Standing up for the 351 cleveland

[hyena429]

I just got done with a 1 hour online battle over our little 351 motor....I happen to chime in on some talk in world of tanks...I thought it was so funny..I thought i would post about it...Only reason i noticed was cause some one asked some questions about the 351 cleveland...And every one who didnt know a thing about them started flapping there gums....Ohhh it was a site too see....I shot them down one at a time...Till they left the game...I came with facts..Not talk.

They stated that clevelands had bad bottom ends...they were heavy....I said hogwash.. block is 50 Pounds lighter than a 350 chevy...they went crazy....f@ck you!! You dont know what your talking about!!.... I said look it up...Here ill give you a link to motor shipping weights....They all shut up on that...a few left the room who's egos i dinged with that little information..and weak bottom ends? Hardly...4 bolt mains and a special small crank for high reving and big wide caps to handle it all...Much like all racing motors are made today......They went on about the 426 hemi and how it would destroy the cleveland...I said nope....600 lift they make the same power...They really freaked...i said..here is the data...I sent them another link...I said please inform yourself and come back armed for battle...lol...Dont lisin to what your ford hating freinds or 1970's propganda....Go look it up for your own eyes.

Then it started...Well a chevy can be built cheaper!! I said...yes usualy...But if you give me a 351 cleveland v4 stock...and the badest 350 chevy of the 70's...stock heads and everything..i bet i could get more power for cheaper than you can....they wigged..lol..saying bullshit and blah blah blah.....I said lisin...With a 351 cleveland 4v you dont have to buy big heads...the chevy you will...They will not flow over 400hp with stock 202 heads....But a cleveland heads will...So any money you saved..You will have to spend on some aftermarket heads to get your motor to push even close..Then!! You will run into another issue....even a late preformance 4 bolt main block chevy is only good up too 500ish hp..stock cleveland blocks up too 675 horse and more...Its better webbed...Its a newer designed motor...350 chevy is a fine motor...I work on them alot....but the cleveland was better...I know the truth hurts sometimes..lol

Well you know what? I didnt hear F you!!..or anything...they all kinda quitely went off to play their game and think about what i said...lol..I know..Im such a stinker sometimes But i get tired of runing into that old 1970's hogwash about the old cleveland...lol....Ill stand up for cleveland's every chance i get...specialy when i dont care what they think...I tell them bring facts, Not just your word...Clears the air every time..lol

 

[sm3570]

LOL!

Troublemaker!

 

[Don65Stang]

Excellent! Good job.

It must be in the air tonight because I just had to defend the 71-73s on vmf. I usually don't jump in like I did. Feel free to join the fray if you're a member there. Lol

http://forums.vintage-mustang.com/vintage-mustang-forum/649225-whats-71-mach-1-worth-numbers-matching-pretty-much-all-original.html

The up side is I got to invite a couple of 71-73 guys to our forum.

 

[hyena429]

Excellent! Good job.

It must be in the air tonight because I just had to defend the 71-73s on vmf. I usually don't jump in like I did. Feel free to join the fray if you're a member there. Lol

http://forums.vintage-mustang.com/vintage-mustang-forum/649225-whats-71-mach-1-worth-numbers-matching-pretty-much-all-original.html

The up side is I got to invite a couple of 71-73 guys to our forum.

Lmao!! I just read your post.....Your qoute in the end was perfict!!" don says: " Btw, check the weights of what you call a fat body vs the weight of the smaller 69-70s and see who the real fat body is "...

I love cramming that fact down 69 and 70 owners...they hate it..and deny the facts that their cars are heavier than our big boys..even our big block 429 scj is lighter..lol...I dont have a account there..Or i would chime in...But if i made one and chimed in now...They would see it was my only post and that i was new...and think im just you under a new name or your attack dog or something ..hehe

 

[73vertproject]

Good job guys. Love hearing about the defense of our cars and engines!

 

[1971mach1]

I copied below some garbage written about our cars. "Over 400 pounds were added in one year" and "smaller engines were strained by the increased weight"??, I don't think so! Neither was true. Also, the car was made bigger mostly because all muscle cars got bigger, look at 1970s Camaro, Firebird, Barracuda, Javelin. But the 71 Mustang wasn't much bigger or heavier than the already large 1969-70 Mustang which already fit a 428/429.

Interestingly, this (below) was copied from THIS website in the "data" section!! Rocketfoot, where did this negative propaganda come from? It's true these reviews were commonplace in the 1980's car books, and probably why our cars still get such negative comments. Maybe the errors should be edited out on this website though, or at least some comments about where this page came from and how misinformed it was.

(below was copied from the data section)

The 1971 Mustang became known as the Big Body Mustang! Lee Iacocca once called it a "fat pig". However the car had to gain width and length to accommodate the new 429 big block being offered in the new 1971 models. Over 400 pounds were added in the course of one year! If you did not order the 429 engine, the smaller engines were quite strained by the increase in weight and size.

 

[Tnfastbk]

Share the links so we can all do the same if needed

 

[marks73]

I'm in! Going to put on my armor and see what I can stir up after work. Sounds like too much fun to pass up to me.

 

[Don65Stang]

Share the links so we can all do the same if needed

http://forums.vintage-mustang.com/vintage-mustang-forum/649225-whats-71-mach-1-worth-numbers-matching-pretty-much-all-original.html




.

 

[Tnfastbk]

Share the links so we can all do the same if needed

http://forums.vintage-mustang.com/vintage-mustang-forum/649225-whats-71-mach-1-worth-numbers-matching-pretty-much-all-original.html




.

is that the ones with the 351c info?

