7" round projector lamps for HID conversion

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.
Has anyone converted to HIDs? I see various 7" round headlamp housings that appear to be retrofitted with projector lenses making them ideal for HID conversion, but there's so many options and price ranges vary from $50-$1000. Not sure who makes the most cost effective and good quality headlamps.

Here's a link to one of many search results: http://www.protuninglab.com/un7rosebeprh.html

 

Totalled

VIP Members
Joined
Sep 5, 2011
Messages
1,864
Reaction score
4
Location
Olympia,Wa
My Car
73 Q code Mach 1
If you did go with it, I would go with a 4300K color temp. As you get above that, it get's blue. Blue light doesn't illuminate for crap at night.

 

Mister 4x4

Too Big to Sneak
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Messages
8,032
Reaction score
241
Location
San Angelo, Texas
My Car
1971 Mustang Mach 1
Not to mention, "Annoying and dorky as Hell."

 

MechEng

VIP Members
Joined
May 29, 2013
Messages
841
Reaction score
5
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
Empty Stable Currently
I actually did quite a bit of research on this a few weeks ago because I was looking at lighting solutions. The problem with all the "projector" housings out there (especially the one you listed) is that they aren't true projector lenses. They're still made for the Halogen H4 style bulb, and many people just choose to throw an HID bulb into them. While this is better than putting a HID bulb into a more traditional housing that lacks this "projector style" lens as the light is much less likely to simply refract all over the place it's still not idea.

That being said, there are some interesting articles on the internet of people who have put true projector lenses into out 7" round headlights. This is due to the fact that Jeep Wranglers, Mini Coopers, and a few other popular vehicles share the same style of headlight. There's even a few people online that will do a true retrofit and conversion for you.

If you HAVE to go with one of these other Seudo-Projector style housings, there are some things you want to look for. You want them to be SAE and DOT approved. Many of these china based knock-offs don't carry these certifications, and you'll see it in the quality. You can also get a nice fix it ticket if you get pulled over and the cop wants to be a real stickler (very unlikely, but I've had a few friends experience this) You'll know that they're approved because they'll be listed in the product description. Gaining these approvals is an expensive process so they're usually proud of it and will throw it out there.

As far as HIDs go, 4300K is still considered a WARM temperature, meaning that there will be hints of yellow in it. 5000K is the highest light output, it's about as pure white as you can go without any blue tinting. 6000K tends to be PERCEIVED as brighter, but it's not, it has just a little bit of blue tinting too it. 5000k and 6000k are incredibly common in the HID world, replacement bulbs are easy to get, and prices are low. Stay away from 8000, 10000, and 120000, it's a Mustang for goodness sake show some respect, not to mention some of these highly colored lights are actually illegal in some states (your burden to check local legislation)

You want to make sure you get a Bi-Lamp HID kit, so that you can retain your High/Low beam operation. Many of the cheaper kits don't have a High beam option. For HIDs this is typically achieved with a small solenoid that physically moved the bulb forwards and backwards changing the focal point within the elliptical shape of the headlight housing.

Then there's 55W and 65W units, slim or normal ballasts, and a host of other options. Also remember that HIDs will almost always require you to bypass the headlight circuit to power them directly from the battery, so you'll want to fuse them yourselves. (A nice benefit though is this reduces the loading on the headlight circuit and can cause your dash lights to increase in brightness!)

An alternative to HID lights, is there are some companies offering LED 7" headlights. The one that I'm looking to use is KC Daylighter. Keep in mind, these are at the moment, quite expensive, and there's no guarantees they'll even fit, but you've got headlights for life without the need to replace. (Here's a link to the LED headlights: https://www.kchilites.com/lights/headlights/7-led-headlight-kit PRICEY!)

At the end of the day, it's your car, do what you like! But keep in mind that you don't want to blind others with poorly done headlights.

 
Last edited by a moderator:

Gonzo1970

Active member
Joined
Feb 24, 2014
Messages
31
Reaction score
0
Location
Illinois
My Car
72 Coupe
If you did go with it, I would go with a 4300K color temp. As you get above that, it get's blue. Blue light doesn't illuminate for crap at night.
Not sure if its the same for Cars Versus Motorcycles, but I went with a 8k 35W HID Kit on my bike, and the difference is absolutely incredible. I will never run a stock or even a halogen blub in a motorcycle ever again. Had I known the difference was so dramatic, I would have done it Years ago.

Hadn't thought about going HID on a car since the cars I currently have since they're all newer (2010+). I will have to think about it for the Mustang.

-Gonz

 

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.
I've got HIDs in all my other vehicles, including my motorcycle. I've got 35W 6000K H7 HIDs on the bike and they work incredibly well (and have been for years now). I put 55W 5000K H4 HIDs on my old Bronco with a Hella H4 kit and it works very well without a projector lens. Those lenses were rather pricey however, so it's no wonder they work very well; avoiding the commonly seen misdirected light and glare all over the place.

