exploding oil filter, Please Help!!

[Omie01]

I tried to fire up my new Cleveland tonight, and while I was priming the oil system My FL1A filter exploded. OK, so maybe a bad filter? Well, went to the store got more oil and a Wix filter, got it all home, prime the oil system for a minute and a half with the oil pressure gauge reading between 60-70 psi the whole time, then dropped in the dizzy, fired it up. It ran for about 30 seconds and then BANG, the oil filter blew again!! I did prime the system this last Wednesday and had no problems, I ran the drill for a full minute with no issues, so I was quite surprised when the first filter blew tonight, and then REALLY surprised when the second one blew tonight so something has to be wrong. The oil pump is a standard volume blueprinted pump from Precision Oil Pumps. Anybody ever have this happen?:huh:

 

[Paul of MO]

Did you you do any oil system mods? If so what.

Did you replace the oil pump spring or shim it?

Did you drill prime the oil system with the valve covers off so you can see if everything up top is getting oil?

Do you have a remote filter or is it screwed to the block?

I have had wix and fram filters pop but never had a real FL1A fail.

How and where are you reading the oil pressure at? A stuck bypass will cause your issue but you would see 100 psi or higher if that was the issue.

- Paul of MO

 

[jbojo]

Sounds like a sticking oil pump relief valve or incorrect spring installed.

 

[barnett468]

ummm, yeah, what jbojo said.

is it a high flow pump?

what is your oil viscosity?

need to know the claimed pressure of the pump.

you get 70 with the drill at 500 rpm so you will get 100 at 1000 rpm if it has a stuck valve.

 

[TommyK]

Maybe a call to Precision oil pumps is in order. My guess would be a stuck pump relief valve as previously suggested.

If the pump spring has been shimmed to raise the pressure you may need to use a racing type filter. The racing filters have a much higher burst pressure rating. The FL1A has a burst pressure rating of 200 psi. The FL1A-HP is about double that. A Jomar filter is rated at 600 psi. Keep in mind that race filters typically don't have a bypass valve so they need to be changed more often and are probably not appropriate for year round daily driving in a cold climate but I doubt that is the case here.

Good Luck.

(Edited for fat fingers and not enough coffee)

 

[Omie01]

The lifter bores have bushings with .060" holes, I have the Tim Meyer cam bearings, And Tim Meyer oil mods in the bottom, not sure what that means but it's in the paper work, I'm guessing the No.1 main plug with enlarged second hole. Not sure if I'm saying that right, but its covered in the Cleveland building book. As far as I know nothing outside of the blueprinting was done to the oil pump, I did not request heavier springs or anything. I have an electric oil pressure gauge in the car, so I turned the key to the "on" position before priming, thats where I got the oil pressure from. When I used the drill to prime I started slow, you can feel resistance build up to a peak, and then start backing off, after that I can spin my drill to the full 400 rpm. If I just floor the drill right away it will blow the filter, so I'm thinking a sticky or slow bypass valve in the oil pump. Geez, pay that kind of money for an oil pump you would think it should not have an issue!!! I started with Brad Penn 10w40, but after first filter blew, I went to VR-1 30w, which I was able to prime system with, but when I started the car the filter blew again. Should I go get a high pressure filter and try it, or just replace the pump? I did have the valve covers off Wed night and confirmed I was getting oil up to as well. So twice I primed it with no burst, Once I primed it and filter burst, second time I tried starting engine and filter blew.

 

[Paul of MO]

The lifter bores have bushings with .060" holes, I have the Tim Meyer cam bearings, And Tim Meyer oil mods in the bottom, not sure what that means but it's in the paper work, I'm guessing the No.1 main plug with enlarged second hole. Not sure if I'm saying that right, but its covered in the Cleveland building book. As far as I know nothing outside of the blueprinting was done to the oil pump, I did not request heavier springs or anything. I have an electric oil pressure gauge in the car, so I turned the key to the "on" position before priming, thats where I got the oil pressure from. When I used the drill to prime I started slow, you can feel resistance build up to a peak, and then start backing off, after that I can spin my drill to the full 400 rpm. If I just floor the drill right away it will blow the filter, so I'm thinking a sticky or slow bypass valve in the oil pump. Geez, pay that kind of money for an oil pump you would think it should not have an issue!!! I started with Brad Penn 10w40, but after first filter blew, I went to VR-1 30w, which I was able to prime system with, but when I started the car the filter blew again. Should I go get a high pressure filter and try it, or just replace the pump? I did have the valve covers off Wed night and confirmed I was getting oil up to as well. So twice I primed it with no burst, Once I primed it and filter burst, second time I tried starting engine and filter blew.

