Holley Sniper EFI and RobbMC Surge Tank, 351c and FMX

[Fabrice]

k, so today went ok, tho, again, loads of time goes to small things



First a pict of the tmp sensor + original relocated to pump. (will change that red colour wire later on)



Prepared the sending unit for the tank. Felt bit crazy to semi destroy a good working unit that

costed in total $170 thanks to transport and the great dutch taxes. Lets try to quickly forget that one

As Don C suggested, as these are from MustangOhio and indeed they looked be of good quality, if you do the swap.

Replace the old sending unit with this new one and apply the punishment to the old one. Mine was changed last year,

so I won't touch it.

I've kept the filter for now, No sure I need to, or if that really matters. I'll see during install.



As announced, it was "bracket day" today and started with doing a temporary one, as I've not decided yet where to actually place the

kick down on uint, I've made this one so its inline and I can come back to that Lokar thingy later on. (gonna CAD that thing to have the best possible location and length)

@Adam, on my setup, using the original bracket, the throttle cable needs an offset of 3.5 cm. The bracket here reproduces the front face of the ford bracket.

I'll provide later on detailed figure once I'll do the final one with the KD and properly welded. I simply didn't settle yet on wether the cable should be below or next to it.



Then came an unexpected new bracket in sight. The unit connector for the positive, negative that needs be directly connected to the battery and

the positive wire for the fuel pomp has two electrical components that need be screwed somewhere. As I do not want drill the firewall unless I have no choice,

I've reused one of the stud that hold the air system inside the car. So made a robust bracket that will hold both units and keep them nicely aligned on firewall.



Because my battery is located in trunk and need go thru the car, location's ideal as its next to the grommet. Once in place, aside being firmly in place and

away from block heat, they almost gone for the eye. Once, i'll have properly routed and secured the wires inside, i'll hide/protect them better.



And then it was time for some gym! Somehow a simple thing like passing wires thru a grommet that leads high into the dashboard always

let you discover some unknown muscles which I'm sure I'll remember even more tomorrow morning

Still need to define where i'm gonna pass the wire + connector of the monitor. Prolly thru the airco grommet on passenger side.

All with all, nothing but many details to do here and there. Next session, more picts!

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

k, so today went ok, tho, again, loads of time goes to small things



First a pict of the tmp sensor + original relocated to pump. (will change that red colour wire later on)



Prepared the sending unit for the tank. Felt bit crazy to semi destroy a good working unit that

costed in total $170 thanks to transport and the great dutch taxes. Lets try to quickly forget that one

As Don C suggested, as these are from MustangOhio and indeed they looked be of good quality, if you do the swap.

Replace the old sending unit with this new one and apply the punishment to the old one. Mine was changed last year,

so I won't touch it.

I've kept the filter for now, No sure I need to, or if that really matters. I'll see during install.



As announced, it was "bracket day" today and started with doing a temporary one, as I've not decided yet where to actually place the

kick down on uint, I've made this one so its inline and I can come back to that Lokar thingy later on. (gonna CAD that thing to have the best possible location and length)

@Adam, on my setup, using the original bracket, the throttle cable needs an offset of 3.5 cm. The bracket here reproduces the front face of the ford bracket.

I'll provide later on detailed figure once I'll do the final one with the KD and properly welded. I simply didn't settle yet on wether the cable should be below or next to it.



Then came an unexpected new bracket in sight. The unit connector for the positive, negative that needs be directly connected to the battery and

the positive wire for the fuel pomp has two electrical components that need be screwed somewhere. As I do not want drill the firewall unless I have no choice,

I've reused one of the stud that hold the air system inside the car. So made a robust bracket that will hold both units and keep them nicely aligned on firewall.



Because my battery is located in trunk and need go thru the car, location's ideal as its next to the grommet. Once in place, aside being firmly in place and

away from block heat, they almost gone for the eye. Once, i'll have properly routed and secured the wires inside, i'll hide/protect them better.



And then it was time for some gym! Somehow a simple thing like passing wires thru a grommet that leads high into the dashboard always

let you discover some unknown muscles which I'm sure I'll remember even more tomorrow morning

Still need to define where i'm gonna pass the wire + connector of the monitor. Prolly thru the airco grommet on passenger side.

All with all, nothing but many details to do here and there. Next session, more picts!

Awesome progress Fabrice that's encouraging to see! Do you have any slack on the Coolant temp sensor for the Sniper? Mine was ridiculously close to not fitting and the wire is taunt with little to no slack. 

I will wire up my Surge Tank tomorrow, then finally put the sniper on and will begin to wire it as well. So you're saying the throttle cable needed to be offset 3.5cm horizontally towards the driver's side from the original location correct? And this is using Holley's supplied linkage on the actual throttle body? Did you need to move the throttle cable up or down at all? Looks like you stayed level and went 3.5cm towards the driver's side, but better to clarify than to assume, right?  ::thumb::

Thanks,

Adam

 

[Fabrice]

@adam, yes plenty slack for me, in fact a little too many, so wires for sensors need be secured as they potentially could be go too near of the waterpump pulley/belt. I want do first basic install and once the thing runs, I'm gonna redo the engine wiring. Notice for instance the small aluminum tube on the pict with throttle bracket, currently 4 wires for ignition, watertemp go thru it. This keeps them and engine clean and safe.

