Determing "numbers matching" on our cars

[Totalled]

Left or drivers side rear, between the top left and second bellhousing bolt.

I'm numbers matching.

 

[goodnigh]

So your engine was cast on Friday (crappy day) 30 Oct 1970 and could possibly have been used in a 1970 (2 bolt main) Torino or Mustang and was positivley used in the 1971 (4 bolt main) 351 Boss Mustang.

Remember parts control back in the day was nowhere near as tight as today and there was a lot of mixing and matching of components. If anyone else has more information I'd really like to read it.

True, unless they had a specific build order you would get whatever part was next off the shelf. Also stamped on my frame near the battery below the D1 indicates my car was built on the graveyard shift (3) :huh:

mike

 

[Shipwright]

True, unless they had a specific build order you would get whatever part was next off the shelf. Also stamped on my frame near the battery below the D1 indicates my car was built on the graveyard shift (3) :huh:

mike

Being built on the graveyard shift is actually a good thing. From what I understand things were a little more relaxed (in a good way) on the night shift.

 

[Jim and Jutta]

OK thanks to everyone I've been able to check the number stamped on the back of my engine and verified it's at least the original engine block. I couldn't do it with the mirror (could see part of the number but kept losing it, reversed and all was more than my little brain could handle) managed to do it with an inspection scope I borrowed from a friend. It showed up much clearer on the scope than the photo I've attached.



Now to try and find where the number is stamped onto the transmission, is on the rear or front top portion of the transmission?

 

[Shipwright]

If I'm not mistaken it should on the top of the transmission just forward of where the tail cone bolts on.

 

[rvrtrash]

That's correct.

Congrats on the block being original. After all this time, it's definately a plus.

Steve

 

[Jim and Jutta]

If I'm not mistaken it should on the top of the transmission just forward of where the tail cone bolts on.

I'll see if I can get the scope up there.

Found my engine number just below the lower right corner of the driver's side head. Easy way to find it (on my car) is start from the the middle of the block about an inch above where it meets the transmission and work your way left slowly left. Took my ram air cleaner off which made it much easier.

 

[M Beauchamp]

I really don't think numbers match means very much since I have seen restorers re stamp serial numbers and date codes on panels, i guess casting would be a little harder to change but not that difficult.

If you take my coupe to vert conversion for instance.

It will be number matching when i am done and the coupe was born 2 months before the vert so the date stamps will work.

So numbers match really means nothing more to me than than the car has mostly original vintage parts.

 

[Jim and Jutta]

I really don't think numbers match means very much since I have seen restorers re stamp serial numbers and date codes on panels, i guess casting would be a little harder to change but not that difficult.

If you take my coupe to vert conversion for instance.

It will be number matching when i am done and the coupe was born 2 months before the vert so the date stamps will work.

So numbers match really means nothing more to me than than the car has mostly original vintage parts.

Good points, that's why a person has to do "due diligence". Let's step back, Marti indicates the car was built December 1970, the engine stamp indicates the engine was built 30 Oct 70, had that stamp indicated it was built Jan 71 it would bring into question the Vin# stamp on it matching the body. Sure someone could also fabricate a block to match not only the Vin# but also the build date stamp... but they certainly wouldn't waste that much effort trying to pass a 71 Mustang off as a mere number matching M code Mach 1.

 

[adammark23]

Block the rear left side slightly lower than the head mounts a number will be rudely printed in block.the the same number will be printed on the top of the main. If it is a manual, will be capped top edge.

 

[Detector]

Tried getting mine via a mirror and this is what I got.

 

[72HCODE]

mine is not a full matching number

the block matches the car and the body panels are original, but the trans was changed from a FMX to a C6. also my 9" blew up and i changed the diff and gears inside the case.

 

[cobra3073]

According to MustangTek the casting # D0AE-L identifies the block as being a 1970 351C with 2 bolt mains and was used in the Torino and Mustang (unconfirmed). The same block was also used in the 1971 Boss 351 and had a four bolt main (confirmed).

The other number identifies the casting date. In the number 0K30 the first number (0) denotes the year (1970), the next letter denotes the month with A = Jan, B = Feb, C = Mar etc.. while skipping the letters I and O because they can be confused for numbers (the Military frequently does this), therefore K = Oct. the last two numbers denote the day of the month 30th.

So your engine was cast on Friday (crappy day) 30 Oct 1970 and could possibly have been used in a 1970 (2 bolt main) Torino or Mustang and was positivley used in the 1971 (4 bolt main) 351 Boss Mustang.

Remember parts control back in the day was nowhere near as tight as today and there was a lot of mixing and matching of components. If anyone else has more information I'd really like to read it.

This brings to light the sometime difference in reference materials.

