Sport Mirror Questions

[JimB73]

Hello all,

Hoping to get some info/help on a few sport mirror questions.

I have researched the forums for similar questions and got some answered. “Stanglover” and ”Not A T5” had an exchange on this topic back in August of 2017 but there wasn’t a definitive answer on the mirror housing size question so bringing it back up in case any new info is available.

1.     I’m looking to add sport mirrors to our 73 vert. When the body work was being done I asked them to weld up the holes in the doors from the aftermarket mirrors that were on the car, they heard –fill all the holes in the door, including the factory mirror holes. So, as a result I need to drill new holes. Can someone tell me what the measurements are for mounting the sport mirrors?  How far from the door edge to the first hole?  Is it the same for both sides? Is there a template for this?

 

2.    I have been trying to find good quality sport mirrors. I have had very poor luck on Ebay purchases. I now have 3 drivers’ side mirrors and one passenger side. All have issues and undisclosed problems the sellers didn’t mention or flat out lied about (glass condition, adjuster knobs broken, bezel damage etc). All of that aside, my question is about the size of the mirror housing. The sellers say all are for 7173 and based on part numbers on the base (with the exception of one of them) they should be,  but what I have found is that all of the mirror housings I have are different sizes, the passenger side being the largest. Can someone with original sport mirrors provide the measurement of the housing across the widest point where the mirror is and top to bottom in the center for both side?   Is the housing supposed to be the same size on both driver and passenger side? I’m wondering if some of the mirrors I have bought were mix and match parts someone put together. Is the mirror size smaller on the passenger side? I bought the Scott Drake passenger side convex mirror glass from NPD and the glass is so small in the housing it looks weird.

Thanks much for any help.

 

[Stanglover]

Hello all,

Hoping to get some info/help on a few sport mirror questions.

I have researched the forums for similar questions and got some answered. “Stanglover” and ”Not A T5” had an exchange on this topic back in August of 2017 but there wasn’t a definitive answer on the mirror housing size question so bringing it back up in case any new info is available.

1.     I’m looking to add sport mirrors to our 73 vert. When the body work was being done I asked them to weld up the holes in the doors from the aftermarket mirrors that were on the car, they heard –fill all the holes in the door, including the factory mirror holes. So, as a result I need to drill new holes. Can someone tell me what the measurements are for mounting the sport mirrors?  How far from the door edge to the first hole?  Is it the same for both sides? Is there a template for this?

 

2.    I have been trying to find good quality sport mirrors. I have had very poor luck on Ebay purchases. I now have 3 drivers’ side mirrors and one passenger side. All have issues and undisclosed problems the sellers didn’t mention or flat out lied about (glass condition, adjuster knobs broken, bezel damage etc). All of that aside, my question is about the size of the mirror housing. The sellers say all are for 7173 and based on part numbers on the base (with the exception of one of them) they should be,  but what I have found is that all of the mirror housings I have are different sizes, the passenger side being the largest. Can someone with original sport mirrors provide the measurement of the housing across the widest point where the mirror is and top to bottom in the center for both side?   Is the housing supposed to be the same size on both driver and passenger side? I’m wondering if some of the mirrors I have bought were mix and match parts someone put together. Is the mirror size smaller on the passenger side? I bought the Scott Drake passenger side convex mirror glass from NPD and the glass is so small in the housing it looks weird.

Thanks much for any help.

 A bit busy right now, but let me get back to you with some or all of what you need.

Geoff.

 

[Carolina_Mountain_Mustangs]

I can do tomorrow have several with mirrors. 

You need to find someone that can put the clinch nuts in for you to mount the mirrors. They have a special tool that works something like a pop rivet. You put the nut in hole and use the tool to clinch the nuts in the door. That is one thing noted on Buck Tag is the mirrors because it had to have the nuts.

Mirrors on other Ford vehicles look similar but are different sizes for sure.

 

[OMS]

I have the riv-nuts from AMK

They also sell an install kit but it is not more than some hardware, an Allen head bolt and wrench

I also new and used mirrors

 

[JimB73]

I can do tomorrow have several with mirrors. 

You need to find someone that can put the clinch nuts in for you to mount the mirrors. They have a special tool that works something like a pop rivet. You put the nut in hole and use the tool to clinch the nuts in the door. That is one thing noted on Buck Tag is the mirrors because it had to have the nuts.

