Looking to upgade factory center gauges.

[Stanglover]

Finally an update, gauges not yet installed, but an update.

I bought the Bosch gauges and made a bracket rather than messing up the factory set. I decided to just paint the entire center panel with SEM Trim Black. Actually, it looks quite good and as I don't have the chrome accents on the other gauges, it won't look out of place.

Now for the issue of the oil gauge supply tube. I would like to avoid using the plastic tube that was supplied for the basic reason they can and do break. Copper is an option, but copper can work harden with engine movement and vibration and also break. The best solution is braided stainless steel with A N fittings. Problem is they only have NPT adaptors while the Bosch gauge has a straight 5/16-24 thread for the feral nut. Sooooo, my question is this, has anybody found a suitable adaptor to go from the 5/16 - 24 thread to the 4 A N fitting? Jegs have this ss tube on the website, 36" for $24.95 US. Auto meter have it, same thing, for 53 bucks.

I'd be very interested if there is a solution out there. Bosch have nothing to offer, just the plastic tubing.

I'm putting up a few pics of where I'm at with this "project" . #1 gauges from the back. #2 front, but way before refinishing (no picture yet), #3 the bracket I fabricated.

Geoff.

 

[midlife]

Check with a local hydraulics company near you; it is amazing what they can come up with to solve these sorts of problems.

 

[Stanglover]

Check with a local hydraulics company near you; it is amazing what they can come up with to solve these sorts of problems.

 Thanks, but I did that today. Must be thinking alike. Unfortunately nothing was available to solve this problem.

It may come down to, "what can I do to prevent a possible rupture in the nylon tubing" I was going to run it through another plastic or even rubber tube anyway as I tend to think that failure is more likely due to chafing or undue vibrations than just the pressure. After all, they supply it for this purpose.

Another alternative I do have is get a part CNC machined, but will need to rely on a couple of "O" rings to seal it. Got to think about that one!!

Thanks for the thought though.

Geoff.

 

[Don C]

I believe what you need is a 2-DATANF-4 adapter:

http://www.rjsales.com/products/compression_fittings/datanf.html

Might not be easy to find, though.

I have used 1/8" copper for many years, for oil pressure gauges, and never had any leaks or failures, nor did I know of anyone that had one break. You just need to leave a little slack between the engine and firewall so there's some flex, and the tubing isn't pulled tight so it is forced to bend where it goes through the firewall.

The failures of the nylon tubing I have seen were due to contact with exhaust manifolds, I have never used them.

 

[Don C]

There was also a question about how mechanical temperature gauges work. There is a bulb at the end of the tube that screws into the water jacket or water pump that is filled with a gas that expands, pressurizing the capillary tube, which then applies pressure to the bourdon tube in the gauge head. This article gives a better and more complete explanation:

http://www.sunzeri.com/Stearman/tempgauge.htm

 

[Stanglover]

I believe what you need is a 2-DATANF-4 adapter:

http://www.rjsales.com/products/compression_fittings/datanf.html

Might not be easy to find, though.

I have used 1/8" copper for many years, for oil pressure gauges, and never had any leaks or failures, nor did I know of anyone that had one break. You just need to leave a little slack between the engine and firewall so there's some flex, and the tubing isn't pulled tight so it is forced to bend where it goes through the firewall.

The failures of the nylon tubing I have seen were due to contact with exhaust manifolds, I have never used them.

 Thanks for your time to look that adaptor up Don. Not quite what I need though. I would need 5/16-24 female threaded 'nut' going to the A N end. Doubt it even made.

I agree with you on the copper tube, I would loop it at least once just before going through the firewall as well as under the dash. There is only a few inches back there anyways so it won't be too noticeable. Copper tube kits are only about 10 bucks, so I'll pick one up as an alternative to the plastic tube.

 

[Stanglover]

There was also a question about how mechanical temperature gauges work. There is a bulb at the end of the tube that screws into the water jacket or water pump that is filled with a gas that expands, pressurizing the capillary tube, which then applies pressure to the bourdon tube in the gauge head. This article gives a better and more complete explanation:

http://www.sunzeri.com/Stearman/tempgauge.htm

Don, good information, thanks.

 I think there may just be room to mount the bulb and its fitting in the jacket between the alternator bracket, replacing the electrical temp sender. It's going to be tight so as not to bend the tube too much. I will run it along the distributor wires and wrap it so it's not obvious and again loop it before going through the firewall with a support of some sort to be determined. Going into the water pump, it was mentioned before that this is not a good place due to the differences in water temperature. If only Cleveland's had water in the intake manifold like, dare I say it, Chev engines!!

All I need is some time!!

 

[Stanglover]

Finally found a better picture of the re-finished center panel. It was posted in another thread, but I'm re-posting it here.

Still away's from actually fitting it as it's now "Show Time".

 

[73429mach]

Finally found a better picture of the re-finished center panel. It was posted in another thread, but I'm re-posting it here.

Still away's from actually fitting it as it's now "Show Time".

Where did you purchase your gauges? Are they mechanical or electrical? That is the same setup I would like to do. My car originally did not have the gauges. Thanks, Ryan

 

[Stanglover]

Finally found a better picture of the re-finished center panel. It was posted in another thread, but I'm re-posting it here.

Still away's from actually fitting it as it's now "Show Time".