 

[Don65Stang]

Wow, the guy called BS on my post about Mach 1 options. Had to school him a little. I hate it that that site has sunk that low with BS icons available to use in their posts.

Whenever I venture over there I appreciate this site so much more!

 

[Boss1Ray]

Whenever I venture over there I appreciate this site so much more!

I only go from here to over there to see if something has been dicussed. Then I come right back!

The beer is better over here... ::Chili::

Ray

 

[marks73]

Proof positive. You can't fix stupid!

 

[hyena429]

Wow, the guy called BS on my post about Mach 1 options. Had to school him a little. I hate it that that site has sunk that low with BS icons available to use in their posts.

Whenever I venture over there I appreciate this site so much more!

Awww i love how he tried to talk him self out of the fatbody comment....I bet money he went and looked at the real curb weights and suprized him self...But ego too big too let you be right on that...Some guys just can never be wrong...lol

And on the options...wtg Don!! It goes to show when some one has no clue on mach 1 options of our years....We can easly spot a well optioned mach 1...just from a few pictures...these cars are not worth enough to fake too much "yet"...Sure a few things have...But soon as most vins numbers and options line up..You got a pretty good idea if its decked out or not...lol..That is hardly a plain jane mach 1...

"Lack of body graphics, front and rear spoilers or rearwindow slats" rear window slats? Dont he know our mach 1's never come with rear window slats stock? lol and lack of spoiler in the rear doesnt not mean it was plain jane!! matter of fact i think there are more original when they dont have a rear fin..Cause so many stuck after market ones on...lol..

Looks like he made a reply to ya...lol

Your compairing apple and oranges.

As to my knowing about this year auto's, I worked in the dearborn plant where they were built for the 71-73 years and owned a few.

Op stated a 3.00 rear gear not an opitional ratio.

Most of the things you listed are standard with the M code and Ac.

Some are extras, But you have books to tell you that.

As for my opinion, Well the Op asked what it is worth.

The 15k price is My opinion of what it is worth as it sits.

There could be a boatload of dollors that would need to be spent to this car to make it a safe road worthy ride. Those facts are an unknown at this time without a very close inspection.

Sorry if the plain jane comment hurt your feelings, But place it next to one opitioned with slats, spoilers,ram air and graphics and which will stand out more?

Mmmmm if he worked there...Why doesnt he know window slats where not stock option?...nor front spoiler?

"Most of the things you listed are standard with the M code and Ac.

Some are extras, But you have books to tell you that." {shakes head} some people..Nothing you listed was standard with the M codes!! he doesnt have a clue...I feal sorry now..lol..Naw..lol

 

[Don65Stang]

I hate leaving it like that so I tried to make amends. Maybe he can bring some good info about the factory days. Maybe he forgot to put the staggered shock bracket on Jim's car or knows how that could have happened. Maybe he knows the last day the 73's were produced...was it July 5th or 6th like I predicted? Maybe he remembers some weird colored Mach 1's rolling by. Maybe he has some never seen factory photos he'd be willing to share.

 

[Tnfastbk]

Our cars did not come with rear window slats from the factory

 

[hyena429]

I hate leaving it like that so I tried to make amends. Maybe he can bring some good info about the factory days. Maybe he forgot to put the staggered shock bracket on Jim's car or knows how that could have happened. Maybe he knows the last day the 73's were produced...was it July 5th or 6th like I predicted? Maybe he remembers some weird colored Mach 1's rolling by. Maybe he has some never seen factory photos he'd be willing to share.

That would be nice...But statements made on options...Dont know if he worked there or not..Heck could of been a paper pusher or a broom sweeper...lol...But i guess even people who worked there mite not know much about the options list...But saying its just plain jane....That is not correct..He was wrong even if he worked there and owned a few...lol..And the fat body remark...Thats typical pre 71 mustang owner stuff...It all points to mmmmm..Kinda like the people on gun forums who claim to be military and they are not but hey...I could say i worked on the stealth bomber online too....Ohhhh snap...I just said it!! hehe..but then again...Could be just as he says..Hard to tell online...specialy when some one gives you room too dout.

 

[Don65Stang]

So I searched his user name for posts he made with the word plant and found out that he has a '70 05H Mach 1 with a 72 4 bolt block currently in it. Maybe he doesn't like the 71-73 Mach 1s. who knows.

he made the following post about what he did in the factory:

"Just to clear some things up, The engine - tran- rearend - ect build date will never match the build date on the buck tag.

I worked in the Wayne Assembly plant in the early 70's.

My job was forklift driver assigned to the interior/rail section.

I stocked the sub-assembly line for interior parts and unloaded rail cars carrying engines and transmissions.

When unloading the engines or transmissions, They were in shipping cradles.

each cradle was placed on a pickline according to size/type.

When the assembly line started, the teletype machine would give the order to the puller stating which engine/trans was to be next on the conveyor headed to the assembly line.

Now the car is mated with an engine/trans, ect that could have been built anywhere from 60-90 days prior to the car being built.

Even built with some parts that have casting # from 2 or more years prior.

Ford did not change some part casting # because they were using the same part in other makes or models years later, Some will have a manufacture date along with the original casting # used for quality control.

Now on the other hand there are some car's assembled with parts from the next years production, because the line ran short of the manufacture year parts.

I have an 89 F250 with a 90 fuel controller unit.

So does that make it a non numbers matching vec?

Just fanning the discussion.... "

Source: http://forums.vintage-mustang.com/vintage-mustang-forum/607138-what-year-did-ford-start-putting-vin-engine-block-2.html

 

[Tnfastbk]

Some have wondered where Wolverine has been, guess we know now MArk can rest easy.