So I'll redo a new one with all wires once ideal length and locations are known. Its tedious to make, as you have to drill holes like a flute, pass all wires thru and then bend, its a 'allgood or allWrong' thingy, but

It makes maintenance so easy, it's worth it. All this to say, new one might go to the other side to host watertemp and the unit wires for accessories. Tho atm, none of the ports from this connector have use to me.

Yes the offset to compensate the throttle alignment is 3.5 cm. Measured from center holes on original bracket. I've kept same height as the nipple (biggest ball of the two provided) as its nicely paralel to engine heads, and there is sufficient distance from the unit axle center. Unlike Lokar, Holley understands the laws of rotations so, as original bracket is 2 cm from its side, if you add 2 more on the other side, you have same part as I did. If you pick to set the lever of the KD inline on lowest nipple hole of the unit, you need drill a hole beneath the screw that secures your throttle cable. This means the bracket would need become L shapped. Which was one of the reasons, I decided wait a bit to make the final piece.

An important aspect to not forget, is that because of the offset, the bracket needs be folded. Not just made of thicker metal, so it does not bend and eventually get tired. There is quite a force applied to it. Not wonder the original is made that strong. So for the final version, I'll prolly add an extra bar from extreme back to the 2 bolts base on the intake...

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

@adam, yes plenty slack for me, in fact a little too many, so wires for sensors need be secured as they potentially could be go too near of the waterpump pulley/belt. I want do first basic install and once the thing runs, I'm gonna redo the engine wiring. Notice for instance the small aluminum tube on the pict with throttle bracket, currently 4 wires for ignition, watertemp go thru it. This keeps them and engine clean and safe.

So I'll redo a new one with all wires once ideal length and locations are known. Its tedious to make, as you have to drill holes like a flute, pass all wires thru and then bend, its a 'allgood or allWrong' thingy, but

It makes maintenance so easy, it's worth it. All this to say, new one might go to the other side to host watertemp and the unit wires for accessories. Tho atm, none of the ports from this connector have use to me.

Yes the offset to compensate the throttle alignment is 3.5 cm. Measured from center holes on original bracket. I've kept same height as the nipple (biggest ball of the two provided) as its nicely paralel to engine heads, and there is sufficient distance from the unit axle center. Unlike Lokar, Holley understands the laws of rotations  so, as original bracket is 2 cm from its side, if you add 2 more on the other side, you have same part as I did. If you pick to set the lever of the KD inline on lowest nipple hole of the unit, you need drill a hole beneath the screw that secures your throttle cable. This means the bracket would need become L shapped. Which was one of the reasons, I decided wait a bit to make the final piece.

An important aspect to not forget, is that because of the offset, the bracket needs be folded. Not just made of thicker metal, so it does not bend and eventually get tired. There is quite a force applied to it. Not wonder the original is made that strong. So for the final version, I'll prolly add an extra bar from extreme back to the 2 bolts base on the intake...

hmmm that's interesting considering I have such little slack. Will continue to follow your lead for the kickdown, can't wait to see your progress!

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

Update:

I have now got everything hooked up, but the one thing I'm missing is a 12v ignition source... Tried the + side of the coil, but it has resistor or something and drops the volts to 6.. Anyone have any idea if theres another 12v ignition source in the engine bay?

 

[73pony]

Did your car have the anti diesel set up? The power ran to the actuator was a full 12v igniting source. I used mine for my elec choke. Also. If you are running an aftermarket ignition like a pertronix etc you should have a full 12v going to the coil. There is a factory resistor there that would either need to be removed or wire it to a relay like I did so you don't have to cut the factory wires.

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

Did your car have the anti diesel set up? The power ran to the actuator was a full 12v igniting source. I used mine for my elec choke.

Not too sure what that is? Where abouts is it located so that I can check?

 

[73pony]

The anti diesel was an actuator on the carb that would activate and open the throttle slightly while running then when you shut the car off it was deenergized and made sure the butterflies closed completely to prevent run on. It was hooked up on the drivers side of the carb.

 

[73pony]

Here are a couple pics of what it looked like.

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

Did your car have the anti diesel set up? The power ran to the actuator was a full 12v igniting source. I used mine for my elec choke. Also. If you are running an aftermarket ignition like a pertronix etc you should have a full 12v going to the coil. There is a factory resistor there that would either need to be removed or wire it to a relay like I did so you don't have to cut the factory wires.

I have a full 12v in the wire going to the aftermarket pertonix coil, but as soon as I connect the wire to the coil it drops to 6v. However, if I connect the throttle body and the surge tank to the wire WITHOUT connecting to the coil, it works fine and runs at 12v. Unfortunately, I need my coil and thus cannot get around it dropping the wire to 6v. I tried making a pig tail wire to see if splicing the wire going to the coil would work, but it seems the voltage in the wire gets dropped to 6v as soon as it's attached..

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

Here are a couple pics of what it looked like.

