Her 72 Mach 1

[72Mach168Cam]

So, please remind me (us) why this painter is NOT going to finish the job for the quoted price? You don't do a 2 stage paint job and not cut and buff. While I'm no expert on painting cars, I have several friends who are and I'm damn sure they would agree. If you wanted an original 1971-73 appearing paint job, you would have use a single stage enamel or similar for that "factory painted" look.

He said that if we wanted the orange peel gone it would be an additional 80 hours labor ($5200).

The agreed upon $18k turned into $19100 two days ago. After he said he had some additional hours in sanding just before the paint booth. I agreed to the extra $1100. But I won't do $5200. I even asked what could we get for 40 hours. He balked at that, stating that few hours would only remove the peaks and still leave texture.

He said we paid for a factory looking paint job and that is what we received.

 

[72Mach168Cam]

Beautiful Mustang Kilgon!!

 The painter of our car should be the one to "finish" our car not some detail shop. Just before our painter painted the body I expressed my hopes that it turns out well enough to "show" the car and like you have business cards available. Also if we did put a poster board together that his shop would be listed as paint and bodywork. Unless he changes his mind in the very near future, which I doubt, I won't be recommending his shop.

I get the impression our painter is pushing us to pay and get lost.

 

[timachone]

He said that if we wanted the orange peel gone it would be an additional 80 hours labor ($5200).

The agreed upon $18k turned into $19100 two days ago. After he said he had some additional hours in sanding just before the paint booth. I agreed to the extra $1100. But I won't do $5200. I even asked what could we get for 40 hours. He balked at that, stating that few hours would only remove the peaks and still leave texture.

He said we paid for a factory looking paint job and that is what we received.

Brett, 

really?!? For that price and if there were no major body repairs included the finish or cut and buff some said MUST have been included! That's not a 5.000 Dollar-job! You gave him 19.000 !!! That's a whole lot money and for that price you shoud get a good, even finish. He laid down 3 layers of clear and screwed that up that way?!? My painter laid down 2 layers of clear and it is almost even like glass. Without any cut and buff! Man, that is way too much paint for this outcome. 80 hours labor for cut and buff?!? What will he do in that time?!? That's a whole week including saturday and sunday for one car! Yes, our cars came from the factory with some orange peel here and there but not overall and you went to a so called professional for a good, remarkable paint shop. Sorry Brett, but this guy has pulled you over the barrel! As before said, in this price range the cut and buff should be included! And that should be done from the painter itself. Most other paint shops will not do the work from someone other. Man, reading this makes me slowly angry and really feeling sad for! It's always the same with (most) that paint guys... 

 

[timachone]

Here, my example, freshly painted, without cutt and buff, 1 layer primer, 2 layers base, 2 layers clear, all in one noon: 

 

[bdennis]

Looking really nice.

 

[timachone]

Thank you, Brendan  :thumb:

 

[Stanglover]

He said that if we wanted the orange peel gone it would be an additional 80 hours labor ($5200).

The agreed upon $18k turned into $19100 two days ago. After he said he had some additional hours in sanding just before the paint booth. I agreed to the extra $1100. But I won't do $5200. I even asked what could we get for 40 hours. He balked at that, stating that few hours would only remove the peaks and still leave texture.

He said we paid for a factory looking paint job and that is what we received.

Brett, I have just one word " BULLSHIT!"

That guy is overvaluing his abilities. I know unless you have it in writing, it's his word against yours, but maybe time to consider legal action or threat thereof. He's trying to rip you off.

Although it was back in 2014 when I had my car stripped and repainted, my total bill was just over 10K Canadian! That included cut and buff and help putting it back together. My painter was also a restorer, so had the knowledge and experience. Besides, he was not busy and volunteered to help. There were some issues as mentioned before, but overall I can't complain. It's won a few trophies along the way.

 

[turtle5353]

He said that if we wanted the orange peel gone it would be an additional 80 hours labor ($5200).

The agreed upon $18k turned into $19100 two days ago. After he said he had some additional hours in sanding just before the paint booth. I agreed to the extra $1100. But I won't do $5200. I even asked what could we get for 40 hours. He balked at that, stating that few hours would only remove the peaks and still leave texture.

He said we paid for a factory looking paint job and that is what we received.

