71 convertible

[cwalker509]

Seat buttons......who here loves installing the Scott Drake ones? Not me! I had bought 2 pairs a while ago and just now starting installing them. I got one pair on but I had to use all but one of the tiny push on retainers from both pairs to do so. I tried to start installing the second set with the one unused retainer and one damaged one because why not? LOL. Anyways pics enclosed. I think Auveco makes a push on round retainer that may work. Advance Auto has some so gonna go look. Basically only one side of the clip would bend and it will not stay on. You can only push it back so many times before it pops off from strain hardening.

 

[Sheriff41]

Seat buttons......who here loves installing the Scott Drake ones? Not me! I had bought 2 pairs a while ago and just now starting installing them. I got one pair on but I had to use all but one of the tiny push on retainers from both pairs to do so. I tried to start installing the second set with the one unused retainer and one damaged one because why not? LOL. Anyways pics enclosed. I think Auveco makes a push on round retainer that may work. Advance Auto has some so gonna go look. Basically only one side of the clip would bend and it will not stay on. You can only push it back so many times before it pops off from strain hardening.

Good to know since I'll be doing this soon. Please update with how the round retainers work.

 

[cwalker509]

Good to know since I'll be doing this soon. Please update with how the round retainers work.

Auveco part 8863 from Advance Auto parts sorta work. The end of the "post" is slightly larger diameter than the post itself so they are not as tight as the other seat but no idea where to get those (the ones they ship with). Wondering if 3mm (0.118) ones will work better? The 8863 ones are made for 0.125" and they seem to be held pretty securely but it is just at the very end of the post. I smashed one of the Auveco parts with a pair of pliers and it held slightly better. I pulled pretty hard on the backing plate to try to remove it and they stayed securely in place so I finished up the seat. More pics to follow on the seats

 

[cwalker509]

Got the other seat back done and took a bunch of pics. I had both 71 and 72 seats. My 72 Sprint seats had vertical bars with a triangular cross section instead of the usual listing rods. The 72 still had the usual listing rod in the horizontal position. The bars are not at all flexible. I noticed when removing the Sprint upholstery that the rods were only secured at the bottom in between where the small tabs are towards the end. They also cut the loop at the bottom of the seat to permit sliding them in during the installation of the vinyl. They left the bottom ~3 inches of the rod outside of the loop. I did not. It takes a little bit of finessing but it is not all that hard to push it all the way in to where you snip the loop portion and then tweak it back down into the loop. I did cut small bits of a cotton thing I bought at the fabric shop and used the strips to help protect the vinyl from potential wear spots. I did retain the random fiber matting that is glued to the seat bolsters as well (not sure how well it shows in the pics).
Pic 1: Listing rods
Pic 2: 3 hog rings used on the horizontal listing rod. I put the middle one in first
Pic 3: the small snip i made to permit installing the listing rod from the bottom. I think i made it a little bigger
Pic 4: installing the rod/bar
Pic 5: Rod flush to snipped portion. It is not that hard to get the rod tweaked back down towards the bottom. Even thought Ford did not do it this way I figured it was designed to but probably took too long in an assy line.
Pic 6: Used a small amount of 1/2 foam on the bolsters, I think it filled them out a bit and looked better.
Pic 7: Almost done! It is done now except for the seat back.

 

[cwalker509]

In case anyone is wondering.....put the quarter regulators in BEFORE you put the convertible top frame in. There is one bolt each side that is incredibly unfun to tighten (the top back one). It pretty much requires an offset wrench. Luckily I had one. A short one would have been nice. But if you DO find yourself in the undesirable footsteps of me, run that one bolt in before your install the regulator. I was using new ones. With the standard offset wrench it would only turn about 1/8 turn at a time. But they are both in but still need to be adjusted.

 

[cwalker509]

Good to know since I'll be doing this soon. Please update with how the round retainers work.

I got my additional seat buttons in. I found that what seemed to work best were metric ones (available on amazon). I flattened some 3mm ones Iwith pliers that I had from a while ago. I put those on first and then put on a 2.5mm onethey held as intended I think (see pic). The buttons still come with the rectangular ones that still don't appear to work. I tried one. It did the same thing so I did what I wrote above.

 

[cwalker509]

Redid the rear seat back (buttons now!).

 

[rio1856]

Just some info I want to share on the push nuts. I found these on McMaster-Carr they were $7.42 for a pack of 25. https://www.mcmaster.com/90528A110/

Rectangular Push Nuts​

18-8 Stainless Steel, for 4-40 Thread Size 90528A110​

 

[mrgmhale]

Some more pics of the brakes. Front Wilwood and custom lines to adapt the 4 wheel disk proportioning valve to the stock lines (shown installed in prior post). I also got a good portion of the fuel lines sorted.Edited since I realized I have not been very good at documenting progress....