Was this an option back in the day or was it standard on all 72 models? When I bought the car it already had an aftermarket carb on it, so if it was an option I don't know if I have it. I will search around near the firewall to see if I can find the wire that went to this regardless, thanks!

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

Here are a couple pics of what it looked like.

Was this an option back in the day or was it standard on all 72 models? When I bought the car it already had an aftermarket carb on it, so if it was an option I don't know if I have it. I will search around near the firewall to see if I can find the wire that went to this regardless, thanks!

SUCCESS!! After tons of messing around under the dash and touching every connection possible with a test light and multimeter, finally found this right in the perfect spot behind the throttle body. 12v ignition, not being used.   





Not sure if this is what 73pony was referring to, but regardless thank you for your help! 

Hopefully in the morning after wiring both the Sniper EFI and the PowerSurge to it, I'll be able to start her!

 

[Fabrice]

Hard to see the connector, Is it not the one ment for the airco compressor? Its on when ignition key's on and stays on during kranking? If true this might become my guy too!

 

[Fabrice]

In side news of the install... Before ordering the kit, I was in contact with Holley techs and they provided me a pdf about the product and content of the kit.

One of them, as I wrote in a previous reply, was that the fuel lines supposed to cover feed and return lines said 40ft in this doc, were in fact 20ft on delivery.

Being an old monkey and because of the extra costs involved for us people of the other side of the pool. I've mailed them

asking for nothing, just to let them know that for a kit that cost us 1/3 more than US customers. It would not have made any difference

pay a few buxx more and be sure to have plenty length to make a secure install, with no worries about coming short.

Just got a reply from Holley: Looks like they do care about old monkeys. The missing 20ft line is about to take off and should land here in a few days, free of charges.

As I can work on the car only weekends and I'll prolly need that return line by next weekend. It might just be on time.

I was going to buy it locally and I will if its not here on time.

But from this Holley's reply, all I can say is: thumbs up!

 

[Don C]

Hard to see the connector, Is it not the one ment for the airco compressor? Its on when ignition key's on and stays on during kranking? If true this might become my guy too!

When emission modifications were made in the early '70s engines developed a tendency to continue to try to run after the key was turned off and was referred to as dieseling (no ignition, just fuel being drawn in through the carburetor). To try to stop this a throttle position solenoid was added to the carburetors that set the throttle plate idle position as soon as the key was turned on. When the key was turned off the throttle plates returned to the completely closed position so the engine couldn't run. For most of our cars this happened in 1972, although some 6 cylinder cars, with automatics, received it in 1971. My '71 M code did not have it, so I had to run a separate wire for the electric choke.

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

SHE RUNS!!!

Took a while to get her going at the beginning because I forgot to set the idle screw back to normal after messing around with it  :shootself:   But all good now the car starts right up every time, just let it do some self learning. It's a pretty hot day and the car idling in the garage is getting up to 190 degrees so I shut her off for the time being while I research the other parameters.

Currently it's at around 13.5 AFR is this a decent number?

 

[Don C]

That's great news. You must feel like turning cartwheels on the lawn.

13.5 sounds reasonable to me. Does your instruction manual say what to expect?

 

[NewAgeMuscle]

That's great news. You must feel like turning cartwheels on the lawn.

13.5 sounds reasonable to me. Does your instruction manual say what to expect?

Yes I am very happy to say the least. Manual says it should be anywhere from 13.5-15 at idle, but may need to be richer than that for a bigger cam. This is my cam: https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/cca-32-421-8/overview/ not sure what it's considered as in the grand scheme of things so I pressed the mild/stock cam category instead of the Street/Strip or Race categories (hopefully that was a good choice). It's a really hot day here in Vancouver though about 82F or 28 celsius, so when stopped at idle the car heats up pretty fast. While cruising shes around 86 F. Time for electric fans and an alum radiator next!!

 

[Fabrice]

SHE RUNS!!!

Yeeeeeha!

Dam I wish I could continue work on this install right now! Wife's todos during Sniper installs should be forbidden by law...

@Don C

Mine came with it, I recall dump the charcoal cannister, the old carb with that thing on it and most 2v specifics stuffs.. (was 18 at the time, something I would no longer do). So I should have that connector and it might still be hot... unless its one of the circuits I've shutdown/removed when I've done the dashboard.

 

[Fabrice]

For some amazing reasons, wife's todo went "poof"

Guess what I did instead

More wiring, while at it renewed vaccum hoses, secured and sorted the mess of wires behind engine. Haven't found that connector.

So studied the ignition switch circuit in good old Haynes book, and so went the last unit wire for the engine baye to its place.

As I forgot buy an aluminum plate to make the kickdown bracket, I went back to the hood/ram air closing issue.

No matter how the sniper works, I can't drive with an open hood.



Measured all again, so the extra height of the unit plus the spacer would match the arc of the hood while closing.

As there's no way back but redo an entire new one, took my time and the diff was out. Repainted the exposed polymer at the cut.



Then after some massage it got its shine back, cleanup both unit and in ram-air high flow filters and re-oiled them.



and voila! Fits perfect and hood closes tight on it.

Tomorrow I'll remove the front fender to see if there's a safer route than via trans tunnel and not too visible for the fuel lines...