Restore or buy

[acmaster]

My wife and I recently had a little boy and my father and I want to get him a mustang when he’s older. My father in law had a 1973 mustang when he was younger and I have always loved the 73 and I would like to have something special for my son. I farm and I’m not rich by any means but I won’t skimp when quality is involved. Would it be cheaper to buy a nicely restored fastback or would it be worth my time and money to restore one for him? What should a guy budget for a nice 73 fastback in the Midwest?

 

[will e]

Welcome to the board!

You have conflicting requirements. "I won't skimp when quality is involved" but you are considering purchasing someone else's restoration.

Almost certainly someone else skimped at some point in their restoration, and if they truly feel they didn't, they will command a premium price.

But to be fair your actual words were 'nicely restored fastback'.

I don't know your background or skill set so I apologize if I offend.

First thing to decide. "What do I mean by restoration"? I am going to assume since it will be driven by a young man, probably his first car, you are not looking to do a 100% concurs restoration. This is good on many levels. It will keep the cost down and driving a concurs restoration will kill it's value pretty quick. So let's go with 'looks period correct with some aftermarket parts that are not original;. This greatly reduces the cost of the doing a restoration or the purchase price of a restored car.

Next: "What kind of Mustang do I want". You've specified fastback. That's good. If you are not 'sold' on the idea that it has to be a 'Mach 1' or a more elusive model like a BOSS then your options go up and the cost goes down. Personally, I wouldn't lock myself into the 73. If you find any 71 to 73 that checks the boxes you should go for it. The production numbers of these cars was pretty low so the deals will be few and far between.

Next: "What are my skill sets and interest"? For me, when I was looking for my second Mustang (the one I still own after 40ish years) I knew I could wrench but body work and painting were out of the question. So I looked for rust free/limited rust cars that would not require a lot of expensive body work.

You've got some time so my suggestion is do a bit more research and set some cash aside. The best deals will be a nice looking car that doesn't run or a project that got started but not completed. Just be careful with either. Especially if the owner did the 'body work and paint' themselves.

Finally understand what you are buying and what it means. For example, you might find a great deal on a 6cyl and think 'I will just swap a V8 in' but there is a LOT more to it than just the engine. Or perhaps you find one that runs but the FMX transmission is toast, you've got several options for swapping out the FMX if you don't want to rebuild it.

Good luck!

 

[acmaster]

Welcome to the board!

You have conflicting requirements. "I won't skimp when quality is involved" but you are considering purchasing someone else's restoration.

Almost certainly someone else skimped at some point in their restoration, and if they truly feel they didn't, they will command a premium price.

But to be fair your actual words were 'nicely restored fastback'.

I don't know your background or skill set so I apologize if I offend.

First thing to decide. "What do I mean by restoration"? I am going to assume since it will be driven by a young man, probably his first car, you are not looking to do a 100% concurs restoration. This is good on many levels. It will keep the cost down and driving a concurs restoration will kill it's value pretty quick. So let's go with 'looks period correct with some aftermarket parts that are not original;. This greatly reduces the cost of the doing a restoration or the purchase price of a restored car.

Next: "What kind of Mustang do I want". You've specified fastback. That's good. If you are not 'sold' on the idea that it has to be a 'Mach 1' or a more elusive model like a BOSS then your options go up and the cost goes down. Personally, I wouldn't lock myself into the 73. If you find any 71 to 73 that checks the boxes you should go for it. The production numbers of these cars was pretty low so the deals will be few and far between.

Next: "What are my skill sets and interest"? For me, when I was looking for my second Mustang (the one I still own after 40ish years) I knew I could wrench but body work and painting were out of the question. So I looked for rust free/limited rust cars that would not require a lot of expensive body work.

You've got some time so my suggestion is do a bit more research and set some cash aside. The best deals will be a nice looking car that doesn't run or a project that got started but not completed. Just be careful with either. Especially if the owner did the 'body work and paint' themselves.

Finally understand what you are buying and what it means. For example, you might find a great deal on a 6cyl and think 'I will just swap a V8 in' but there is a LOT more to it than just the engine. Or perhaps you find one that runs but the FMX transmission is toast, you've got several options for swapping out the FMX if you don't want to rebuild it.

Good luck!

Welcome to the board!

You have conflicting requirements. "I won't skimp when quality is involved" but you are considering purchasing someone else's restoration.

Almost certainly someone else skimped at some point in their restoration, and if they truly feel they didn't, they will command a premium price.

But to be fair your actual words were 'nicely restored fastback'.

I don't know your background or skill set so I apologize if I offend.

