Power steering totally gone

[Fabrice]

Yesterday, thinking I was done on mechanical stuffs and finally could work on last bits for body

before go to paint, drove car few meters back out of garage to clean up floor...

Power steering: zero

Pump is been replaced like 5 years ago together with hoses.

It did not have to do much since then as the car didn't left the garage.

Checked the level on pump, all nice and fresh looking ATF type F. No leaks either.

All dry on both steering gear and pump.

It may be off for a while as I never needed to turn the wheel.

So question is: what can it be? Is there some checks I could do

before opening the pump?

 

[delawarebill]

when u fired it up did the p/s squeal ? of course it could be steering box or p/s pump. but i'd be looking at the pump. there are fittings u can buy to put a gage on it. but the gage is going to be 1000 psi. maybe ask around to see if a shop can ck the pressure for u.

 

[Stanglover]

I'm just throwing this one out there as I have just had some sort of failure on my PS SPA-T box. My issue has been progressively getting worse, but the other night, I lost power steering to the right so it was just like manual........ but harder. Although my box had supposedly been rebuilt professionally, the 'power valve' has failed. Not sure how or why yet.

So I wondering if this internal valve in the box has stuck or otherwise failed. There could be some crap in it that is blocking the fluid. Time for a complete re-build of both pump and box IMO. If it is the power valve, you likely will have to buy a spare box just for that part as I'm told by my "guy" that they are not available rebuilt.

In my case I bought an SPA-S fixed ratio box that I threw in for now, but I have an SPA-T box on the way, which I'm hoping will be good.

Geoff.

 

[Fabrice]

@delawarebill

mmm, after you mentioned it, I recall now, that a while back I did hear a weird noise, and steering wheel wasn't smooth while turning.

Thought it was some air and went full turn on both sides and it went away. Pushed that, back then, on the "its normal for a car that sits in garage all the time" pile..

Being freelancer, a long period passed since then before I got some free time to work on car again and totally forgot about it.

Was looking in between work at this vid


looks like same or similar pump, i have the pulley extractor. doesn't seam like very challenging.

Or are there other options to test the pump before I order a set?

I will next time I can return to it, try to test with wheels just off the ground to see if any diffs..

 

[tony-muscle]

I also had a remanufactured pump from a reputable company that failed. Mine was from Lee Steeting, who is not in business anymore. Now I am looking into replacing my pump with a Saginaw pump. I bought one to test fitment and it should work with a few tweaks. I don't know yet if the pressure will be compatible, but I think it should work. I will mount and test it next year after I get my engine back.

 

[Fabrice]

No time during week to work on the car, will do this weekend... Whats the best way to purge the system?

The Saginaw pumps (the ones with diamond like shapes) aren't these Chevy thingies?

 

[tony-muscle]

No time during week to work on the car, will do this weekend... Whats the best way to purge the system?

The Saginaw pumps (the ones with diamond like shapes) aren't these Chevy thingies?

Copy and pasted from the manual:

Air Bleeding

Air in the power steenng system 

(shown by bubbles in the fluid) should

be bled. After making sure that the

reservoir is filled to specification (the

fluid must be at normal operating

temperature, 165 degrees F to 175 .

degrees F, when the check is made),

turn the steering wheel through its full

travel three or four times. Do not hold

the wheels against their stops.

Recheck the fluid level.

Yes, the Saginaw is a Chevy thing, but seen as a better pump than the Ford. Our steering boxes are Saginaws after all so not that much disparity. The Saginaw pump is rated to 1,200 psi, and the Mustang requires 1,175 (edit) psi minimum pressure - just saw it in the manual when I copied the above. May not be a switch for everyone, but I have not much to lose since I am replacing pretty much everything that moves in the engine bay and power train.

 

[Bentworker]

So do you have the "canned ham" Saginaw pump or the stock pump?

The Saginaw pumps are great, pressure is easily tuned with washers, flow is controlled by an orifice. Pretty cheap, reliable, a little lighter. Also you can get anywhere from the 700 psi range all the way up to about 1450 out of them.

 

[tony-muscle]

So do you have the "canned ham" Saginaw pump or the stock pump?

The Saginaw pumps are great, pressure is easily tuned with washers, flow is controlled by an orifice.  Pretty cheap, reliable, a little lighter.  Also you can get anywhere from the 700 psi range all the way up to about 1450 out of them.

I am trying a canned ham: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/TFF-6184B

Can't report yet since I have not installed. I just quickly checked the fit and it will need some minor tweaks. I got this one because the return tube is facing up. In most of them the return tube is facing down. Not a big deal, but with this model the return tube ends up being very close to where the stock pump's tube is.

I meant to say that this specific pump is rated to 1,200 psi, but as you say, it could be tuned easily. The minimum rating for our cars is 1,175 psi so it should work fine.

 

[Fabrice]

[Air Bleeding

Air in the power steenng system .....

the wheels against their stops.

Recheck the fluid level.]

That's what I did (and will retry first with wheel just off floor to check if its the pomp or if the gears are locked somehow), but was wondering is there is a way to "bleed" a bit like breaks system, to actually remove old fluid by adding new one.

 

[Fabrice]

K, tested today with front wheels off ground after topping to max the pump. First with engine off, wheels turned of course "heavy" but no feel of damaged gears. Engine on, exact same: no leaks, zero pressure.

So ordered a ford pump seal kit... if turns out it's still dead, a Saginaw pump will replace the Ford one...

 

[Fabrice]

A week past and still no mail for CJ Pony about my steering pump gasket kit. They have an online chat so...

I could have waited till chicken grow teeth. Their ordering system somehow added a null product in zero quantity on their side of the order,

which was then put in back order, as they don't have "null" in store, my order was on hold waiting for zero null...

Once rectified, package was send and received my tracking number.

So means I still have to wait 2 weeks for it

No biggy still have tons to do before it goes to painter. So today started the car, and turns out I have a Christine, a self healing car!

All is back, super smooth, still no leaks. Purged the air by turning max to both side twice. No sound, just pure smoothness.

Last week, no matter what I tried, wheels off ground etc, it was simply dead.

So I started rethink what I did last weekend before leave it rest for the week... I played with front pulley, and filled the pump almost up to the neck,

and when placed back the stick, and some pressure was required as it was bits overfilled. This somehow must have helped to either remove

some air bubble to allow the pump to init correctly. Today's level was bits above what it should be but surely lower than last time,

so as there is no leaks, air must have been playing a role... So I guess there is no more rush in the gasket kit, but will certainly

use it if it ever does this trick again.

Oh and I also seen that the little oil leak I used to have while the car did not run at trans shifter linkage also stopped. While oil trans level

is right on spot (checked hot in park).

Christine is in my garage and she finally values all I do for her and now she shows it to me! )