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1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
I know I have to replace the left side inner rocker support, most of the bottom of it is rusted out. The car is flexing when lifted. While I was setting it up on the stands to level it I temp put a metal rail across the reinforcement pans and found it does not sit flat on both pans. ( see pic with the arrows) My question is... is 3/16" off the way it is ok, or a bad thing??

Resize-Wizard-1.gif

 
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1972 Q code Mach 4spd
2004 350z
2005 Corvette
1971 Camaro SS/RS
I know I have to replace the left side inner rocker support, most of the bottom of it is rusted out. The car is flexing when lifted. While I was setting it up on the stands to level it I temp put a metal rail across the reinforcement pans and found it does not sit flat on both pans. ( see pic with the arrows) My question is... is 3/16" off the way it is ok, or a bad thing??
How are you leveling the car ? You really need to read the thread I posted on how to level the chassis (I posted the link for you in a previous thread) Your then gonna need to measure the rails as per the frame chart to make sure they are set in the correct position in relation to the unibody / rockers If you look at the dolly I made for my car in my videos & the measuring system I set up that's how you have to do it..any other way is just guessing or a shot in the dark 3/16" is within spec..I would put the reinforcement plate back in if possible WHEN THE UNIBODY & RAILS ARE CORRECTLY LOCATED its one more brace to keep things in place.. The way I would go about your repair is as follows.

1---set car up on dolly or similar at 4 corners of the rocker pinch weld

2--Level front to back & side to side on dolly

3--Set measuring system

4--set rails as per frame dimension chart front & back

5--Install braces as I previously linked to

6--Make all repairs to inner & outer rockers

7--Do not remove any brace work till all structural repairs are complete

 
Joined
Mar 21, 2011
Messages
196
Reaction score
1
Location
Kunkletown PA
My Car
1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
I know I have to replace the left side inner rocker support, most of the bottom of it is rusted out. The car is flexing when lifted. While I was setting it up on the stands to level it I temp put a metal rail across the reinforcement pans and found it does not sit flat on both pans. ( see pic with the arrows) My question is... is 3/16" off the way it is ok, or a bad thing??
How are you leveling the car ? You really need to read the thread I posted on how to level the chassis (I posted the link for you in a previous thread) Your then gonna need to measure the rails as per the frame chart to make sure they are set in the correct position in relation to the unibody / rockers If you look at the dolly I made for my car in my videos & the measuring system I set up that's how you have to do it..any other way is just guessing or a shot in the dark 3/16" is within spec..I would put the reinforcement plate back in if possible WHEN THE UNIBODY & RAILS ARE CORRECTLY LOCATED its one more brace to keep things in place.. The way I would go about your repair is as follows.

1---set car up on dolly or similar at 4 corners of the rocker pinch weld

2--Level front to back & side to side on dolly

3--Set measuring system

4--set rails as per frame dimension chart front & back

5--Install braces as I previously linked to

6--Make all repairs to inner & outer rockers

7--Do not remove any brace work till all structural repairs are complete
Yes thank you I did read it many times now.... maybe too many....LOL You can see the yellow stands in the pic, the lift arms are still just there when I took that pic. I have 4 stands and I am trying very hard to level it right. 3/16" may be good but I have a hard time with that, I am a perfectionist, precision welder/ machinist/ maintenance superviser. Well I do not do the maintenance part anymore. I think I have found the sag you told me about, still looking into it. I will keep you posted. keep the info comeing it does help!!

 
Joined
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Messages
2,888
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43
Location
U.S.A.
My Car
1972 Q code Mach 4spd
2004 350z
2005 Corvette
1971 Camaro SS/RS
I know I have to replace the left side inner rocker support, most of the bottom of it is rusted out. The car is flexing when lifted. While I was setting it up on the stands to level it I temp put a metal rail across the reinforcement pans and found it does not sit flat on both pans. ( see pic with the arrows) My question is... is 3/16" off the way it is ok, or a bad thing??
How are you leveling the car ? You really need to read the thread I posted on how to level the chassis (I posted the link for you in a previous thread) Your then gonna need to measure the rails as per the frame chart to make sure they are set in the correct position in relation to the unibody / rockers If you look at the dolly I made for my car in my videos & the measuring system I set up that's how you have to do it..any other way is just guessing or a shot in the dark 3/16" is within spec..I would put the reinforcement plate back in if possible WHEN THE UNIBODY & RAILS ARE CORRECTLY LOCATED its one more brace to keep things in place.. The way I would go about your repair is as follows.