First thing to decide. "What do I mean by restoration"? I am going to assume since it will be driven by a young man, probably his first car, you are not looking to do a 100% concurs restoration. This is good on many levels. It will keep the cost down and driving a concurs restoration will kill it's value pretty quick. So let's go with 'looks period correct with some aftermarket parts that are not original;. This greatly reduces the cost of the doing a restoration or the purchase price of a restored car.

Next: "What kind of Mustang do I want". You've specified fastback. That's good. If you are not 'sold' on the idea that it has to be a 'Mach 1' or a more elusive model like a BOSS then your options go up and the cost goes down. Personally, I wouldn't lock myself into the 73. If you find any 71 to 73 that checks the boxes you should go for it. The production numbers of these cars was pretty low so the deals will be few and far between.

Next: "What are my skill sets and interest"? For me, when I was looking for my second Mustang (the one I still own after 40ish years) I knew I could wrench but body work and painting were out of the question. So I looked for rust free/limited rust cars that would not require a lot of expensive body work.

You've got some time so my suggestion is do a bit more research and set some cash aside. The best deals will be a nice looking car that doesn't run or a project that got started but not completed. Just be careful with either. Especially if the owner did the 'body work and paint' themselves.

Finally understand what you are buying and what it means. For example, you might find a great deal on a 6cyl and think 'I will just swap a V8 in' but there is a LOT more to it than just the engine. Or perhaps you find one that runs but the FMX transmission is toast, you've got several options for swapping out the FMX if you don't want to rebuild it.

Good luck!

I don’t have any body or painting abilities so that limits me somewhat. I don’t want a car that’s too nice to drive and my son won’t get to drive it everywhere or everyday but I want a rust free car that will last a long time and won’t be a money pit constantly needed rust fixed and such. My father and I are mechanically inclined, my father being the better mechanic. My goal was to find a nice car needing finished or that has a bad engine and had the body work done at a good shop

 

[Tnfastbk]

As stated above, when you build the car yourself you know exactly what you have. Whenever you buy a car that has been redone you are hoping they are telling the truth in what and how things have been done. A lot of car "flippers" have maximum profit in mind when doing a car, where as you would have the "I'm keeping the car" mentality. That being said they are some really nice cars out there to be bought. Just take your time to educate yourself on what to look for in the buying process.

 

[Sheriff41]

Buy the nicest car you can afford, then work on repairing or restoring to whatever level you would like. This allows you to enjoy the car while you work to improve things. Also, if you decide to sell, you have a car that will be of interest to potential buyers.

Buying a full-on project will result in a significant amount of work and time. If you or your son lose interest, then recouping any money will be more difficult.

Cars have the potential to be great family projects. Best of luck with whichever way you go!

 

[Spike Morelli]

I have an opinion on this topic. Unless you're in the business somehow, maybe a longtime mechanic with personal experience, or own a body shop, or something major like those, I doubt you can restore a car correctly, and for a better price, than to buy a finished car. Like having kids, if you wait until you can afford it, you'll never have 'em. Should you find the car of your dreams, just take out a loan and buy it, it's cheaper than doing it yourself and the gratification is instant. How do I know? I have boats, restored 4 of them. If They still made the kind of boat I want I'd just do as I said and take out a loan. It would be cheaper! Jay Leno was once asked on TV, "Can you make money on restoring a car?". His reply, "Not if they're restored right." I did my car, but I bought it way back when it was cheap to begin with, and there were lots around, and I'm in the business, so not so big a "hit" on the wallet for me. I paid $1000 for my car, finished, running , straight. Those days are gone. People get $50,000 loans all day for a new car, never think twice about it.

 

[giantpune]

Restoring a car almost always costs more than the car ends up being worth. Even just in the cost of parts, materials, and tools. The more you have to pay for other peoples' labor, the more the scales tip against you.

And this is what you have to watch out for when buying something already "restored". If they restored the car with the intent all along to sell it for a profit, then they most certainly skimped somewhere. Otherwise there would not be a profit in it for them.

If they were restoring the car for themselves, then they (hopefully) didn't cut as many corners on purpose. More of the work will be done correctly. And now they will end up selling the project at a loss.

IMO, the best way to buy a decent restored and/or well taken care of car is from an heir. Grandpa had this thing and loved it. Grandpa passed on. His heirs get it and sell it for a fair price because they just want the money. The only one who is out money in that case is grandpa, who is dead and no longer cares about how much he really spent on the car. The heirs are happy to sell the car for fair market value because they have no stock in how much money grandpa spent fixing it up over the years.