Mirrors on other Ford vehicles look similar but are different sizes for sure.

Thanks David!

I did get the AMK Rivnuts and tool to install (look like a pop rivet tool but with a different head)

 

[JimB73]

I have the riv-nuts from AMK

They also sell an install kit but it is not more than some hardware, an Allen head bolt and wrench

I also new and used mirrors

Thanks!

I may check with you on the used mirrors once I can confirm the correct size.

 

[JimB73]

Hello all,

Hoping to get some info/help on a few sport mirror questions.

I have researched the forums for similar questions and got some answered. “Stanglover” and ”Not A T5” had an exchange on this topic back in August of 2017 but there wasn’t a definitive answer on the mirror housing size question so bringing it back up in case any new info is available.

1.     I’m looking to add sport mirrors to our 73 vert. When the body work was being done I asked them to weld up the holes in the doors from the aftermarket mirrors that were on the car, they heard –fill all the holes in the door, including the factory mirror holes. So, as a result I need to drill new holes. Can someone tell me what the measurements are for mounting the sport mirrors?  How far from the door edge to the first hole?  Is it the same for both sides? Is there a template for this?

 

2.    I have been trying to find good quality sport mirrors. I have had very poor luck on Ebay purchases. I now have 3 drivers’ side mirrors and one passenger side. All have issues and undisclosed problems the sellers didn’t mention or flat out lied about (glass condition, adjuster knobs broken, bezel damage etc). All of that aside, my question is about the size of the mirror housing. The sellers say all are for 7173 and based on part numbers on the base (with the exception of one of them) they should be,  but what I have found is that all of the mirror housings I have are different sizes, the passenger side being the largest. Can someone with original sport mirrors provide the measurement of the housing across the widest point where the mirror is and top to bottom in the center for both side?   Is the housing supposed to be the same size on both driver and passenger side? I’m wondering if some of the mirrors I have bought were mix and match parts someone put together. Is the mirror size smaller on the passenger side? I bought the Scott Drake passenger side convex mirror glass from NPD and the glass is so small in the housing it looks weird.

Thanks much for any help.

 A bit busy right now, but let me get back to you with some or all of what you need.

Geoff.

No Problem, Thanks much!

 

[Hemikiller]

Harbor Freight makes a decent riv-nut setting tool.

https://www.harborfreight.com/45-piece-threaded-insert-riveter-kit-1210.html

DO NOT use the riv nuts included with the tool. Correct screws are avaialble, they are 10-24 x1" . You can buy them from AMK or any Mustang shop. Riv nuts are also available from them or get them from McMaster.

https://www.mcmaster.com/95105a127

 

[delawarebill]

i used on both mirrors the rubber grommet with brass threaded sleeve. on ebay.. they worked great. i would also suggest the passenger mirror to be convex.

 

[Stanglover]

I'll start with some pics of my mirrors. As you can see, they are not exactly the same dimensions. I have seen some difference in the basic shape between 69 and 71-73's on not only Mustangs, but Montego's & Torino's. The pedestals are for sure different to fit the various door shapes, so be sure to get Mustang pedestals. Right now, mine are out in the shed and I'll need to go find them for the numbers. As for the dimension across the open face, these are die-cast and I see evidence of belt sanding on mine. I can't say with certainty, but as these were being finished in production, "Joe Blow" would press them against a belt sander until it looked okay. This would definitely account for a difference across the open face if one was sanded more than another. That's my theory and I'm sticking to it!!

As for the convex mirror and definitely NOT to upset anyone, you're right, that Scott Drake one is the same stupid size as the original, way too small to be useful.

I realize it was made just to fit the factory base plate, but there are options! PM me for details if you have not already got them.

I'll go measure my door placing and get back asap. However, if it were me putting sport mirrors on a car that didn't have them or doing a non concours mod, I'd move them forward by at least 2". I'm a short-***, and sitting in my driving position, I have to tilt my head backwards to see in the mirror. OK for a 6 footer with the seat all the way back, but not so much for the shorter driver. In fact, had I thought about it when my car was stripped for painting, I should have done just that. Oh we, too late now.

As you can see, quite a difference in sizes. The mirrors shown are my enlarged versions.