With the rear disc brakes, I have some thoughts I feel are worth sharing, and you pondering. It is possible with converting the rear drum brakes to rear disc the Master Cylinder will need to be changed to one with a different piston bore size, a different size reservoir, and definitely with no Residual Pressure Check Valves (RPCV). RPCV units are intended to be used ONLY with drum brakes. If you have RPCVs on the hydraulic lines feeding a disc brake caliper you will end up having the disc brake pads dragging under a continuous amount of applied pressure, pads that wear our quickly, pads and rotors that will overheat, warped rotors, reduced fuel economy, and reduced vehicle performance as the affected disc brakes will essentially be slightly applied at all times.

Some RPCVs are inserted as a small spring loaded "flapper valve" under the brass seat(s) of the Master Cylinder hydraulic outlet port(s). To remove them you use a sheet metal screw to insert and twist in enough to bite the brass outlet, then use a screwdriver flat tip like a lever to pop the screw and brass seat out. Then install a new brass seat without an RPCV. Other designs have the RPCV installed inline with the hydraulic fluid line(s) that feed the calipers. To remove them just disconnect the RPCV from the hydraulic line(s) affected, then reconnect the hydraulic lines as needed.

 

[RIBS]

My seat buttons came from NPD and worked well…good progress!

 

[cwalker509]

With the rear disc brakes, I have some thoughts I feel are worth sharing, and you pondering. It is possible with converting the rear drum brakes to rear disc the Master Cylinder will need to be changed to one with a different piston bore size, a different size reservoir, and definitely with no Residual Pressure Check Valves (RPCV). RPCV units are intended to be used ONLY with drum brakes. If you have RPCVs on the hydraulic lines feeding a disc brake caliper you will end up having the disc brake pads dragging under a continuous amount of applied pressure, pads that wear our quickly, pads and rotors that will overheat, warped rotors, reduced fuel economy, and reduced vehicle performance as the affected disc brakes will essentially be slightly applied at all times.

Some RPCVs are inserted as a small spring loaded "flapper valve" under the brass seat(s) of the Master Cylinder hydraulic outlet port(s). To remove them you use a sheet metal screw to insert and twist in enough to bite the brass outlet, then use a screwdriver flat tip like a lever to pop the screw and brass seat out. Then install a new brass seat without an RPCV. Other designs have the RPCV installed inline with the hydraulic fluid line(s) that feed the calipers. To remove them just disconnect the RPCV from the hydraulic line(s) affected, then reconnect the hydraulic lines as needed.

I assume the RPCV included in an over the counter rebuilt master cylinder for a stock 71 Mustang? Where can I buy a non-valve RCPV? Should I just get a different MC? Any recommendations appreciated. I have two other cars with pwr disc brakes and can store the rebuilt one for just in case.

 

[mrgmhale]

I assume the RPCV included in an over the counter rebuilt master cylinder for a stock 71 Mustang? Where can I buy a non-valve RCPV? Should I just get a different MC? Any recommendations appreciated. I have two other cars with pwr disc brakes and can store the rebuilt one for just in case.

Any Master Cylinder built and sold for use with Disc Brakes ought to not have RPCV in its hydraulic outlet leading to the disc calipers. I have always felt it was best to purchase a MC made for Disc Brake systems as the cylinder bore diameter can be different as compared to MC units designed for wheel cylinder (drum brake) use. For something involving retrofitting disc to replace drums I would likely get a full set of parts (calipers, MC, PB Booster) from a wrecking yard where the parts came off a 71-73 Mustang, or (better yet) get the parts from Wilwood. Were I to be getting my parts from Wilwood I would prefer to call and talk to someone about the parts I ought to be getting.

https://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderKits


I would not consider doing a disc brake conversion without a power brake booster. That is because disc brake systems do not have the same kind of "self-energizing" design as a drum brake system. With the drum brake system the top anchor pin is what absorbs all the braking pressure as the "floating wedge" action of the brake shoes/linings are essentially jammed outward against the rotating mass of the drums, which essentially aids in forcing the friction material of the linings against the drum surface. The disc brake system simply uses hydraulic pressure to squeeze the pad friction material against the rotating disc, and no self energizing action is present. I once had a car with non-power disc brakes. The brakes worked well enough, as it was a smaller car. But, I had to exert a lot of manual pressure onto the Master Cylinder to get the brakes to perform properly. Never again will I have a disc brake car without a power booster. When it comes to brake boosters on these Vintage Mustangs (and Cougars), my instinct would be to call WCCC and seek their recommendations. In fact I might end up doing all the parts purchases from or through them. They have a terrific reputation

https://secure.cougarpartscatalog.com/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbW_v_DdEuU


An alternative approach if the drum and disc MC units do have the same bore size is to remove the brass seat n the MC outlet that will be feeding the disc calipers, pull out the RPCV, then install a new brass seat. I would be prone to reusing the original brass seat as it will likely become distorted when being removed using a machine screw in it to all it to be pried out of its position.