1---set car up on dolly or similar at 4 corners of the rocker pinch weld

2--Level front to back & side to side on dolly

3--Set measuring system

4--set rails as per frame dimension chart front & back

5--Install braces as I previously linked to

6--Make all repairs to inner & outer rockers

7--Do not remove any brace work till all structural repairs are complete
Yes thank you I did read it many times now.... maybe too many....LOL You can see the yellow stands in the pic, the lift arms are still just there when I took that pic. I have 4 stands and I am trying very hard to level it right. 3/16" may be good but I have a hard time with that, I am a perfectionist, precision welder/ machinist/ maintenance superviser. Well I do not do the maintenance part anymore. I think I have found the sag you told me about, still looking into it. I will keep you posted. keep the info comeing it does help!!
3/16" + or - is the factory tolerance taken right from the frame dimension chart...Do you have the chart ? I'm a perfectionist too ! Cool ! I got mine to within a 1/16" of inch over the entire length of the unibody (frame) front to back..But I replaced the rear frame rails..left front frame rail..It was really gratifying when i put the car on all 4's it sits absolutely level & perfect !

I posted pics herehttp://www.7173mustangs.com/thread-1970-engine-bay-measurements?page=5 of my setup..maybe it will help you..to see how i supported the entire passenger compartment on the rockers..Just so you know where the bottom of the rails are where you have the bar really means nothing other than the rail itself could be a touch larger smaller (manufacturing tolerances) Whats important is the susp mounting points, the rail heights at the locations laid out in the chart , square left to right at the susp mounting points & square front to back..

 
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Joined
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Messages
196
Reaction score
1
Location
Kunkletown PA
My Car
1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
I will not be able to work on the car tomorrow I have to take my son to the hosp to have a liver biopsy. I will redo my stands like yours.... well maybe a little higher for me, but I will and let you know and we can go from there. I am glad to here you are like me as it has to be right!! may be I can come see your work in person.... I have made a lot of things but this is my first car restore like this!!

thanks again

 
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Joined
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Messages
2,888
Reaction score
43
Location
U.S.A.
My Car
1972 Q code Mach 4spd
2004 350z
2005 Corvette
1971 Camaro SS/RS
I will not be able to work on the car tomorrow I have to take my son to the hosp to have a liver biopsy. I will redo my stands like yours.... well maybe a little higher for me, but I will and let you know and we can go from there. I am glad to here you are like me as it has to be right!! may be I can come see your work in person.... I have made a lot of things but this is my first car restore like this!!

thanks again
Sorry to hear your plans for tomorrow but best of luck ( Had a close friend have one of those a while back) Your more than welcome to stop up at the Saturday morning garage! as a matter of fact we had one of the board members come by a couple of weeks of ago (there's a post somewhere) again good luck tomorrow!

 
Joined
Mar 21, 2011
Messages
196
Reaction score
1
Location
Kunkletown PA
My Car
1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
I will not be able to work on the car tomorrow I have to take my son to the hosp to have a liver biopsy. I will redo my stands like yours.... well maybe a little higher for me, but I will and let you know and we can go from there. I am glad to here you are like me as it has to be right!! may be I can come see your work in person.... I have made a lot of things but this is my first car restore like this!!

thanks again
Sorry to hear your plans for tomorrow but best of luck ( Had a close friend have one of those a while back) Your more than welcome to stop up at the Saturday morning garage! as a matter of fact we had one of the board members come by a couple of weeks of ago (there's a post somewhere) again good luck tomorrow!
Thank you Very much!!!

 
Joined
Mar 21, 2011
Messages
196
Reaction score
1
Location
Kunkletown PA
My Car
1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
I will not be able to work on the car tomorrow I have to take my son to the hosp to have a liver biopsy. I will redo my stands like yours.... well maybe a little higher for me, but I will and let you know and we can go from there. I am glad to here you are like me as it has to be right!! may be I can come see your work in person.... I have made a lot of things but this is my first car restore like this!!

thanks again
Sorry to hear your plans for tomorrow but best of luck ( Had a close friend have one of those a while back) Your more than welcome to stop up at the Saturday morning garage! as a matter of fact we had one of the board members come by a couple of weeks of ago (there's a post somewhere) again good luck tomorrow!
Scott,

My son is doing ok, they ended up doing 3 biopsy, we will have to see why and what they say around Tuesday.

I started to make the stand like you said but I found out the LT side rear rocker is so rusted out above it ( the inner rocker support) that it would never hold the car. I will come up with something to get around that in the morning!