Geoff.

EDIT;

Here are the numbers I have. I could only measure the driver door, pass should be the same. From the first screw hole center // to the top of the door, measures 7.75" to the front edge and 1" down from the top line on the door, if that makes sense.

The number on the spare base I have is D1ZB 17713-A as well as RH 60422-401. The number in the housing is a bit hard to read, but appears to be ZB17477-A with ?? 342-402

Hope that helps, but the base number is the most important I would think.

 

[rackerm]

From the center of the screw and along the top edge of the door is what i used for the top edge of the ruler





Also from my measurements, 69 and 70 mirror housings are the same as 71 to 73 but the pedallstle is different.

 

[Stanglover]

Now, just to make this confusing, here are pics of my 71 car. Typical Ford, nothing is the same!!

Both sides measure 7.75" and 1" down, although that pic looks to be less, but you get the idea. Sorry about the focus, I don't have much room to move in the garage.

Geoff.

 

[rackerm]

Now, just to make this confusing, here are pics of my 71 car. Typical Ford, nothing is the same!!

Both sides measure 7.75" and 1" down, although that pic looks to be less, but you get the idea. Sorry about the focus, I don't have much room to move in the garage.

Geoff.

Geoff,

Yep to your point, Ford was not that precise where it did not matter.

Rich

 

[rackerm]

Now, just to make this confusing, here are pics of my 71 car. Typical Ford, nothing is the same!!

Both sides measure 7.75" and 1" down, although that pic looks to be less, but you get the idea. Sorry about the focus, I don't have much room to move in the garage.

Geoff.

Geoff,

Yep to your point, Ford was not that precise where it did not matter.

Rich

How about one more car for good measure... I tried to match Geof's ruler position on this one.

 

[Stanglover]

Now, just to make this confusing, here are pics of my 71 car. Typical Ford, nothing is the same!!

Both sides measure 7.75" and 1" down, although that pic looks to be less, but you get the idea. Sorry about the focus, I don't have much room to move in the garage.

Geoff.

Geoff,

Yep to your point, Ford was not that precise where it did not matter.

Rich

 How true!!

As I mentioned, if I were  to do the body again, I'd move the mirrors forward at least 2". There would be no issue with the door opening. I always felt these cars were designed by the 'Jolly Green Giant', not meant for short *** people at all!! I would also bring the pedal mounts forward at inch at least as well. I hate being so close to the steering wheel!

Perhaps our friend might want to consider HIS driving position and place his mirrors accordingly.

Geoff.

Just a thought, Mine is a Mach1 fastback. I don't see why a vert might be different, but then who knows what "they" were thinking!!

 

[JimB73]

Stanglover, Rackerm,

Thank you for the pictures and measurements! very helpful in trying to figure placement of mirrors. I'm 6' so will have to see how that works compared to stock location.

I'm still trying to understand the mirror housing size difference and see if there is any consistency in size for cars that originally came with the sport mirrors. It may not be as big a deal as I think it is but if I'm going to add the sport mirrors I want it to be as correct as possible. Of the three drivers side mirrors I have I now know that one is not correct for Mustang as the number on the base is incorrect (appear that it was on a Ranchero or Montego?)  It was pulled from a 73 Mustang in a salvage yard before I knew the correct part number for Mustangs... So, I have two drivers' side mirrors to work with and one passenger side mirror. Here is the info on them:

Blue Driver Side #1    

                                      

Base # D1ZB 17743 B

                Additional # 60421 401 JC

Measurements: 5 5/16" wide (across at widest point) X 3 3/8" high (at center)

 

Orange Driver Side #2

        Base # D1ZB 17743 B

                Additional # 60421 401 JC

Measurements: 5 1/4" x  3 7/16"

 

Blue Passenger Side

 

        Base # D1ZB 17713 AWA

                Additional # RH 60422 401 JC

                       

        Housing # 60342 402

Measurements: 5 9/16" x 3 9/16"

++++++++++

I haven't disassembled the drivers' side mirrors yet to get at the housing number behind the glass.

The size difference between the drivers side and passenger side is really noticeable when side by side but may be okay when on the car but should they be the same size or were they in fact different sizes from the factory? the other thing I notice is the thickness of the casting. The drivers side mirrors are both much thinner casting then the passenger side mirror I have. So, wondering if even though the base has correct part number maybe the housing is not correct??