It is possible whom ever did all the work may have shimmed or replaced the bypass spring and got it too stiff or jammed it up - you did not ask for this but many people insist that this just has to be done. It does not.

If you are mechanically able, no disrespect if your are not, I would run out to your local auto parts store and buy a simple, stock, inexpensive, oil pump. Swap it out and see what happens.

You could get a racing FL1A and it may work but if the bypass is stuck then you risk damaging your oil pump drive gear / distributor shaft / oil pump drive shaft because they will always be under an excessive amount of torque.

If you saw good oil flow at the rockers at the back of the drivers side and the front of the passenger side then your oiling system is not blocked. This need to be observed again with the new standard oil pump installed.

Has this engine even been broke in yet? It is likely you have washed all the assembly lube from your rod and main bearings at this point. This is not ideal but you can still break it in.

Is it in your car or are you doing this on a stand?

Or - call your builder and have him fix it. Either the builder or the oil pump company owes you some assistance.

Sorry - This kind of situation is what kills the fun and drives good people away from the hobby.

Paul of MO

 

[Omie01]

It has not been broken in, but was ran on a simulator. It has a roller cam so I'm not too worried about break-in. I have just decided to change the pump. I just can't risk anything short of the right thing on this engine!!


OH! And its already in the car!! Awesome!!! Thanks everybody!! As usual all your insight is great!!::thumb::

 

[Paul of MO]

It has not been broken in, but was ran on a simulator. It has a roller cam so I'm not too worried about break-in. I have just decided to change the pump. I just can't risk anything short of the right thing on this engine!!


OH! And its already in the car!! Awesome!!! Thanks everybody!! As usual all your insight is great!!::thumb::

Great - with a roller cam you are good to go once you get the oil filters to quit exploding.

If it was already running at some point then the bypass must have opened on a cold start and got stuck. That is my best guess.

Have fun - keep us posted.

- Paul of MO

 

[EBSTANG]

The lifter bores have bushings with .060" holes, I have the Tim Meyer cam bearings, And Tim Meyer oil mods in the bottom, not sure what that means but it's in the paper work, I'm guessing the No.1 main plug with enlarged second hole. Not sure if I'm saying that right, but its covered in the Cleveland building book. As far as I know nothing outside of the blueprinting was done to the oil pump, I did not request heavier springs or anything. I have an electric oil pressure gauge in the car, so I turned the key to the "on" position before priming, thats where I got the oil pressure from. When I used the drill to prime I started slow, you can feel resistance build up to a peak, and then start backing off, after that I can spin my drill to the full 400 rpm. If I just floor the drill right away it will blow the filter, so I'm thinking a sticky or slow bypass valve in the oil pump. Geez, pay that kind of money for an oil pump you would think it should not have an issue!!! I started with Brad Penn 10w40, but after first filter blew, I went to VR-1 30w, which I was able to prime system with, but when I started the car the filter blew again. Should I go get a high pressure filter and try it, or just replace the pump? I did have the valve covers off Wed night and confirmed I was getting oil up to as well. So twice I primed it with no burst, Once I primed it and filter burst, second time I tried starting engine and filter blew.

It is possible whom ever did all the work may have shimmed or replaced the bypass spring and got it too stiff or jammed it up - you did not ask for this but many people insist that this just has to be done. It does not.

If you are mechanically able, no disrespect if your are not, I would run out to your local auto parts store and buy a simple, stock, inexpensive, oil pump. Swap it out and see what happens.

You could get a racing FL1A and it may work but if the bypass is stuck then you risk damaging your oil pump drive gear / distributor shaft / oil pump drive shaft because they will always be under an excessive amount of torque.

If you saw good oil flow at the rockers at the back of the drivers side and the front of the passenger side then your oiling system is not blocked. This need to be observed again with the new standard oil pump installed.

Has this engine even been broke in yet? It is likely you have washed all the assembly lube from your rod and main bearings at this point. This is not ideal but you can still break it in.

Is it in your car or are you doing this on a stand?

Or - call your builder and have him fix it. Either the builder or the oil pump company owes you some assistance.

Sorry - This kind of situation is what kills the fun and drives good people away from the hobby.

