Engine swap question

[Don C]

First, take off the valve covers and make sure the valve keepers/retainers are in place on all valves and all rocker arms are in place with the push rods in place. Turn the engine over to check for proper movement on all rocker arms.

 

[PeteG41]

First, take off the valve covers and make sure the valve keepers/retainers are in place on all valves and all rocker arms are in place with the push rods in place. Turn the engine over to check for proper movement on all rocker arms.

I can do that! Good use of the new remote start switch. I will have the sheet with the cylinders that had no compression so that will make it easy. From your experience, whats the best case scenario for me here?

 

[Don C]

Bent push rods due to intake valves stuck closed would be the easiest to repair. Just a little condensation around them can cause them to stick to the seats. Make sure they are free before installing new push rods and turning the engine over.

 

[PeteG41]

Bent push rods due to intake valves stuck closed would be the easiest to repair. Just a little condensation around them can cause them to stick to the seats. Make sure they are free before installing new push rods and turning the engine over.

Sounds pretty ideal. I know she was sitting in a backyard since about 2015, at least that was the date of the last tag on my plate. I apologize in advance because I know this is going to be a dumb question, but when I figure out which valves are stuck, can I just lube them up a little and give them a tap with a mallet? With the rocker and push rod removed.

 

[Steve McMahan]

Having 4 cylinders in random order is weird. One or maybe two is possible, but 4? I suspect a broken cam or something catastrophic happened. An engine sitting could maybe have one bent pushrod creating one back cylinder. I wouldn’t do anything until I know for a fact what’s wrong with the engine, not maybe it’s this, know. Again, my 2 cents.

 

[PeteG41]

Having 4 cylinders in random order is weird. One or maybe two is possible, but 4? I suspect a broken cam or something catastrophic happened. An engine sitting could maybe have one bent pushrod creating one back cylinder. I wouldn’t do anything until I know for a fact what’s wrong with the engine, not maybe it’s this, know. Again, my 2 cents.

Alright limped her home from the shop, and got her parked. This is the info I’ve got.

My dead cylinders are 4-7
These are the readings for my good ones.
1-145
2-150
3-148
8-150.

They also did a leak down test on the dead cylinders and they were at 10%. So from what it sounds like it might be a little healthier than I originally thought, and have a valve issue. Sheet says recommend inspecting valve and valve stem seals. Popping off the covers tomorrow to see what kind of goodies I find.

 

[detritusmaximus]

Could be dead hydraulic lifters or weak/broken valvesprings from sitting so long. If a valve deosn't open, there is nothing to compress...my bet is collapsed lifters.

Is it noisy, like clackity?

 

[PeteG41]

Having 4 cylinders in random order is weird. One or maybe two is possible, but 4? I suspect a broken cam or something catastrophic happened. An engine sitting could maybe have one bent pushrod creating one back cylinder. I wouldn’t do anything until I know for a fact what’s wrong with the engine, not maybe it’s this, know. Again, my 2 cents.

Alright limped her home from the shop, and got her parked. This is the info I’ve got.

My dead cylinders are 4-7
These are the readings for my good ones.
1-145
2-150
3-148
8-150.

They also did a leak down test, and my dead cylinders were at 10%. So from what it sounds like it might be a little healthier than I originally thought, and have a valve issue. Sheet says recommend inspecting valve and valve stem seals

Could be dead hydraulic lifters or weak/broken valvesprings from sitting so long. If a valve deosn't open, there is nothing to compress...my bet is collapsed lifters.

Is it noisy, like clackity?

yep a little bit, problem is my exhaust leak covers it up to an extent. Sounds pretty unhappy though

 

[Ron Tanzi]

I agree completely, I have an M code and there is no way I would swap it for a 390. I have had a few FE powered vehicles and like them. Now, if it were a 427 side oiler I would have to think long and hard about it. I'm going to rebuild my 351C as a 408, so the Cleveland would win out, but having a 427 (or even a 428CJ) would be cool. It would be difficult to get an FE to produce the same power as a Cleveland of the same size.

A side oiler would be very cool.