My reservation with the cheaper 7" projector lamps is exactly that, quality of materials. I want a glass lense and reflector to handle the high heat of HIDs as the composite stuff discolors over time (seen this on my motorcycle).

So is there an OEM 7" round lamp assembly that incorporates a correct projector lense? I've run the DDMTuning HID kits and they make a high/low in a single HID bulb using some kind of electromechanical aim adjustment.


I keep seeing that these are popular and appear to be DOT approved: http://www.gtrlighting.com/tru-projector-7-round-dual-beam-headlights-chrome/

 
Last edited by a moderator:

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.
I ended up going with the GTR Lighting Tru-Projector lamps. The primary reason being, they're the only true projector beam headlamps available. The lenses are glass and the high/low beam control adjusts the internal projector lens shrouding/position like real projectors work (possibly because they are real projectors). Price isn't as cheap as the $35 units, but I believe these lamps are the real deal. Haven't seen anything else on the market except for the skilled individuals who have retrofitted H4 conversion housings with OEM projector beams.

 

MechEng

VIP Members
Joined
May 29, 2013
Messages
841
Reaction score
5
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
Empty Stable Currently
I ended up going with the GTR Lighting Tru-Projector lamps. The primary reason being, they're the only true projector beam headlamps available. The lenses are glass and the high/low beam control adjusts the internal projector lens shrouding/position like real projectors work (possibly because they are real projectors). Price isn't as cheap as the $35 units, but I believe these lamps are the real deal. Haven't seen anything else on the market except for the skilled individuals who have retrofitted H4 conversion housings with OEM projector beams.
Mesozoic,

Those look like a really nice set of lights! And quite the price tag to boot. Do you have any pictures of them installed in your car? I'm curious to see what the front of the car looks like with the black headlights installed.

 

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.
I ended up going with the GTR Lighting Tru-Projector lamps. The primary reason being, they're the only true projector beam headlamps available. The lenses are glass and the high/low beam control adjusts the internal projector lens shrouding/position like real projectors work (possibly because they are real projectors). Price isn't as cheap as the $35 units, but I believe these lamps are the real deal. Haven't seen anything else on the market except for the skilled individuals who have retrofitted H4 conversion housings with OEM projector beams.
Mesozoic,

Those look like a really nice set of lights! And quite the price tag to boot. Do you have any pictures of them installed in your car? I'm curious to see what the front of the car looks like with the black headlights installed.
I placed my order and was immediately notified that they're starting to produce their Gen3 lamps now, so I deferred my order for a weeks to get those instead of the Gen2. Apparently, they're a significant upgrade over the Gen2s. Here's some pics of what they sent me:

newTruProjector.jpg

 

MechEng

VIP Members
Joined
May 29, 2013
Messages
841
Reaction score
5
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
Empty Stable Currently
Wow, those look pretty wicked. Are you getting them in the Chrome finish or the blackout finish?

 

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.
Wow, those look pretty wicked. Are you getting them in the Chrome finish or the blackout finish?
Chrome to minimize the difference in appearance from original. They told me the headlamps are all glass with metal reflectors - looking forward to running them and will definitely post pics when I get them installed.

 

460bbf

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 10, 2013
Messages
132
Reaction score
0
Location
Sapulpa, OK
My Car
72 mach 1 with A bbf
defiantly let us know how they work, I have been wanting to put HID's in my 72 ford truck but had not found a projector that would work. I was told you but an HID bulb in a standard housing and the light will scatter and blind everyone on the road.

 

74proii

VIP Members
Joined
Dec 4, 2012
Messages
100
Reaction score
0
Location
wa state
My Car
74 pro street coupe
1983 gt
1993 reef blue lx
1973 fastback f code
1973 fastback h code
2014 GT
I actually did quite a bit of research on this a few weeks ago because I was looking at lighting solutions. The problem with all the "projector" housings out there (especially the one you listed) is that they aren't true projector lenses. They're still made for the Halogen H4 style bulb, and many people just choose to throw an HID bulb into them. While this is better than putting a HID bulb into a more traditional housing that lacks this "projector style" lens as the light is much less likely to simply refract all over the place it's still not idea.

That being said, there are some interesting articles on the internet of people who have put true projector lenses into out 7" round headlights. This is due to the fact that Jeep Wranglers, Mini Coopers, and a few other popular vehicles share the same style of headlight. There's even a few people online that will do a true retrofit and conversion for you.

If you HAVE to go with one of these other Seudo-Projector style housings, there are some things you want to look for. You want them to be SAE and DOT approved. Many of these china based knock-offs don't carry these certifications, and you'll see it in the quality. You can also get a nice fix it ticket if you get pulled over and the cop wants to be a real stickler (very unlikely, but I've had a few friends experience this) You'll know that they're approved because they'll be listed in the product description. Gaining these approvals is an expensive process so they're usually proud of it and will throw it out there.