Paul of MO

true.

 

[barnett468]

you did not tell us which pump it is . they make 3 different kinds.

the problem is the pump

remove the pump and if it is high volume, install a standard volume pump.

if it is standard volume, you can remove the bypass piston and check for debris and free movement . if you even think it is sticky anywhere in its travel, run a small ball hone in the bore for around 5 seconds and lightly sand the piston with 600 and wd40.

a 60 lb spring is the most you need with your setup but a 70 is also fine and wont blow a pump.

reinstall the pump and secure the oil pan with just 4 bolts and fill it up with just 4 qts and try it again.

 

[Omie01]

Its a Melling M84A blueprinted by Precision oil pumps, they claim to leave the stock springs in them.

 

[barnett468]

Its a Melling M84A blueprinted by Precision oil pumps, they claim to leave the stock springs in them.

ok, standard volume, therefore your bypass is likely messed up as was previously mentioned . This has happened on a few Mellings pumps lately but it should not happen on one you paid to have it checked on . If you do what i said and it "should" be fine.

NO WARRANTEES OR GUARANTEES EXPRESSED OR IMPLIED

 

[Paul of MO]

"This has happened on a few Mellings pumps lately"

How the "heck" would you know this? Do you handle Mellings quality control as well? geese.......

Omie01, Go to Napa, get a pump, they have them in stock, and swap it out. Easy as pie.........

If the stock Napa pump does the same thing then your oiling system is completely blocked somewhere and even with the bypass open it is not bleeding off enough oil pressure and is bursting the filters.

If it does pop the filter with the new pump then your builder owes you a tear down and reassemble.

Keep us posted!

Paul of MO

 

[Omie01]

How do I remove the cap that holds the bypass valve and spring? The reason I can not blueprint my own pump is because I cannot get this cap out without destroying it, and If I do destroy it, where can I get another cap? I really don't want to take a chance on an out-of-the-box pump, I would rather know it is a good pump, hence the reason I thought "Precision" was the way to go. Thanks guys!!

 

[barnett468]

"This has happened on a few Mellings pumps lately"

How the "heck" would you know this? Do you handle Mellings quality control as well? geese.......

Paul of MO

Easy, I am a restorer and engine builder and also have several friends that are and have seen this first hand which is why I suggest that people check the pumps before installing them . This only takes maybe 30 minutes to do, however, installing one and having to replace it after the pan is on and the engine is in the car takes slightly longer.

In fact, one person I know of got a standard pump from Melling for a Clevo and it had 100 psi at idle so he called them and they sent him another one which did the exact same thing, so he called them again and this time they had him send both pumps back to them and had one of their techs go thru another new pump to insure it worked properly and when he installed it, it did work perfectly

You have been warned to stop making sarcastic comments yet you continue to do so and this is disruptive to threads and does not benefit anyone.

I suggest that if you have any useful info you post it without any additional sarcastic commentary and start treating people with respect instead of indignation.

FYI - This should not be a contest of who knows what and they do not give prizes to those whom are right.

.

 

[Don65Stang]

I have temporally closed this thread while the staff is in discussion. Please do not PM us about the matter.

 

[barnett468]

How do I remove the cap that holds the bypass valve and spring? The reason I can not blueprint my own pump is because I cannot get this cap out without destroying it, and If I do destroy it, where can I get another cap? I really don't want to take a chance on an out-of-the-box pump, I would rather know it is a good pump, hence the reason I thought "Precision" was the way to go. Thanks guys!!

To get the plug out you can sometimes hit it on the edge with a flat end punch or screwdriver to knock it sideways then pull it out with needle nose pliers . You can also drill a hole in them then install a sheet metal screw part way then grab the screw with vice grips and pull it out.

Many parts stores have the plugs and Dorman is a big supplier of them . If you know of a parts store that has a lot of the orange Dorman boxes, they will likely have them.

They may call them freeze plugs, soft plugs, steel cup plugs or oil galley plugs.

.

 

[Paul of MO]

Omie,

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not take the new pump apart!

Melling has great quality control and builds 100,000's of oil pumps each year. The chances of getting a bad one is almost zero.

Put it in - run the engine - and if nothing bad happens and you do not have 100 plus psi then life is good. If you pop a filter then the oil mod was done wrong. Simple as that.

As far as the pump goes "If it ain't broke don't fix it"

- Paul of MO