've relaxed the rules in any way down here in VIC.

Brett

 

[Austin Vert]

Thanks Brett,

Interesting feedback.:chin: Yeah, it could mean different rules for different States again. More out of step State rubbish like before.

Australia - 24 million people and six States with different rules - crazy.:shootself:

Greg.

 

[Flatback72]

Thanks Brett,

Interesting feedback.:chin: Yeah, it could mean different rules for different States again. More out of step State rubbish like before.

Australia - 24 million people and six States with different rules - crazy.:shootself:

Greg.

Could be worse Greg, think of all the poor buggers over in South Australia. Their nanny government won't let them modify their LHD cars away from stock configuration at all. If it doesn't look exactly as it did when it left the factory then it's not allowed on the road at all.... :shootself:

To be honest, I didn't begrudge being made to put new lap/sash belts all round, it's nice to know that myself and passengers are as safe as it's possible to be in the event of a stack.

 

[Austin Vert]

Thanks Brett,

Interesting feedback.:chin: Yeah, it could mean different rules for different States again. More out of step State rubbish like before.

Australia - 24 million people and six States with different rules - crazy.:shootself:

Greg.

Could be worse Greg, think of all the poor buggers over in South Australia. Their nanny government won't let them modify their LHD cars away from stock configuration at all. If it doesn't look exactly as it did when it left the factory then it's not allowed on the road at all.... :shootself:

To be honest, I didn't begrudge being made to put new lap/sash belts all round, it's nice to know that myself and passengers are as safe as it's possible to be in the event of a stack.

Yeah Brett,

good point - that is very true for sure.

Greg.

 

[Mister 4x4]

Through all of this, nobody has yet answered my question of how to get the extended drop links onto a modern 3-point set-up without having to disassemble the whole thing - which could render it inoperable.

Is that the case, because I can't see a was to slip the non-drop link that came with the belt kit off, and install the new one without having to remove the 'reel end' of the belt from the auto-rewind mechanism, or otherwise getting the latch plate (the part you pull across your body and click into the latch) to fit through the metal loop.

I don't believe they're designed to be taken apart and re-sewed by the customer, either.

So, before I order a set for mine and potentially waste the money, does anybody have any explanation on how to swap the new drop links onto existing 3-point belts?

 

[tony-muscle]

I think there are companies that can take them apart (or cut) and re-stitch the end. When I bought my seat belt from Don from Ohio they were too long. He had me send the belt to the manufacturer where they cut it and restitched it together.

Through all of this, nobody has yet answered my question of how to get the extended drop links onto a modern 3-point set-up without having to disassemble the whole thing - which could render it inoperable.

Is that the case, because I can't see a was to slip the non-drop link that came with the belt kit off, and install the new one without having to remove the 'reel end' of the belt from the auto-rewind mechanism, or otherwise getting the latch plate (the part you pull across your body and click into the latch) to fit through the metal loop.

I don't believe they're designed to be taken apart and re-sewed by the customer, either.

So, before I order a set for mine and potentially waste the money, does anybody have any explanation on how to swap the new drop links onto existing 3-point belts?

 

[OMS]

Through all of this, nobody has yet answered my question of how to get the extended drop links onto a modern 3-point set-up without having to disassemble the whole thing - which could render it inoperable.

Is that the case, because I can't see a was to slip the non-drop link that came with the belt kit off, and install the new one without having to remove the 'reel end' of the belt from the auto-rewind mechanism, or otherwise getting the latch plate (the part you pull across your body and click into the latch) to fit through the metal loop.

I don't believe they're designed to be taken apart and re-sewed by the customer, either.

So, before I order a set for mine and potentially waste the money, does anybody have any explanation on how to swap the new drop links onto existing 3-point belts?

I don't think anyone should cut and re-sew a safety belt.

You will not know if it holds until you need it the most.

It's not worth the risk.

 

[tony-muscle]

Through all of this, nobody has yet answered my question of how to get the extended drop links onto a modern 3-point set-up without having to disassemble the whole thing - which could render it inoperable.

Is that the case, because I can't see a was to slip the non-drop link that came with the belt kit off, and install the new one without having to remove the 'reel end' of the belt from the auto-rewind mechanism, or otherwise getting the latch plate (the part you pull across your body and click into the latch) to fit through the metal loop.

I don't believe they're designed to be taken apart and re-sewed by the customer, either.

So, before I order a set for mine and potentially waste the money, does anybody have any explanation on how to swap the new drop links onto existing 3-point belts?

I don't think anyone should cut and re-sew a safety belt.

You will not know if it holds until you need it the most.

It's not worth the risk.

However, that said, can we rely on companies that have "experience" with belts? I guess the question is how we define experience, but I guess a belt manufacturer should know how to do it. Are there any standards that have to be followed when doing this work?

