Oh, the double standards....

[EdM]

1973 Stang (Biggest, Heaviest) vs. 1969 Camaro RS (That no one complains about)

351C                                                         350

L. 193.8"                                                  186"

W. 74.1"                                                     74"

H. 50.7                                                      51.1"

Wheelbase 109.1"                                    108"

3,411LBS.                                             3,492LBS. 

So we're 8 inches longer on  73 with the huge bumpers. 71 and 72 would be better, but I wanted to take the biggest example. 

Same width. Slightly lower. 1" longer wheelbase. 81lbs. lighter. 

Anyone ever hear a complaint at all about the size or weight of a 69 Camaro RS or SS??? Didn't think so. 

Can you add a column with the 71/72 dimensions?

 

[cwalker509]

1973  Mustang                                  69 Camaro RS                     71 Mustang (from WIkipedia)

351C                                                         350                                         Boss 351

L. 193.8"                                                  186"                                          189.5

W. 74.1"                                                     74"                                            74.1

H. 50.7                                                      51.1"                                         50.1

Wheelbase 109.1"                                    108"                                         109

3,411LBS.                                             3,492LBS.                                   3560

 

[Big Red Mach 1]

Can you add a column with the 71/72 dimensions?

1971





Body Length


189.5 inches




Body Width


74.1 inches




Body Height Hardtop


50.8 inches




Body Height Fastback


50.1 inches




Track Front


61.5 inches




Track Rear


61.5 inches




Wheelbase


109.0 inches




Weight Fastback


3560 lb

 

[Big Red Mach 1]

I would have totally assumed the 73 was heavier. Not sure how the monster bumpers got added and it lost weight. But who knows about these internet specs. Point was that no one ever bitched about a 69 Camaro. And other than a few extra inches in length, they are close to identical. 

 

[tony-muscle]

The 71-73s are big compared to the 64 1/2-68 models, but it stuck and it's misused as being big compared to other cars. Mustang's own Iacocca called the 69 heavy compared to his vision of the first Mustangs, which were to be compact sports cars. From what I understand, Ford wanted (and needed) to compete in the horsepower war. The GTOs, the Plymouths and then the Camaros (all weighing around the same 3,500 lbs). To compete with more horsepower, the Mustang ended up as a bigger and heavier car. The "big" V8s added a lot of weight to the base car. Unfortunately, most of the data out there [and used for comparison] is for the base car.

 

[Stanglover]

He has some great stuff on his channel, but the M-code test is a bit misleading.

First - he used custom Ross pop-up pistons, which puts the compression WAY above what a stock M-code had. Ford advertised 11:1 for 1970 and 10.7:1 for 1971, which are both complete BS. Using the 70 head specs, the best calculated ratio is 9.9:1, the worst, 9.5:1. Using 71 heads, it drops to 9.5 and 9.3.  The domes on the pistons have been machined down and he does say 11:1, so I can only assume that's where he's at. Still, that's NOT stock M-code territory. 

Hemikiller, this is NOT intended to dispute what your compression ratio number are, but to just show the numbers I got from UEI Pistons  with regards to KB 177 and 148 pistons. The KB177  (flat top) are .020" taller than stock, so on an engine that has not been decked, the deck height would be .008". Even at this, with a +.030" over bore, they only come up with 10.56:1, still below what Ford claimed for the stock engine. With KB 148 pistons with a 13cc dish, still .020" taller (compression height) they come up with 9.36:1. With zero deck, mine came up with closer to 9.5:1, which with 91 oct. pump gas, is just about right, no pinging with correct timing curve.

View attachment comp ratio.pdf

 

[MeanMachine]

Anyone interested in the dimensions I found for the 2020 GT?

54.3" H

75.4" W

188.5 L

Weight: 3705 lbs (Manual) / 3733 lbs (Auto)

Considering these stats, should they still call the '71-'73 Mustangs the "Big-Bodies"

 

[tony-muscle]

On the topic, this is a nice article with historical weight data for Mustangs from CJP.

https://www.cjponyparts.com/resources/mustang-curb-weights

Out of curiosity I wanted to see for the first generation, what was the bigger engine available and the maximum weight listed for the fastbacks (which is likely the one with the biggest engine). Data from CJP article and Wikipedia. Please make corrections if needed. The data for 1967 is conflicting.