 
Joined
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Messages
196
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Location
Kunkletown PA
My Car
1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
Ok Scott,

I set the center of the front leaf spring bolt to 6.5" and the front frame just forward of the torque box before it goes up. Well keep in mind I think I am brain dead but it looks like the car is nose up, by about 1.5". front two back frame rails and top of rocker/bottom of the door.

It just does not look right. I have read all the posts from you about this many times and at this point I just need to stop and have some beers and post this and ask what am I doing wrong??? The pic shows the red laser level line on the rocker.

sorry for being so brain dead!!!

mustang lazer line 001.JPG

 
Joined
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My Car
1972 Q code Mach 4spd
2004 350z
2005 Corvette
1971 Camaro SS/RS
Ok Scott,

I set the center of the front leaf spring bolt to 6.5" and the front frame just forward of the torque box before it goes up. Well keep in mind I think I am brain dead but it looks like the car is nose up, by about 1.5". front two back frame rails and top of rocker/bottom of the door.

It just does not look right. I have read all the posts from you about this many times and at this point I just need to stop and have some beers and post this and ask what am I doing wrong??? The pic shows the red laser level line on the rocker.

sorry for being so brain dead!!!
::huh:::I'm lost ? Is the car passenger compartment itself leveled ? (level inside the rocker on where the scuff plate goes..remove scuff plate & then left to right at the rt rear door jamb to lt door jamb & lt hinge pillar to rt hinge pillar) If so what is the red laser representing ?

I think i got it...You do have the frame chart? Ok if using the laser your gonna have to hang / tape a piece of string at the leaf spring bolt center..set a target at 6.5" on the string leave some extra string to tie a nut to to keep the string plumb...then move to the frt location & do the same thing with your target set 6" set the laser a foot behind the car on a tripod and your laser line will be set WHEN THE LASER LINE hits both targets at the marks you made ...Do the same or measure down from the rail to the laser line to check the other points..ONCE 6.5 & 6 ESTABLISH THE LASER LINE IN RELATION TO THE LEVEL PASSENGER COMPARTMENT The only problem i see is that your gonna need 3 lasers to do this 1 set on each side then 1 set to intersect the lines at 90 degrees to check left to right you could just move the 3rd along the datum to check left to right

 
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Joined
Mar 21, 2011
Messages
196
Reaction score
1
Location
Kunkletown PA
My Car
1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
Ok Scott,

I set the center of the front leaf spring bolt to 6.5" and the front frame just forward of the torque box before it goes up. Well keep in mind I think I am brain dead but it looks like the car is nose up, by about 1.5". front two back frame rails and top of rocker/bottom of the door.

It just does not look right. I have read all the posts from you about this many times and at this point I just need to stop and have some beers and post this and ask what am I doing wrong??? The pic shows the red laser level line on the rocker.

sorry for being so brain dead!!!
::huh:::I'm lost ? Is the car passenger compartment itself leveled ? (level inside the rocker on where the scuff plate goes..remove scuff plate & then left to right at the rt rear door jamb to lt door jamb & lt hinge pillar to rt hinge pillar) If so what is the red laser representing ?

I think i got it...You do have the frame chart? Ok if using the laser your gonna have to hang / tape a piece of string at the leaf spring bolt center..set a target at 6.5" on the string leave some extra string to tie a nut to to keep the string plumb...then move to the frt location & do the same thing with your target set 6" set the laser a foot behind the car on a tripod and your laser line will be set WHEN THE LASER LINE hits both targets at the marks you made ...Do the same or measure down from the rail to the laser line to check the other points..ONCE 6.5 & 6 ESTABLISH THE LASER LINE IN RELATION TO THE LEVEL PASSENGER COMPARTMENT The only problem i see is that your gonna need 3 lasers to do this 1 set on each side then 1 set to intersect the lines at 90 degrees to check left to right you could just move the 3rd along the datum to check left to right
I did the string and it worked very well, after the string I put the stut bar you can see in the pic at that point. now I do know the leaf point but am I correct on the front point, just forward of the torque box on the frame before it slopes up??

 
Joined
Dec 24, 2010
Messages
2,888
Reaction score
43
Location
U.S.A.
My Car
1972 Q code Mach 4spd
2004 350z
2005 Corvette
1971 Camaro SS/RS
Ok Scott,

I set the center of the front leaf spring bolt to 6.5" and the front frame just forward of the torque box before it goes up. Well keep in mind I think I am brain dead but it looks like the car is nose up, by about 1.5". front two back frame rails and top of rocker/bottom of the door.