 

[cwalker509]

Any Master Cylinder built and sold for use with Disc Brakes ought to not have RPCV in its hydraulic outlet leading to the disc calipers. I have always felt it was best to purchase a MC made for Disc Brake systems as the cylinder bore diameter can be different as compared to MC units designed for wheel cylinder (drum brake) use. For something involving retrofitting disc to replace drums I would likely get a full set of parts (calipers, MC, PB Booster) from a wrecking yard where the parts came off a 71-73 Mustang, or (better yet) get the parts from Wilwood. Were I to be getting my parts from Wilwood I would prefer to call and talk to someone about the parts I ought to be getting.

https://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderKits


I would not consider doing a disc brake conversion without a power brake booster. That is because disc brake systems do not have the same kind of "self-energizing" design as a drum brake system. With the drum brake system the top anchor pin is what absorbs all the braking pressure as the "floating wedge" action of the brake shoes/linings are essentially jammed outward against the rotating mass of the drums, which essentially aids in forcing the friction material of the linings against the drum surface. The disc brake system simply uses hydraulic pressure to squeeze the pad friction material against the rotating disc, and no self energizing action is present. I once had a car with non-power disc brakes. The brakes worked well enough, as it was a smaller car. But, I had to exert a lot of manual pressure onto the Master Cylinder to get the brakes to perform properly. Never again will I have a disc brake car without a power booster. When it comes to brake boosters on these Vintage Mustangs (and Cougars), my instinct would be to call WCCC and seek their recommendations. In fact I might end up doing all the parts purchases from or through them. They have a terrific reputation

https://secure.cougarpartscatalog.com/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbW_v_DdEuU


An alternative approach if the drum and disc MC units do have the same bore size is to remove the brass seat n the MC outlet that will be feeding the disc calipers, pull out the RPCV, then install a new brass seat. I would be prone to reusing the original brass seat as it will likely become distorted when being removed using a machine screw in it to all it to be pried out of its position.

My car was power disc brakes to begin with. I put Wilwood up front and a kit from Summit on the rear. I have a rebuilt booster and MC for front disc/rear drum as per OEM. Does this mean I should pull the RPCV from the rear circuit and replace it?

 

[mrgmhale]

My car was power disc brakes to begin with. I put Wilwood up front and a kit from Summit on the rear. I have a rebuilt booster and MC for front disc/rear drum as per OEM. Does this mean I should pull the RPCV from the rear circuit and replace it?

If the MC you installed was equipped with a RCVP flapper valve, under the hydraulic outlet port for the rear wheel cylinders, then there is no need for the inline RPCV. That said, I do not see how an inline RPCV could hurt things as long as it is the correct specification for the pressure retained by it. As I remember it, the factory master cylinder mounted RPCV units only hold back about 2 PSI, just enough to keep the wheel cylinder and master cylinder cup seal edges pressed against their respective cylinder bore surfaces to keep air from entering the hydraulic system when brake fluid cools down (and the volume contracts a little), Otherwise, with the hydraulic pressure not being present, when the brake fluid cools down after operation, atmospheric air will be sucked into the wheel cylinders, which result in a spongy brake pedal feel at best, and loss of braking action due to the compressibility of the air inside what is supposed to be a fully closed and sealed hydraulic system at worst. Also, if atmospheric air enters the hydraulic system, the water molecules from the air will be absorbed y the brake fluid, which causes corrosion to occur in the hydraulic system (wheel cylinder and master cylinder bore etching, wheel cylinder and master cylinder cup seal edges get damaged on the rough corrosion laden surfaces).



e

 

[cwalker509]

Spent some time working on adjusting the frame and then the rear quarter windows....OK, lots of time, like all day lol. Not sure the windows are quite right. Will have to wait until the doors are in and those windows installed. I would have thought the windows went straight up but I was unable to get them to do that. The ride the back seal and rotate. Does not seem right. The passenger side was awful. Spent hours on it. Hd to shim at the very bottom of it to get it rotated out so it would hit the seal correctly (or what I believe to be correctly).

 

[cwalker509]

I worked a bit on the center interior windshield trim. Despite this being an AZ car the piece has a fair amount of rust. The parts I worked on do not appear factory new but certainly better.

 

[cwalker509]

Installed the hard trim surrounding the boot well. Got some interior soft trim started. Ran out of the white vinyl dye and the bottom of the can was not right. Left it streaky. Will buy another can of white. Before and after shots of the interior trim piece above the windshield.

 

[Sheriff41]

Looks great! Freshly prepared parts are always satisfying.

 

[cwalker509]

Installed interior windshield trim pieces. They do not fit well. Comments appreciated as to how to get better fitment. Installed in original holes so they should represent how it left factory.

 

[PoFoMoCo]

I’m late to the build thread, but it appears you are hitting on all cylinders now! Nice job.