Ron

 

[c9zx]

+1 on what Don said. If they are competent, they should be able to tell you what is causing no compression. Assuming it is bad valve sealing could prove to be a mistake. Just my opinion. Chuck

 

[PeteG41]

+1 on what Don said. If they are competent, they should be able to tell you what is causing no compression. Assuming it is bad valve sealing could prove to be a mistake. Just my opinion. Chuck

I didn’t have them pop the covers off and get into it any deeper. Didn’t want to go down the route of having to do all the work right now so it wasn’t just sitting at their shop. I’ll be taking them off later this morning and will keep you guys updated! I’ll probably have a few questions to ask I’m sure.

 

[Steve McMahan]

And numbering as in passenger side bank 1-4 and drivers side 5-8? That is weird, I hope it’s collapsed lifters. Cant be broken cam with that data.

 

[PeteG41]

And numbering as in passenger side bank 1-4 and drivers side 5-8? That is weird, I hope it’s collapsed lifters. Cant be broken cam with that data.

Yessir! Which actually matches up with the compression test I did. But my rental gauge was acting up so I didn’t really trust it. Heading to grab some new valve cover gaskets here in a bit, then going to dive in. I’ll post pictures of what I find.

 

[PeteG41]

Well gents, here’s the push rod on #4. It was pushed off to the side next to #3. I’m guessing I’ll find the same thing on the driver side but we’ll know here in a few.

 

[PeteG41]

I don’t know how this happened but number five doesn’t have a pushrod. They also must’ve mixed up cylinders seven and eight because eight has the bad pushrod.

 

[c9zx]

Alright limped her home from the shop, and got her parked. This is the info I’ve got.

My dead cylinders are 4-7
These are the readings for my good ones.
1-145
2-150
3-148
8-150.

They also did a leak down test, and my dead cylinders were at 10%. So from what it sounds like it might be a little healthier than I originally thought, and have a valve issue. Sheet says recommend inspecting valve and valve stem seals

yep a little bit, problem is my exhaust leak covers it up to an extent. Sounds pretty unhappy though

Just to be clear they told you the cylinders were leaking 90% and not that the leakage was 10%. This may sound like a "Hail Mary" and it may be, but I've seen it work with reasonable success. Having sat for so long it could be rings stuck in the ring lands. Before you pull the heads, pull all the plugs, and get a can of Sea Foam Motor treatment. Using a funnel a a length of vacuum hose, pour about 2-3 tablespoons full of the Motor Treatment into each spark plug hole trying to get some on the inboard cylinder wall. Let it sit for 48 hours and turn the engine over by hand or on the starter several revolutions to clear excess fluids. Put about a pint off the Motor Treatment in the oil. Reinstall plugs and be prepared for a fair about of smoke on start up. Let it idle at about 1000-1200 RPM until at operating temperature and 5 more minutes. Run it again a few more times. It may not do anything except generate some smoke but from what you have said I don't think you have much to lose, other than a little time a very few dollars. Chuck

 

[PeteG41]

No sorry, I definitely described that weird. The leakage was only 10% so my rings are good. I do have 3 bent push rods though. #8 is bad enough to the point where it doesn’t want to come out. So I have no clue what happened. Going to remove the brace to give myself more room to work with.

 

[Steve McMahan]

Intake manifold is next. You need to see what’s happened in there.

 

[PeteG41]

Intake manifold is next. You need to see what’s happened in there.

Yeah I was going to pull it but at this point I feel like the smartest thing in the long run is to go for a full rebuild with my block. With the limited info I have on the “rebuild” that was already done, something makes me think it was either cheaply done/not right, or maybe the timing chain jumped a gear. #8 is almost at a 90 degree angle and won’t come out. And I almost wonder if the pushrod from #5 could be in the pan.

 

[detritusmaximus]

Probably in the valley under the intake is where the pushrod ended up.
I too would pull the intake and check a the lifters and pushrods. You might get lucky and have a decent running motor after a little attention. Or at least buy some time before having to rebuild...unless you are wanting it to go that way.
I'd say have a little fun 'fixing' it. Even if it isn't perfect, it is satisfying.