Brett, Sorry to hear that!  Wow that's sad!!  I cant believe what people charge for subpar work.  I must really need to up my prices!!!  You saw the work on the yellow mustang I did the first time painting it. I used all good material PPG products. Did all the disassembly and reassembly along with paint and panel replacements for probably $5k less than that guy charged you.  I'm not beating you up, I just feel for ya man.  Places like that give guys like me a bad rap.  But, I believe the look of the car is really nice. With that being said, I think you will be very pleased once it is wet sanded and buffed out. It will be a night and day difference. Once you get past this part and start assembly and get it on the road, this schmuck will be a distant memory for you and your wife. Good luck with the rest of it, and if you need anything don't be afraid to ask! 

 

[72Mach168Cam]

Thanks Timachone, Geoff, Kevin and all others.

Tim there were some major panel replacement; full floor, drivers quarter panel, tail panel, core support and battery tray apron. We brought the car to the shop in a very disassembled state. The only thing remaining on the body were the doors which only had the door latch and interior door handle. The front coil springs were replaced with wood 4"X4" blocks.

We settled on a final price to get the Mach 1 into paint post structural repairs and before final primer coat. It was a verbal contract sealed with a handshake for $18000. Three days ago I was excited to see the picture of the Mach 1 in the paint booth in paint. In my euphoria I quickly agreed to an additional $1100.

Obviously I do not know paint/bodywork but "I" can see the orange peel. I hope to get a professional opinion on the final product produced by our hired painter before WE hire out a wet sand and buff job. And at this point a redo of the entire hood to fix the front trim piece.

In one of the unprofessional text messages to my wife the painter claimed to have 500 hours into our car and something to the effect that he helped US out along the way to stay in our budget.

As I said I did (do) not know what it took (takes) to put a Mustang into paint that needed the amount of panel replacement that it did. But I did as much research as I could prior to undertaking this restoration. This website was my main go to source. My best guess was 300-350 hours.

I have not threatened legal action. I would need to do my homework on that before I did. One such task that I believe would help is to pick up the Mach 1 with our own (rented) trailer. And bring it to a professional bodyshop for evaluation. My wife contacted such a bodyshop that was agreeable to that course of action.

I am starting a mini vacation from my job today. It was planned for a 5 day spring time work to get stuff done around the house and yard mini vacation. Earlier this week it looked like the addition of bringing the Mach 1 home after 16 months was going to be the crown jewel to this planned time off.

 

[Stanglover]

Ok this makes more sense to me now. I confess I jumped into this post not knowing of the amount of bodywork done. That being the case, I would think 18K would be a pretty good price based on my own car that needed only the tail light panel replaced. The rest was just nicks and minor dents, full sanding, prime, paint, cut and buff.

Having said that, it now come to finishing the job and that's where the problem lies.

 

[72Mach168Cam]

Ok this makes more sense to me now. I confess I jumped into this post not knowing of the amount of bodywork done. That being the case, I would think 18K would be a pretty good price based on my own car that needed only the tail light panel replaced. The rest was just nicks and minor dents, full sanding, prime, paint, cut and buff.

Having said that, it now come to finishing the job and that's where the problem lies.

Yessir!

Heck, my wife was "ok" with the orange peel while first looking at the paint job. Her beef and it really bugs her is the hood trim piece. It was the first thing she saw upon exiting our suburban. And it took a few minutes of staring at the hood trim before she was able to walk around the whole Mach 1.

I really hate to blow up. But I'm percolating. I am entering John Wayne movie quote territory.

"I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a-hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them."

I really just want to be done with incompetent people. I have a difficult time interfacing with other industries outside of my career field of 34 years. It is a personal physcological problem. The standards at which I have been held to in aircraft maintenance since I was 19 leaves me without a choice to be jaded the away that I am towards other industries. 

I just want to find a professional, pleasant to deal with person(s) to finish out the paint job. So I can get to making my own mistakes turning wrenches.

 

[Stanglover]

As I said, I kind of jumped in on this saga recently, not knowing all the details. I just realized what you have been talking about with the hood trim piece after enlarging the best picture. What ever was he thinking to fill in the gap between the hood and trim piece? I would be fuming too in that case. He ought to at least make that good by removing the filler and repainting the hood and trim. I hope I'm correct on that.

Going back to mine, but not wanting to over shadow your issues, my body guy failed to correctly align the fenders center to the body, therefore the hood was also off. It was only a fraction, but instead of correcting that, he adjusted the trim to suit. As mentioned before, the little post for the twist nut on the end had broken off (I knew that before) so he glued it. Unfortunately with body panel adhesive, there's no removing it without breaking it, now I'm stuck with it.  Here are a couple of pics. 1st is right side, 2nd is left side that is 1/8" out and hood misalignment is seen.

I hope you're good with me showing this.

 

[72Mach168Cam]

No worries Geoff! I wish my wife's Mach 1 hood, looked that good!