 

[Fabrice]

Let me add more confusion to the above statements:

"Restoring a car almost always costs more than the car ends up being worth" yes and no.
First it depends with what you start with. Then there is the most important part: How much time do you want to spend on it and what your skills are, and not to forget; what your tool box looks like. It also depends if you are a credit card restorer (basically ordering everything new/nos online) or actually restore. The latter being way cheaper but also demanding waaaaaaay more time!
I'm restoring a 71 429 that was fairly rusty and my 2 daughters are out of the house for a few years now, that's when I started work on it, Somewhere in mid 2018 and I'm far from done... I do spent most my weekends on this car ( I love working on it so thats no punition) but you say "I recently had a little boy". Well I mentioned my 2 daughters, because you will see there is always something you need to do, to go get and the mustang has to wait. And thats demanding already with one. If you get a second kid or more, trust me on this: you are booked full time forever 26 hours a day, 8 days a week!
Speaking of waiting, you also need a place to work, and if you go for restoration, keep in mind there are quite of lot of parts than cannot be in/on the car and has to be stored else where. In short you need (dry) space next to the car location itself for the parts waiting to go back in/on the car.

As your boy is obviously very young, it is very cool to already plan a present that will be offered in 16 years from now. While some would think it's silly, I think it's not and your chance to find a good car now are likely greater than what you will find in almost 2 decades from now.

My 2 cents: buy a solid car, complete and make sure coming years that it's properly maintained. I won't look for rare models ( unless you find a perl that is affordable) as they are of no importance to a young guy...

 

[detritusmaximus]

Time to define terms...because advice is useless if you are talking apples to oranges.
What does 'restored' mean to you?
Are we talking a concourse correct, all oem/nos down to nuts and bolts? Or a nice solid, well detailed car that may or may not be 'correct' or accurate to how Ford built it?
The latter is cheaper and allows far more leeway in personal choice and what level of car you buy initially.

 

[SteveO_71]

You can get a nice solid (say 71 - Mach1), detailed car that presents itself well for $50K - $60K range.
All you would need to do is wax it and look for the next cruise night or show.

Adjust the price accordingly.

 

[73pony]

Welcome from another Iowa member. As stated above a lot depends on what you perceive as "Restored". Where in Iowa are you located? I'm in Cedar Rapids.

 

[detritusmaximus]

Welcome from another Iowa member. As stated above a lot depends on what you perceive as "Restored". Where in Iowa are you located? I'm in Cedar Rapids.

And how you want to use it. Too nice of a car and it never leaves the garage. A fairly nice one and you get to not worry as much about driving it.
Like Spike mentioned, he got his when it was just a used car and people drove the wheels off them. There is a very different mindset and enjoyment if you are able to take it out anytime you want versus the shine and show crowd.

 

[giantpune]

And how you want to use it. Too nice of a car and it never leaves the garage. A fairly nice one and you get to not worry as much about driving it.
Like Spike mentioned, he got his when it was just a used car and people drove the wheels off them. There is a very different mindset and enjoyment if you are able to take it out anytime you want versus the shine and show crowd.

Yep. If its too nice, it just sits in the garage and you wipe it off with diapers.

 

[detritusmaximus]

Yep. If its too nice, it just sits in the garage and you wipe it off with diapers.

Until somebody stacks boxes on it...

 

[Sheriff41]

Until somebody stacks boxes on it...

Looks like someone's holding a grudge.

 

[mrgmhale]

My wife and I recently had a little boy and my father and I want to get him a mustang when he’s older. My father in law had a 1973 mustang when he was younger and I have always loved the 73 and I would like to have something special for my son. I farm and I’m not rich by any means but I won’t skimp when quality is involved. Would it be cheaper to buy a nicely restored fastback or would it be worth my time and money to restore one for him? What should a guy budget for a nice 73 fastback in the Midwest?

Excellent question, and one I am sure a lot of Mustang owners wish they had asked before undertaking a "quick restoration" on their own. Unless you are skilled at mechanical repairs and body/paint work on these older vehicles, and plan to do the work yourself at your home (unless you own an auto repair facility), you will almost always be better off finding and purchasing a nicely (properly) restrored or preserved First Generation Mustang, as opposed to buying one for less money and undertaking the restoration work yourself.

Time and time again I see where folks purchased a Mustang needing (a little work), and winding up plowing a large amount of money into a car after finding it was not in quite the condition they had thought. I also see a lot of cases where someone has a Mustang they put a lot of money into, and due to life circumstances end up having to sell it. Often the price is far less than what was put into the car. Every once in a while I see where someone got a Mustang for a really low price, put in minimal work, and was able to flip it for a profit. I deem those to be more of a unicorn situation, where it happens rarely and alomst as if by magic. Don't count on that happening to you.