 

[rackerm]

Stanglover, Rackerm,

Thank you for the pictures and measurements! very helpful in trying to figure placement of mirrors. I'm 6' so will have to see how that works compared to stock location.

I'm still trying to understand the mirror housing size difference and see if there is any consistency in size for cars that originally came with the sport mirrors. It may not be as big a deal as I think it is but if I'm going to add the sport mirrors I want it to be as correct as possible. Of the three drivers side mirrors I have I now know that one is not correct for Mustang as the number on the base is incorrect (appear that it was on a Ranchero or Montego?)  It was pulled from a 73 Mustang in a salvage yard before I knew the correct part number for Mustangs... So, I have two drivers' side mirrors to work with and one passenger side mirror. Here is the info on them:

Blue Driver Side #1    

                                      

Base # D1ZB 17743 B

                Additional # 60421 401 JC

Measurements: 5 5/16" wide (across at widest point) X 3 3/8" high (at center)

 

Orange Driver Side #2

        Base # D1ZB 17743 B

                Additional # 60421 401 JC

Measurements: 5 1/4" x  3 7/16"

 

Blue Passenger Side

 

        Base # D1ZB 17713 AWA

                Additional # RH 60422 401 JC

                       

        Housing # 60342 402

Measurements: 5 9/16" x 3 9/16"

++++++++++

I haven't disassembled the drivers' side mirrors yet to get at the housing number behind the glass.

The size difference between the drivers side and passenger side is really noticeable when side by side but may be okay when on the car but should they be the same size or were they in fact different sizes from the factory? the other thing I notice is the thickness of the casting. The drivers side mirrors are both much thinner casting then the passenger side mirror I have. So, wondering if even though the base has correct part number maybe the housing is not correct??

Driver side base casting number



Passenger side mirror casting number



Sorry, I can not find the driver side housing casting number.

71-73 LH Driver side remote mirror is Ford Part # D1ZZ-17682-C & RH Manual mirror is D1ZZ-17682-B (Note: these are not the casting numbers)

 

[JimB73]

Rackerm,

That is interesting, my drivers side mirrors numbers end with an upside down AM. I wonder what the difference is between WA and AM

on your passenger side mirror picture the housing number looks like C9ZB -Doesn't that indicate a 69 number? I wonder what the correlation is between the casting number and the part number.

I keep looking for something that would point to a specific number that was used on the 71-73 and can't seem to find it but maybe it is because of the difference between the casting numbers and part number....?

 

[Stanglover]

 

Blue Passenger Side

 

        Base # D1ZB 17713 AWA

                Additional # RH 60422 401 JC

                       

        Housing # 60342 402

Measurements: 5 9/16" x 3 9/16"

++++++++++

I haven't disassembled the drivers' side mirrors yet to get at the housing number behind the glass.

The size difference between the drivers side and passenger side is really noticeable when side by side but may be okay when on the car but should they be the same size or were they in fact different sizes from the factory? the other thing I notice is the thickness of the casting. The drivers side mirrors are both much thinner casting then the passenger side mirror I have. So, wondering if even though the base has correct part number maybe the housing is not correct??

 Take a look at the shape of the 'pointy' end. do they look the same? Your part numbers above match a spare pass side I have and I listed that and I know this came of a 73 Mustang fastback, because I took it off. My castings are quite a bit different driver side to pass side on the car. The size is close to what I posted, but to be honest, I didn't put a Vernier on them, just a ruler. The spare I have sitting on my desk is a lot thinner at the opening than the one on the car. It measures 5 1/2"" x 3 7/16th. 

From my past knowledge of how **** gets made in factories I'm pretty damn sure that if a casting came with a load of flash on the opening, Joe Blow would just slam it against the belt sander until it was gone. He couldn't care less about dimensions as long as it past "inspection"...….. and I say that loosely!!

I wouldn't worry too much about size, but the shape is what should look the same. I have seem castings that are quite square at the "pointy" end. Compare them before putting them on. I think 69-70 Torino , Montego etc. might be different in that regard, but I can't be sure on that, so don't beat me up if I'm wrong.

Two matching mirrors is what you want and nobody will ever notice that one is an 1/8" bigger than the other.

Geoff.