My reference materials is at odds with your "MustangTek" information as it relates to the D0AE-L casting number being used with the 1971 Boss 351 and/or 4-bolt main blocks. My references show the following:

The 2-bolt main blocks for 1970 and 1971:

D0AE-A

D0AE-C

D0AE-E

D0AE-G

D0AE-J

D0AE-L

For 1972 - 1974, the 2-bolt main casting number is:

D2AE-DA

The 4-bolt main casting numbers are:

D0AE-B

D0AE-D

D0AE-F

D0AE-H

The Boss 351 casting number is:

D1ZE-A

The 351HO casting number is:

D2AE-EA

The 351 Cobra Jet number is:

D2AE-CA

Source: High Performance Ford Engine Parts Interchange by George Reid.

 

[Jim and Jutta]

Well I did find the numbers stamped on the transmission matching my car's VIN so now I know at least the engine block and transmission are original to the car so I feel better about accepting the seller's word the car was number matching when I bought it years ago.

Tons of information providedby you guys for anyone looking at buying a "reported" numbers matching car and what to take into consideration when determining it's value. I also learned there are different opinions on what a numbers matching car is, some expect the engine, trans and rearend to be original others expect the car to be more "concours numbers matching" with everything original which would make it a trailer queen (if you wanted to keep it that way). I bought mine to try and keep part of our history alive, therefore I wanted one with the original engine and transmission to try and keep it as original as possible, I also bought it for weekend cruises so by no means was I wanting a trailer queen. I would recommend anyone looking at buying a 71-73 Mustang to spend some time on this site getting to know more about our cars so they go in well informed when they inspect the cars they're interested in purchasing.

By the way, back in the late 70's while stationed in Germany as a young GI a friend of mine had shipped his 71 yellow Boss to Germany and offered to sell it to me rather than ship it back to the States, I thought the price was to high since he wanted $2,500.00 and it was about 6 years old. I drove it for a weekend but decided not to buy it because it ate up the gas on the autobahn and was to big for the narrow side roads. I told him if had the 6 cylinder and an automatic I would have been interested. Talk about an uninformed buyer!

 

[Jim and Jutta]

To further unravel the mysteries, I'm wondering why someone would take the 4V heads off and put on 2V heads, an edelbrock 2750 intake and then put the autolite 4300 carb back on. The guy I bought it from said that's the way it was when he bought it from the original owner, the 4V intake along with 4V exhaust manifolds were in the trunk when I bought the car but not the 4 V heads. The marti report shows it's a M code car based upon the dash and door vin# plus I've now determined the engine and transmission have the same last digits of the Vin stamped on them. Is there a reason someone would remove the 4V heads and put the current set up on it?

 

[cobra3073]

To further unravel the mysteries, I'm wondering why someone would take the 4V heads off and put on 2V heads, an edelbrock 2750 intake and then put the autolite 4300 carb back on. The guy I bought it from said that's the way it was when he bought it from the original owner, the 4V intake along with 4V exhaust manifolds were in the trunk when I bought the car but not the 4 V heads. The marti report shows it's a M code car based upon the dash and door vin# plus I've now determined the engine and transmission have the same last digits of the Vin stamped on them. Is there a reason someone would remove the 4V heads and put the current set up on it?

Such a change would be indicative of someone who was looking for better "street manners", read that more torque at lower RPMs. It has been an accepted position for many years that the 2V heads are much better at lower RPMs than the 4V heads.

Hope this helps!

BT

 

[Jim and Jutta]

Such a change would be indicative of someone who was looking for better "street manners", read that more torque at lower RPMs. It has been an accepted position for many years that the 2V heads are much better at lower RPMs than the 4V heads.

Hope this helps!

BT

Sounds like the 2V heads on it are better suited for the cruises I use it for than the 4V heads, thanks!

Jim

 

[Totalled]

2V heads would also lower the compression ratio over the quench 4V heads that were on it, letting you run regular fuel.

 

[URUGUAYAN_FASTBACK]

Hey there guys!!.. Interesting thread on here... I´ve heard a lot of versions about matching numbers cars... Mostly because besides the all know engine, trans and body... Judges in this cases checks dates and i believe someone in here posted a vid of a cougar and in that video, the guy said that a correct part for a car must have a date that were close enough from the production date... I believe the gap was a year...

Now as most of you know i have a basically matching everything car because it was unmolested till i got it in 2009... Howeveri have some parts dated in 69 and my car is a 72...

Could that happen because my car was an embassy order and an export car?

 

[Detector]

My reference materials is at odds with your "MustangTek" information as it relates to the D0AE-L casting number being used with the 1971 Boss 351 and/or 4-bolt main blocks.

I was researching this same issue a few months back and found as much information to support either case. My block is the D0AE-L and what I found was it still could be either the 2-bolt main or Boss 4-bolt. Only way to know for sure is to look at the mains and they could have been drilled out 2-bolt.