That said, regardless of the alleged condition of the Mustang, ALWAYS (and I mean always) have the vehicle thoroughly inspected by someone familiar with these older cars BEFORE BUYING IT. Failing to do that can too easily end up with you getting an older Mustang that looks really nice, but has deeply hidden rust or collision damage in the underlying seams, behind trim, or elsewhere. In such cases, even having gotten a Mustang for free, the cost of repairing that kind of damage can come out to a final billing several times the value of the car once it is completely repaired (properly).

Case in point, one person (real situation, this did happen) acquired what looked like a 73 Mach 1 in really good, well preserved condition. The price paid was a fair amount for an older Mustang in really good condition (low $20k). There was a little rust in a few small areas, typical rust-prone areas for these older Mustangs. When the new owner took the car to a body shop to have the few small rust patches repaired it was found that there was a tremendous amount of rust behind many trim pieces, and in deep seams throughout that car. The owner decided to have the rust damage corrected with a deep restoration of the entire vehicle. Some of the damaged parts were no longer available, and had to be fabricated by hand. In the end the Mustang turned out really nicely, with all the body work having been done correctly and preserving as much original metal as possible by resectioning new metal with older, undamaged metal panels. It took over 13 months for the work to be completed, and the total billing for the work was just under $135,000 - for a car worth about $25k in near excellent condition (it has a current value of about $35k now). The owner had his reasons for not selling for use as a crash derby vehicle as opposed to doing the repairs. And he was well off enough to have all that costly work done. But, clearly that is a situation best being avoided if possible. You do not want to be that guy, unless you truly have very deep pockets and enjoy saving cars many others would be scrapping.

Anyway, look for a vehicle in truly excellent, well preserved condition, or professionally restored. And seriously, regardless of how nice the seller is, get it inspected top to bottom by someone who is an expert with these vehicles. You will either end up thanking me for the advice, or cursing the day you chose to ignore the advice.

On another note, parts are still readily available for First Generation Mustangs, and documentation is also easy to find. I suggest you get a shop manual, electrical schematic, parts catalog, and body parts set of manuals for whatever car you end up getting. For First Generation Mustangs I have found Forel Publications has a nice set of manuals available in PDF format for really reasonable prices. Their web site is:

https://www.forelpublishing.com/clickbank/index.html

Gil

 

[detritusmaximus]

Looks like someone's holding a grudge.

No, I've seen the inside of too many garages.

.....but even I can fall into thinking, 'Well, I'll just place it carefully...'.

Or the bicycle scrape.......

 

[Horsin' Around]

That small investment of 20k today in a solid fund will probably net you 50k or more in 2040 when he is ready for a car. No storage, insurance, maint, etc (Probably another 10k added).

 

[Mark Jones]

Buying a classic car is not for the faint of heart. Thats my story and I am sticking to it. That said,,,,, I love doing the work on cars to fix them up. I have been working on motors and cars and motorcycles all my life. Regardless of what I am working on, I love to bring things back to life. If you are this kind of person, restoring a classic car should not be a problem. At 65, I am feverishly attempting to get the 1972 Mach1 I bought 1.5 years ago to daily driving status (I may be divorced by the time you read this) and I am very excited.
My suggestion for approaching a classic car is this, buy a running and driving car that you can drive and enjoy while you repair / fix it up. You will be more likely to stick with it. I didnt follow my own advice on the last purchase of the 72. The engine was running, but very poorly. I thought that it just needed some TLC to get it on the road. I was so excited to buy it that I didnt even pull the dipstick to check the oil. I found that the engine had dropped a valve and punched a golf ball sized hole in the #5 cylinder wall. No problem, just build another motor. While I was having the machine work done on the motor I decided to refresh the interior. When I pulled the carpet I found rusted floorboards and I had to take a class to learn how to weld. And it goes on from there. This is what restoring a car is all about.
Buy a car that is running and driving. Drive the car and listen to the sounds it makes. Have a qualified person put it up on a lift and look at the belly of the beast. Set a financial limit and stick to it! (I can hear everyone in this forum laughing about sticking to a restoration budget).
Within 30 days I should be driving my 72 daily to break in the new motor. I have no history with the rest of the driveline. I dont know how the transmission will hold up, what condition the differential is in or what else will fall off the car when I start diving it. I am sure the suspension will need attention but all of it is ok with me. I love working on it.

 

[MikeGriese]

The kid was just born. If the current trend of younger people putting off getting drivers licenses continues, a 67 year old car may be the last thing he wants when the time comes.

Not to be a wet blanket, but something to consider.

On the other hand, 16 years is a long time. You can learn stuff like paint and body work in that time.

I would recommend building or finding a car that YOU want and will drive and enjoy. If he grows up seeing you enjoying the car, there is a Much Greater Chance he will be interested. If all it is is something to wash and not touch until he turns 16, it may as well be a 24 place china set - nobody wants those either nowadays.