1965: 2,914 lbs, 289 Windsor

1966: 2,978 lbs, 289 Windsor

1967: 2,919 lbs, 390 FE (Weight here does not make sense so this data may not be accurate)

1968: 3,362 lbs, 428 Cobra Jet

1969: 3,463 lbs, 429 Boss

1970: 3,472 lbs, 429 Boss

1971: 3,607 lbs, 429 Cobra Jet

1972: 3,437 lbs, 351 Cleveland

1973: 3,521 lbs, 351 Cleveland

The point is that the cars became generally heavier due to the bigger engines, which meant beefier bodies and drivetrain. Also bigger noses to fit the bigger engines.

 

[Hemikiller]

I'd call BS on the 69/70 data - Ford's own data book says the 70 Mach 1 was 3400 lb with a 351/3speed. 

 

[tony-muscle]

I'd call BS on the 69/70 data - Ford's own data book says the 70 Mach 1 was 3400 lb with a 351/3speed. 

The data for weight is from the CJP article and it is given as a range. Probably it did not include the 429 in that range because I doubt the 429 is only 72 lbs heavier than the 351, plus any additional weight from 3 to 4 speed.

 

[c9zx]

From an OLD post.



The questionof  how much do the cars weigh has come up several times. I had my car scaled today using a four corner race car scale system. With approximately 13 gallonsof fuel , without driver, it weighed 3583 lb.. Thefuel  weighs about 80.6 lb.. It is a 72 Mach 1, AC, PS, PDB, Magnum 500 wheels, sp...

•  February 19, 2013
  

 

[7173Vert]

I always figured my 71 J Code Vert to be in the 3800lb range ( not including gas...). The Vert frame set up, all inclusive, adds 200 lbs +\- and the big block 100-150 lbs. 

I will have to get it weighed one day...

 

[Mister 4x4]

I know perspective is always a factor, but I think these offer up some compelling evidence to support argument that the '71-'73 are are NOT as gigantic as everybody thinks.

So this shows the relative size comparison - pretty much the same except the nose looks MUCH smaller on the '70.  Why is that?  (The '71 would also look shorter and possibly even longer if the TuTone and rockers were black, I imagine)

View attachment 28828

Because the nose is squared off on the '71-'73s, rather than tapered on the '69-'70s.  Look how much bigger the nose of the '70 Shelby looks than the '69 Mustang.



I don't know about you, but the newer car looks a LOT bigger than the '71.  I think everybody is now used to seeing huge wheels on newer cars and tend to forget that the older cars had smaller wheels, thus making them appear bigger than they are (in proportion).



The newer Mustangs almost seem like minivans in comparison.  (Forgive me as a take the same kind of liberty with my comment as those who complain about how gigantic our 'Big Bodied Clydesdales' are)



And just for fun, since everybody thinks '71-'73s are SO big, let's compare a '70s against a newer Mustang... which looks less smaller than the newer Mustang than the '71 does above.



People would rather just stick with the same ol' arguments when they have nothing new or credible to add to the mix.

Keep comparing numbers against numbers all day, and the arguments hold water.  Line 'em up and see the arguments disappear.

 

[midlife]

The original fake news story.  Nothing here...move along please.

 

[EdM]

1973  Mustang                                  69 Camaro RS                     71 Mustang (from WIkipedia)

351C                                                         350                                         Boss 351

L. 193.8"                                                  186"                                          189.5

W. 74.1"                                                     74"                                            74.1

H. 50.7                                                      51.1"                                         50.1

Wheelbase 109.1"                                    108"                                         109

3,411LBS.                                             3,492LBS.                                   3560

Hence my question. Same goes on with my Mopar forum where the A bodies apparently had to start their own forum from the "collectables".