 

[OMS]

Through all of this, nobody has yet answered my question of how to get the extended drop links onto a modern 3-point set-up without having to disassemble the whole thing - which could render it inoperable.

Is that the case, because I can't see a was to slip the non-drop link that came with the belt kit off, and install the new one without having to remove the 'reel end' of the belt from the auto-rewind mechanism, or otherwise getting the latch plate (the part you pull across your body and click into the latch) to fit through the metal loop.

I don't believe they're designed to be taken apart and re-sewed by the customer, either.

So, before I order a set for mine and potentially waste the money, does anybody have any explanation on how to swap the new drop links onto existing 3-point belts?

I don't think anyone should cut and re-sew a safety belt.

You will not know if it holds until you need it the most.

It's not worth the risk.

However, that said, can we rely on companies that have "experience" with belts? I guess the question is how we define experience, but I guess a belt manufacturer should know how to do it. Are there any standards that have to be followed when doing this work?

Seat belts have to pass various safety regulations and standards

The manufacturer knows how and what to use to do it correctly.

A local upholstery shop... maybe

 

[Mister 4x4]

Through all of this, nobody has yet answered my question of how to get the extended drop links onto a modern 3-point set-up without having to disassemble the whole thing - which could render it inoperable.

Is that the case, because I can't see a was to slip the non-drop link that came with the belt kit off, and install the new one without having to remove the 'reel end' of the belt from the auto-rewind mechanism, or otherwise getting the latch plate (the part you pull across your body and click into the latch) to fit through the metal loop.

I don't believe they're designed to be taken apart and re-sewed by the customer, either.

So, before I order a set for mine and potentially waste the money, does anybody have any explanation on how to swap the new drop links onto existing 3-point belts?

I don't think anyone should cut and re-sew a safety belt.

You will not know if it holds until you need it the most.

It's not worth the risk.

My point exactly. I'm not keen on going that route, which is why I'm trying to find out if there's an easy D-I-Y way to swap the drop link for the non-drop link that came with my 3-point belt kit. If not, then I'll take a page from Jeff's book and make some rigid drop links to lower the position of the upper belt-link mount.

I have no intention of hacking up a perfectly good set of belts just to install a drop link that should've been purchased with the kit in the first place.

I'm a little paranoid with the whole 3-point belt system not fitting properly. If you remember Rick Allen, the drummer from Def Leppard, lost his left arm because the seat belt in his Corvette cut right through it during a high speed rollover accident. Considering that I'm 6'-5" and the belt as it sits comes over my shoulder and rides right up against my neck, I'm not at all comfortable with the idea of having a similar issue in my car (pretty sure I wouldn't be losing my arm in that case ).

But yes, you're right Don - I wouldn't want anybody but a professional disassembling/reassembling something so critical as a seat belt.

 

[tony-muscle]

I didnt know thats how he lost is arm. We better place one of those cushion covers over the belt

1971 M-code Mach 1

 

[Mister 4x4]

All any of the cites say is that his seat belt was "improperly fastened" (whatever that means) and he was ejected from the car, where his arm remained.

What I'm pretty sure I do know is that if a seat belt can cut through a shoulder joint to sever an arm during an intense car accident, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have any issues going through say, one's neck, with any more trouble. Considering the location of major blood vessels and airway that supply some of your most critical organs (brain and lungs, for instance), I wouldn't want even the possibility of minor lacerations to be caused in that area by something that's supposed to actually protect you [when installed and worn properly, that is].

 

[tony-muscle]

What I'm pretty sure I do know is that if a seat belt can cut through a shoulder joint to sever an arm during an intense car accident, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have any issues going through say, one's neck, with any more trouble. Considering the location of major blood vessels and airway that supply some of your most critical organs (brain and lungs, for instance), I wouldn't want even the possibility of minor lacerations to be caused in that area by something that's supposed to actually protect you [when installed and worn properly, that is].

100% agree... I guess that's why they are called shoulder harnesses and not neck harnesses.

 

[Jeff73Mach1]

The problem with my solution is that while the drop link is mounted to the original mounting point for the shoulder strap, the lower portion is bolted to the seatbelt. You can slide a guard over the metal, make a vinyl or leather sleeve, you can smooth it or plastidip it, but there is no getting around the fact that it isn't tested, it is only as strong as the hardware you choose to use and if it fails, it is all on you for "designing and manufacturing the part"

I accept the risks of my own modifications, I used a heavy piece of steel that is to my way of thinking stronger than anything else in the mounting system and I used good grade 8 hardware with proper and complete thread engagement and equal in size to the factory fasteners. I don't let other people drive my car for the most part.

To be clear I don't recommend doing it the way I did it. There is no engineering to back me up nor is there any testing to prove me right.