It just does not look right. I have read all the posts from you about this many times and at this point I just need to stop and have some beers and post this and ask what am I doing wrong??? The pic shows the red laser level line on the rocker.

sorry for being so brain dead!!!
::huh:::I'm lost ? Is the car passenger compartment itself leveled ? (level inside the rocker on where the scuff plate goes..remove scuff plate & then left to right at the rt rear door jamb to lt door jamb & lt hinge pillar to rt hinge pillar) If so what is the red laser representing ?

I think i got it...You do have the frame chart? Ok if using the laser your gonna have to hang / tape a piece of string at the leaf spring bolt center..set a target at 6.5" on the string leave some extra string to tie a nut to to keep the string plumb...then move to the frt location & do the same thing with your target set 6" set the laser a foot behind the car on a tripod and your laser line will be set WHEN THE LASER LINE hits both targets at the marks you made ...Do the same or measure down from the rail to the laser line to check the other points..ONCE 6.5 & 6 ESTABLISH THE LASER LINE IN RELATION TO THE LEVEL PASSENGER COMPARTMENT The only problem i see is that your gonna need 3 lasers to do this 1 set on each side then 1 set to intersect the lines at 90 degrees to check left to right you could just move the 3rd along the datum to check left to right
I did the string and it worked very well, after the string I put the stut bar you can see in the pic at that point. now I do know the leaf point but am I correct on the front point, just forward of the torque box on the frame before it slopes up??
Correct a touch before the bend or slope up target should be located 6" down from the bottom of the frame rail..your gonna need a bar or laser THE WHOLE LENGTH OF THE CAR...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Joined
Mar 21, 2011
Messages
196
Reaction score
1
Location
Kunkletown PA
My Car
1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
::huh:::I'm lost ? Is the car passenger compartment itself leveled ? (level inside the rocker on where the scuff plate goes..remove scuff plate & then left to right at the rt rear door jamb to lt door jamb & lt hinge pillar to rt hinge pillar) If so what is the red laser representing ?

I think i got it...You do have the frame chart? Ok if using the laser your gonna have to hang / tape a piece of string at the leaf spring bolt center..set a target at 6.5" on the string leave some extra string to tie a nut to to keep the string plumb...then move to the frt location & do the same thing with your target set 6" set the laser a foot behind the car on a tripod and your laser line will be set WHEN THE LASER LINE hits both targets at the marks you made ...Do the same or measure down from the rail to the laser line to check the other points..ONCE 6.5 & 6 ESTABLISH THE LASER LINE IN RELATION TO THE LEVEL PASSENGER COMPARTMENT The only problem i see is that your gonna need 3 lasers to do this 1 set on each side then 1 set to intersect the lines at 90 degrees to check left to right you could just move the 3rd along the datum to check left to right
I did the string and it worked very well, after the string I put the stut bar you can see in the pic at that point. now I do know the leaf point but am I correct on the front point, just forward of the torque box on the frame before it slopes up??
Correct a touch before the bend or slope up target should be located 6" down from the bottom of the frame rail..your gonna need a bar or laser THE WHOLE LENGTH OF THE CAR...
yep that is what I have right now, like I said and showed in the pic it just does not look right to me. would love to talk to you on the phone about it!!

 
Joined
Dec 24, 2010
Messages
2,888
Reaction score
43
Location
U.S.A.
My Car
1972 Q code Mach 4spd
2004 350z
2005 Corvette
1971 Camaro SS/RS
I did the string and it worked very well, after the string I put the stut bar you can see in the pic at that point. now I do know the leaf point but am I correct on the front point, just forward of the torque box on the frame before it slopes up??
Correct a touch before the bend or slope up target should be located 6" down from the bottom of the frame rail..your gonna need a bar or laser THE WHOLE LENGTH OF THE CAR...
yep that is what I have right now, like I said and showed in the pic it just does not look right to me. would love to talk to you on the phone about it!!
Pm me i should be around in the afternoon tomorrow

 
Joined
Mar 21, 2011
Messages
196
Reaction score
1
Location
Kunkletown PA
My Car
1972 Mustang convertible. 351C 4V
1968 Ford F-100 300 str6 3 sp
1999 Ford Contour sport V6 5sp
2000 Ford F350 4X4 7.3 turbo diesel dually
2000 Ford F150 4X4 5.7L
Correct a touch before the bend or slope up target should be located 6" down from the bottom of the frame rail..your gonna need a bar or laser THE WHOLE LENGTH OF THE CAR...
yep that is what I have right now, like I said and showed in the pic it just does not look right to me. would love to talk to you on the phone about it!!
Pm me i should be around in the afternoon tomorrow
I will, thanks!

 
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