Where did you purchase your gauges? Are they mechanical or electrical? That is the same setup I would like to do. My car originally did not have the gauges. Thanks, Ryan

 Ryan, I found my set on Amazon.ca, so likely on Amazon.com as well. I bought the three gauge set as it was cheaper than individually. They are Bosch.

 The temp and oil gauges are mechanical. The bracket I designed and made myself ( still awaiting a cad drawing of it!!)

 As yet, I have not installed them in the car as there are other issues I need to find solutions for. The first being a way to eliminate the nylon tube supplied. I would like to use the braided SS, 4 A N type, but as the thread on the gauge is 5/16-24 not NPT, there is no adaptor made. I'm going to look at a copper tube type, but not sure about the connector either. May be stuck with the nylon tube, but if so, I'll run it through a larger rubber or plastic tube to protect it. I would think that the majority of failures would be due to chafing and undue vibration. The water temp gauge will also be a challenge to fit. It will have to replace the electrical sender in the block. Trouble is we have to use a 3/8 NPT adaptor in the block. This is good and bad. The bulb on the tube is quite long and needs the adaptor to get it where it needs to be in the hot water flow and that's good. The bad is there is little room between the block and the alternator bracket to avoid over bending the very delicate ether filled tube. I have not actually got in there, but it will be a challenge I fear. For this tube, I found some plastic sheathing that is like a spiral. This is the only way I found of getting an additional cover over the wire "spring" cover. See picture. To finish off, I will run it along the coil wires and wrap it with harness wrap so as to hide it. I want to keep the appearance of stock as much as possible.

The other unfortunate issue is I have to drill a 3/4" (or bigger) hole in the unaltered fire wall. I was thinking of using the same two hole grommet used for the fuel line through the apron. NPD sell them.

Another "mod" I made was the use of LED's. I purchased a couple of types from Hi-PO Parts.com. I got blue and clear. I'll not go into the exact numbers right now, but as I want the factory hue on my gauge illumination, I came up this this idea. I just happened to be given an empty speedo/tach housing with the blue domes still in it. I took three of them and cut the tops off, which I super glued (Gorilla brand) to the LED. It took awhile for the glue to set. Be very careful not to get glue on the domes, (as I did), it's a PITA to get it polished off again!! The result will be pretty damn good I think.

OK that's it for now. more later I guess................ when I think of what I missed out.

I have not found how to put script under picture, so you'll have to figure out what's what.

 

[NG8264723]

Your oil guage ferrule adapter looks removable. I bet if you remove it there is a metric thread in the gauge housing. You can go metric to AN. There area adapters. I thought it was strange that you would be locked into tubing with Bosch gauges. Try to remove it but use 2 wrenches

 

[Stanglover]

Your oil guage ferrule adapter looks removable.  I bet if you remove it there is a metric thread in the gauge housing.  You can go metric to AN.  There area adapters.  I thought it was strange that you would be locked into tubing with Bosch gauges.  Try to remove it but use 2 wrenches

 I wondered about that too, but was not sure if I'd bugger something up and scrap the gauge. Might be worth a try.

Thanks for the input.

Geoff

OK tried that, no go. The base nut only holds the guts together. Just hope it works still.

 

[NG8264723]

Not the base nut the brass piece. The base nut I would leave alone but the brass pice looks removable. Unfortunately to remove it might bugger up the threads but it looks like it would come right out

 

[Stanglover]

Not the base nut the brass piece.  The base nut I would leave alone but the brass pice looks removable.  Unfortunately to remove it might bugger up the threads but it looks like it would come right out

 No, the 5/16 threaded piece is connected to the guts inside and I'm not going there, but thanks for the idea. It would be nice if it was. The way I see it now is a) live with the plastic tube or b) copper tube or c) I could get a fitting CNC custom machined, but that option would be costly and still could leak, so not realistic.

If you can prove it can be done on this gauge, I'm all ears.

Geoff.

 

[NG8264723]

OK one other way.

Use a steel line with a compression fitting. Go from the steel this fitting

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brass-5-16-Tube-x-1-8-NPT-Male-NPT-Pipe-Thread-Compression-Connector-Fitting-/361726978484

then

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4an-male-to-1-8npt-female-Gauge-Adapter-Fitting-Autometer-VDO-/322096758399?epid=1153402449&hash=item4afe767e7f:ggQAAOSwl8NVbbWB&vxp=mtr

 

[NG8264723]

Or call Bosch and ask if they have an adapter they might...

 

[Stanglover]

Or call Bosch and ask if they have an adapter they might...

 That might be an idea.

 

[Stanglover]

OK one other way.  

Use a steel line with a compression fitting.  Go from the steel this fitting

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brass-5-16-Tube-x-1-8-NPT-Male-NPT-Pipe-Thread-Compression-Connector-Fitting-/361726978484

then

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4an-male-to-1-8npt-female-Gauge-Adapter-Fitting-Autometer-VDO-/322096758399?epid=1153402449&hash=item4afe767e7f:ggQAAOSwl8NVbbWB&vxp=mtr

 Already have the first one and the female A N is available here.  International shipping on E-Pay is ridiculous!

I appreciate your input, thanks.

 

[NG8264723]

here is a pic



tumblr image hosting

 

[Stanglover]

here is a pic



tumblr image hosting

Thanks, I see what you mean. Yes this could work. Just got to make up my mind to actually do it, one way or another.

Geoff.