As far as HIDs go, 4300K is still considered a WARM temperature, meaning that there will be hints of yellow in it. 5000K is the highest light output, it's about as pure white as you can go without any blue tinting. 6000K tends to be PERCEIVED as brighter, but it's not, it has just a little bit of blue tinting too it. 5000k and 6000k are incredibly common in the HID world, replacement bulbs are easy to get, and prices are low. Stay away from 8000, 10000, and 120000, it's a Mustang for goodness sake show some respect, not to mention some of these highly colored lights are actually illegal in some states (your burden to check local legislation)

You want to make sure you get a Bi-Lamp HID kit, so that you can retain your High/Low beam operation. Many of the cheaper kits don't have a High beam option. For HIDs this is typically achieved with a small solenoid that physically moved the bulb forwards and backwards changing the focal point within the elliptical shape of the headlight housing.

Then there's 55W and 65W units, slim or normal ballasts, and a host of other options. Also remember that HIDs will almost always require you to bypass the headlight circuit to power them directly from the battery, so you'll want to fuse them yourselves. (A nice benefit though is this reduces the loading on the headlight circuit and can cause your dash lights to increase in brightness!)

An alternative to HID lights, is there are some companies offering LED 7" headlights. The one that I'm looking to use is KC Daylighter. Keep in mind, these are at the moment, quite expensive, and there's no guarantees they'll even fit, but you've got headlights for life without the need to replace. (Here's a link to the LED headlights: https://www.kchilites.com/lights/headlights/7-led-headlight-kit PRICEY!)

At the end of the day, it's your car, do what you like! But keep in mind that you don't want to blind others with poorly done headlights.
Ditto, although forgot to mention go with the 5th gen digital ballast, much improved.

 

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.
defiantly let us know how they work, I have been wanting to put HID's in my 72 ford truck but had not found a projector that would work. I was told you but an HID bulb in a standard housing and the light will scatter and blind everyone on the road.
Yes, that's true. That's why you need an HID specific projector housing like the GTRLighting units. I've seen some others retrofit OEM projector housings into lamps too. Still waiting on the units from GTR.

 

thendricks

Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2011
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Nebraska
My Car
1971 Mustang coupe
Thanks for all the suggestions and knowledge on this topic. I'm hoping to make my '71 into a vehicle I drive regularly. I'm often on the road before the sun or after it gas gone down so good lights are important to me and I think this is one piece of the puzzle. Being somewhere between cheap and poor and also deriving satisfaction from doing things myself I'm watching the jinkyard sourced conversions with interest.

 

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.
I forgot to post a response to this thread once I got the lamps working. They are excellent! The bi-xenon function works great and the light output is truly phenomenal.

IMG_3242.JPG

 

mdan575

VIP Members
Joined
Apr 17, 2013
Messages
460
Reaction score
3
Location
Virginia
My Car
1971 Mach 1
So that leaves me the question what bulb did you go with and just how plug and play were they?

Did you have to run additional wiring to power them bypassing the switch using a relay or something?

Did you have to modify the surrounding parts to fit them? Or did they fit nicely in the stock trim ring and design?

huh

huh

huh

Looks good though makes me think the extra money is worth it for a properly designed headlight that I can actually see with at night.

 

Mesozoic

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
415
Reaction score
2
Location
Tucson, AZ
My Car
1971 Mustang fastback restomod. Caged, stiffened, lowered, on 17" wheels with 4 wheel disc brakes and Bilstein dampers. PST polygraphite suspension kit w/Mustangs Plus springs. Custom SEFI-EDIS8 EEC-V injection based on '96 Crown Vic harness (CDAN4 strategy). 90mm induction, LMAF, 80mm Accufab TB, Edelbrock Victor intake, 42# injectors, fully ported RHS Pro Action 215 heads, long tube headers. '69 351W stroked to 408 using Scat 4340 crank, H-beam rods, SRP pistons. Comp Cams 284 Magnum hydraulic roller cam, Canton windage tray and main girdle w/blueprinted standard pressure oil pump. Serpentine conversion using late model 5.0 parts. Backed by a built 4R70W, FB Performance 3000 RPM triple-disc converter, custom alum driveshaft, stock Ford 9" w/3.50:1 billet LS.
So that leaves me the question what bulb did you go with and just how plug and play were they?

Did you have to run additional wiring to power them bypassing the switch using a relay or something?

Did you have to modify the surrounding parts to fit them? Or did they fit nicely in the stock trim ring and design?

huh

huh

huh

Looks good though makes me think the extra money is worth it for a properly designed headlight that I can actually see with at night.
The light output is nothing short of amazing. Nothing had to be modified to get them to physically fit, they dropped right in.

The electrical question is a good one, however. The wiring that comes with the units is useless because it doesn't include relays. Fear not, there is a very convenient (and cheap) solution from DDM Tuning. Using one of their harnesses, you'll likely need to replace the high/low actuation connector on each headlamp to work with the relay harness, but that's it. The DDM harness is plug and play with the ballast and lamps.

 
Top