Don't know what the heck he was thinking. Just go back a few pages to the pics of the body in primer with fenders and hood attached. He hadn't "filled" it in yet. Why oh why?

More thoughts while driving kids to/from dentist appointment;

Poor bastard probably is upside down on his price/labor. He probably really was in over his head on this project. We chose poorly. He started his own bodyshop one month before we brought him the Mach 1. He is not ready for the big leauges. Or even triple A. Apparently the few 64-67 Mustangs that he has worked on must not have needed as much work and/or there is enough manufacturing differences between the generations that it was overwhelming.

Not that he didn't do good work. Cause he did. The gap on the rear quarter extensions is beautiful! A far sight better than they were when I took them off the car. The silver paint accents turned out just the way I envisioned. And after a cut and buff the paint will probably be gorgeous. 

There were a few tell tale signs early on; I brought him a printed copy of the body dimensions for a 72 Mustang before he cut out the floor and he looked a might bit confused as I handed it to him. He failed to recognize the full floor pan from dynacorn did not come with parking brake brackets attached or rear seat side panel brackets. So when he cut out the floor. Every piece went into the scrap metal bin.

I need to quit typing. I didn't intend to turn this into a complaint blog. My apologies.

 

[72Mach168Cam]

My wife watched bunch of videos on "how to" wet sand and buff yesterday. There is more to learning than that I know. But as a friend of mine who is also a Mustang fanatic said we have a perfect piece of the car to learn wet sand and buff on. The hood. Even if we don't do it ourselves, again, the hood will be an excellent piece to start with. 

 

[turtle5353]

Biggest thing is to not go too aggressive with your sanding or buffing. ESPECIALLY  on corners and edges.  Don't run the buffer too fast or build up excessive heat.  Its very easy to burn through fresh clear and paint.  To be honest if you have never done it before , I probably wouldn't recommend starting on this car!  You can do way more harm than good if your not careful.  Your water and paper have to stay clean, clean, clean.  If your getting dirt nibs out first, make sure they don't stick to your paper because they will scratch the hell out of the clear if they get embedded in the paper.  If you decide to move forward with this yourself be very careful and do your home work.  You need good sand paper, good soft sanding blocks in various shapes, a good buffer ( not an orbital ) , and good compounds.  I have tried many over the years and always end up coming back to the 3M Finesse-it line.  I use their rubbing compound, then glaze, then a hand glaze. If you have any specific questions let me know.  Or give me a call and I can try to answer some questions for ya if that's easier. 

 

[72Mach168Cam]

Painter found some more parts to paint today. Pretty sure he forgot about the bumper til yesterday. 

Hoping to get the Mach 1 home this Friday. I like to solve complex problems. Can't wait to dig into this project on our own turf once again.

 

[timachone]

Brett, 

that looks cool. Hope you have all parts together soon! 

Here, I found a small consolation plaster for you: 



Think of that moment you (especially and not forgotten your wife) will it see that way and it will drive you through that difficulties. Don't ask, how I know... 

All the best and keep us up to date  :thumb:

 

[72Mach168Cam]

Thanks Tim!

We kind of had a laugh about the bumper. We forgot all about it. Didn't think about it until after we inspected the paint job. We figured the painter forgot as well since he didn't bring it up. The painters response to my wife's text, when asked, led us to believe it was forgotten about.

Any hazards for off gassing paint while driving around with freshly painted parts in the back of a suburban? I ask for my family as I've already got brain damage (self inflicted)

 

[72Mach168Cam]

Loose parts collected yesterday. The Mach 1 was already loaded into an enclosed car trailer when we got to the shop. Guess he didn't want any more things for us to find

Shop prepped for arrival. ie. I put my car on wheel dollies and pushed it into the corner the Mustang occupied for a decade.

Delivery expected this afternoon. Update to follow.

 

[72Mach168Cam]

Oops! I freely admit to being completely out of my leauge when hiring a bodyshop. Thankfully the internet allows me some level of anonymity. I truly am embarrassed at the amount that I paid. But it is home. 

We found a few more flaws within the first 10 minutes of having it in our shop. Can't believe I missed them. I'm sure there will be more. One such doozy is the tail panel. The doofus managed to paint blackout for the honeycomb panel to tail light gap. But the Moron completely forgot to make holes for the honeycomb panel. And not to mention some sort of black colored splatter on the roof that appears to be UNDER the clear coat. 

I'm typing concise and clearly I think and trying to be respectful to the site owner and mods. But I really want to scream obscenities via the keyboard. 

Anyways here are some pics. We shall keep on with the restoration/resurrection.